Gorgon getting closer....

but the casino's not empty!!

you're arguing that they're betting and that's the problem, i'm arguing they're betting and no matter what, money is flowing.

Yes I agree that Australia in any case has got nothing to lose, also because most of those investments and risks is coming from overseas.
But on the other hand once those project are finish the jobs are finished too and royalty to government would be related to spot gas prices
 
Love those contracts...

Doesn't seems that hard to work out the value of the new deal, the problem is that all those deals will be eventually valued at prices when gas is supplied. Unless you hedge future prices, but, of course, none is going to hedge all the gas prices now for so many years ahead, all those values are worth not much more then a gamble at the casino...

Boz we've been down this track before in this very thread. Volume and price certainty is required in a "base" gas offtake contract/s of this nature to get projects of this magnitude over the line. That is the very reason why gas prices for the domestic retail market have stayed so low in WA - they were drawn up and underwritten when the original NW Shelf JV and the DBNGP was built. Above the base minimum the developer (eg Chevron et al) takes spot price risk to give themselves some upside exposure in the future. Note none of this applies to east coast CSM gas projects as their cost to develop is much lower.

Same reason why the Japanese are still only paying less than $2/GJ for natural gas from the NW Shelf project that was built 20 years ago. They set the price and volume back then - a bet they made that is now significantly "in the money"! This of course has a flow on effect on our royalty incomes but that's life... it was the best deal Woodside et al could do at the time.

Same reason (but operating in reverse) why Ric Stowe is as wealthy as he is. When Griffin built their coal mine in Collie thirty plus years ago it was on the back of a coal offtake contract with then SECWA that escalated at a nice little ratchet. Pity the spot price of coal didn't keep up with said ratchet so you can imagine who got reamed there - and it wasn't Griffin!

But then they came out of that contract just recently and are now having a little difficulty offloading their coal...
 
Hey forumites,
I enjoyed the too-ing and fro-ing of this thread but its been quiet for ages now, whats happening up there.

How is all this development affecting things on the ground in Karratha ATM ?

What is the 5 year outlook with property prices, development etc.

For one of the most interesting property stories going on in Australia, it gets very little airtime on this forum.

Is there just no interest in this place from a PI point of view anymore?

Do tell...!!

Pango
 
I keep monitoring gas prices and in the main market in US are at lowest have been in months (this morning NATURAL GAS FUTR april delivery at 4.28 USD/MMBtu). Gas producer are not doing well in US as consequence and many players are shifting investment more towards oil as there is talk of gas glut for the next couple of years
 
Boz there isn't one world market price for natural gas, for one main reason - it is very costly to transport (ie turn into condensed liquid), so in effect you have a whole number of disconnected markets with different prices.... North America is a large market and their gas prices have collapsed because of supply from unconventional fieds (and recession).

In Aus, gas wholesale is sold at different prices between WA and East coast. WA used to be much cheaper < $3 now its closer to $6 because there are limited suppliers and it all goes to export, east coast is still ~ $3-4 but will probably increase after LNG projects start.

Spare a thought for the gas importing countries who have no gas - they buy these shipments, regassify and sell into market at $10++. All the Aus LNG will be going into the Asian marketplace. Most contracts for this market are written relative to oil prices (not US Nymex gas market)

nice summary here. am sure you dont spend 20,50, 100 billion and wake up and say oh dear the spot price has dropped??
 
what are the views on the govt making ADRs for cars to have compulsory gas driven motors? seems nuts burning all this foreign oil

i've always thought govt/emergency/police vehicles should be running gas - currently it's like Brazil exporting ethanol and running their transport on crude based diesel.....
 
what are the views on the govt making ADRs for cars to have compulsory gas driven motors? seems nuts burning all this foreign oil

Hi Ausprop

We export gas and import oil. Broadly speaking the price of gas is linked to the price of oil, so what is the problem?

If we import a bit more oil and export a bit less gas, we will still be in the same net position. What have we gained other than a nice warm and fuzzy false "energy security" story for the population?

In fact, the domestic gas reservation policy in WA is some of the worst energy policy we have seen for awhile. I don't know of any part of the energy industry that supports it. It artificially reduces the price of gas (and hence electricity), which will make the eventual reversion to international prices ever more painful when it comes. Low gas prices will inhibit other technologies competing so when we have a problem with gas production there is nothing else! Been down that road before if I remember rightly... it's just bad populist policy.

