Deck gives way...a reminder to all landlords..

[lura]

Following on from a case recently decided in Qld - this should be a very scary proposition to the owner of this property if it is an investment.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/balcony-collapse-8000-more-say-experts-20100613-y68z.html

 

[WinstonWolfe]

40 people weigh around 3 tonnes, the same as 2 medium sized cars.

Add a bit of dance music with everyone bouncing in unison, and I am surprised there's not more of this.

 

[depreciator]

I'm surprised that archicentre said only 2% of decks were unsafe.

 

[willair]

Following on from a case recently decided in Qld - this should be a very scary proposition to the owner of this property if it is an investment.

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/balcony-collapse-8000-more-say-experts-20100613-y68z.html

I wonder how the insurance company will be looking at this,"who" will pay the various medical-demo-removal-new plans materials,permit councils costs,plus all the people that will line up prior to walking into any courtroom for the longterm problems they have or have yet to find out they have,every 4 th house in the inner bris southside has a deck in one form or another some quite large in sqm's spans,if they are set in hardwood,double braced,with rsj's set in place then 30 people should be no problem,but from a lot that i have seen that are not passed,not braced into the main building,undersize timber in the underfloor set-up,and from what i'm told the BCC is right onto that,once you take the house-foot-print out from the original plan,then it will show up,and if it was not passed from the start then i'm sure the people that work for insurance companies would be asking that first of all..willair..

 

[convert2online]

that's a scary thought. it seems it can just happen no matter how many people are standing on it. Then again with any similar structure 40 people stomping on it's not going to help matters

 

[Dazz]

this should be a very scary proposition to the owner of this property if it is an investment.

Why do you say that lura ??


If the balcony was designed for a maximum static load amount equivalent to say 15 or 20 people, then the Owner should be fine and dandy. I imagine most of these things have a safety factor of at least 2, such that it could handle the equivalent load amount of say 40 people in a static load condition.


To cover his backside further, it could easily be written in the Lease that the balcony is designed for a certain static loading, and the Tenant is to observe that loading and not create any condition whereby that loading imposed would exceed the recommended design maximum. Too easy. We do that stuff all the time.


If the Tenant named on the Lease and in charge of the party then chose and allowed his guests to cram in 40 and then start imposing dynamic loading conditions applied in unison, then I would contend that the Owner has nothing to worry about at all. I would contend that the Tenant is up **** creek without a paddle.

Partygoer Bonnie Sleeman, 15, was surprised no one was more seriously injured.

"I reckon there were about 40 people on the balcony, it was packed," Ms Sleeman told News Ltd.

 

[marg4000]

The two decks that collapsed in Queensland had structural issues that developed over a number of years.

It has been recommended that ALL decks be checked for structural soundness.
Marg

 

[craigb]

a builders perspective, There are a few ways a deck/balcony can break .
The most common of these it the ledger beam comes loose , most ledger beams are DYNA bolted to a brick wall, these bolts come loose over time unless fitted with kem grip, its a two pack adheisive thats injected in the hole and sets after the dyna bolt is tightened .

In this case as i glimpsed at the picture on the news ( two seconds) it looks like the ledger beam was hex bolted to timber , and the ledger split down the center, the deck was constructed with joist hangers and the weight split the beam.

the other balcony failures are from concrete balconys , these are constructed using steel and concrete, they mainly fail due to the steel being placed in the bottom half of the concrete slab, the slab cracks and the steel folds.
When the steel is placed in the top 25mm of the slab then if the concrete cracks the steel acts as steel cables and stops the balcony folding,

NOTE : be aware of older seaside type constructions , as the salt air can corrode through the steel when placed through the top half of a slab.

if in doubt use more posts, any Q's just pm me , cheers craig.

 

[Peterw]

Craigb. In my mind, the ledger beam construction, places pretty much all the weight on the dyna bolts etc. I would have thought, that may have required an engineer to do the design, to ensure the beam size, the spacings and size of the dyna bolts, as well as the wall that they are going into, are capable of taking the weight. Not sure how an inspection after construction is going to help identify, firstly what the design load is, and or how well the dyna bolts are holding. In my mind, good old fashioned stumps may give a bit more piece of mind. No doubt this will not be the last deck failure, and it will be interesting what sort of regulation, our governments will then come out with.

 

[Propertunity]

.....- this should be a very scary proposition to the owner of this property if it is an investment.

If this is an IP, I would have thought it would be a scarier proposition for the PM who the LL hired to "manage" the property and advise of any issues that need dealing with.

 

[lura]

If this is an IP, I would have thought it would be a scarier proposition for the PM who the LL hired to "manage" the property and advise of any issues that need dealing with.

True, if the PM didn't done their job properly - however, this may not be the case...(can't recall the case date or name) but the property manager was found not at fault because a balcony railing came loose and tenants hurt because the judge ruled that the property manager was not a qualified building inspector and can only judge the condition as a property manager. In that particular case, the pm made notes that the balcony looked ok and the judge accepted that. Tenant wasn't aware of problem either and so didn't notify the agent....costs fell onto the landlord and their PL insurance.

 

[marg4000]

I think it is a bit much to expect PMs to be building experts and know when structures are unsafe, unless it is blindingly obvious.
Marg

 

[lura]

In a recent Qld case in the district courts: Spackman v Stevens and James (2010) QDC 118 - the duty of care owed to the tenant of a rental property was analysed. This particular case was a bout a carpenter who did work on a deck - suffice to say the agent and landlord were not in the wrong as they acted as they should in getting the contractor to carryout the works. The tenant is injured and sues the agent, landlord and contractor...contractors insurance will now pay out the tenant.