Let the market work out where the value is - and that means oil for cars and gas for export at the moment. With gas prices where they are internationally selling it domestically instead at half price makes no sense for either the gas producer or the domestic competition to gas. There's nothing wrong with the market outcome...
 
yep fair point I think?

just thinking on a micro scale, do I care that woodside sells me gas under market? the alternative would be they sell at market and i buy from BP at market, end result is I would pay more.
 
yep fair point I think?

just thinking on a micro scale, do I care that woodside sells me gas under market? the alternative would be they sell at market and i buy from BP at market, end result is I would pay more.

Absolutely, that makes such a policy very popular... hence "populist"

That benefit just comes at the expense of everyone in the industry, including the govt through reduced royalties. You can't keep doing it forever for that reason...

It does nothing for the development of alternative sources of energy, energy security, attracting investors, industry capability and development, R&D, etc etc etc

Low energy prices just means investors look to other industries for something to do with their capital, right at a time when we should be investing in new energy sources and technologies.
 
I keep monitoring gas prices and in the main market in US are at lowest have been in months (this morning NATURAL GAS FUTR april delivery at 4.28 USD/MMBtu). Gas producer are not doing well in US as consequence and many players are shifting investment more towards oil as there is talk of gas glut for the next couple of years

Gas prices keep heading south and in US it is as cheap as coal link
Here is also a chart on the oil/gas ratio
ratiooiltogassincejan2008.png
today's ratio is 21, may be it is a good investment to make big gas storage places for use in the future...
 
An interesting update for GAS from bloomberg

...
Multiyear Contracts

U.K. natural gas for delivery tomorrow dropped 11 percent this year in London to 31.5 pence a therm ($4.85 a million British thermal units), or about $26.25 a barrel of oil equivalent. North Sea Brent crude is worth about $86 a barrel.

Most of the gas consumed in Europe is bought under multi- year contracts that are linked to the price of oil, a formula that exporters such as Algeria, Qatar and Russia say guarantees long-term investment.

Supply originally intended for delivery to the U.S. is coming to Europe, where it’s being sold on spot markets, grabbing market share from long term contracts, said Morten Frisch, a senior partner at U.K.-based Morten Frisch Consulting Ltd. Spot trading activity across Europe is rising.
...
Qatar, the world’s biggest LNG producer, doesn’t plan to reduce gas output, Minister of State for Energy Mohammed al-Sada said last month.

The Qataris want to produce the most gas possible to maximize output of natural-gas liquids, said Caruso, formerly administrator at the U.S. Energy Information Administration. It’ll be difficult for exporters to agree on supply quotas because much of the investment has already been made, he said.

In the U.S., gas has fallen 28 percent this year, the second-worst performer after sugar in the S&P GSCI Index of 24 commodities, as gas produced from shale rock bolstered supply.

Shale Gas

If shale production can be replicated in Europe and Asia, it will threaten the two main markets for gas exports, Caruso said. GECF is “certainly concerned about the success of shale gas technology in North America,” he said.

Unlike OPEC, founded in 1960, the GECF hasn’t set any price targets or production quotas since its foundation in Tehran in 2001.
...
may be gas prices are not just a short term problem, i think there is just too much of it
 
Update: This is the big year for Gorgon construction. ll the big companies are now sourcing their workforce.

The other Job ramping up is Ichthys LNG job in Darwin. Anyone looking to break into the game this could be your opportunity
 
Update: This is the big year for Gorgon construction. ll the big companies are now sourcing their workforce.

The other Job ramping up is Ichthys LNG job in Darwin. Anyone looking to break into the game this could be your opportunity

dont think so mate - gorgon has been going for ages, if anything, there are less jobs going now than there were before
 
Really i dont no why this got sent to me then. - Thank you for registering your interest in a career with the CB&I Kentz Joint Venture.

The Chevron-operated Gorgon Project is Australia's largest single resource development and the CB&I Kentz Joint Venture (CKJV) has been awarded a contract by Chevron Australia to carry out the Mechanical, Electrical and Instrumentation work. We are beginning to recruit skilled people who want to make this opportunity of a lifetime, a reality.

Between now and December, we will be hiring 500 employees based mainly at the Henderson Australian Marine Complex (AMC) operation.

However, once 2013 hits we will require an extra 2,000 workers to ramp up the operations, with the majority working fly-in, fly-out (FIFO) at Barrow Island.
Don't miss your opportunity to be part of the iconic Gorgon Project.
Apply by clicking below or you could find yourself disappointed, big time. Also go to seek and type in leightons they are also looking for alot of different people.
 
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