HELP: Advice and opinions URGENTLY needed.
- Thread starter josko
- Start date
Best wishes Jo.
We have had our PPOR on the market for 2-3 weeks and have had 5 lots of cashed up people through already. It is a great ocean view property. There are people out there with plenty of money who are still buying despite the gloomy climate. Cashed up buyers who are purchasing on emotion don't give a stuff about sub prime. They just want their dream home. I hope one or two of them want yours - but this is mainly in the hands of the gods. Taking action is the main thing and you are not short of that quality from what I can glean of your character.
With Metta, Ian
We have had our PPOR on the market for 2-3 weeks and have had 5 lots of cashed up people through already. It is a great ocean view property. There are people out there with plenty of money who are still buying despite the gloomy climate. Cashed up buyers who are purchasing on emotion don't give a stuff about sub prime. They just want their dream home. I hope one or two of them want yours - but this is mainly in the hands of the gods. Taking action is the main thing and you are not short of that quality from what I can glean of your character.
With Metta, Ian
The reason you do this is so you have more disposable income to put towards your next IP, rather than having it tied up in an IP reducing interest that is tax deductible anyway.
It's all about opportunity-cost.
At least, that's how I understand it
The reason you do this is so you have more disposable income to put towards your next IP, rather than having it tied up in an IP reducing interest that is tax deductible anyway.
It's all about opportunity-cost.
At least, that's how I understand it
And most have non tax deductible debt which could be paid down instead and would have a greater impact on cash flow..
Hi Josko; Your investors brain is in control. Your decision to put two IP's and your PPR up for sale means almost certainly you will sell something probably one IP and your home. (Murphy's Law
) You do not pay capital gains tax on your PPR so you are further ahead than selling the IP's alone.You should also think about setting up a D.I.Y. Super Fund so in future acquistions, not all your properties are exposed to the vagaries of your creditors both business and banking.
The lessons we have learned this time is that we need to have a years buffer on each property. If you grow too quick you can fail because of not enough liquidity particularly when you reach 5-7 properties.
Your husband and you must have worked very hard to acquire what you have and there will be those who would view you as well off and therefore a target. The reality with property is your asset rich and cash poor its the nature of the beast.
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Don't close your options off about Commercial Property. We cut out teeth with our first two IP's being the commercial buildings our businesses operated out of. We have a relative who is a surveyor who after talking with us a year ago purchased a large commercial building and his business acts as the key tenant and he then sublet the remaining space and his yield is up around 10% per annum. His rent is tax deductable and it covers the interest of the mortgage. The sub tenants are paying off principle
As for the selling agent tell him nothing about your financials. Let him do most of the talking. He will try and pick your brains and his job is to work your price down and the buyers up. At the moment it is a buyers market so most of the heat will be on you. I would not sell your PPR through the same agent as your IP's
I am not an advisor so you can view this as dross if you like. Have a surf of our earlier posts particularly with regards to super. The wife and I play good cop bad cop with the agents. We are ruthless because agents bottom line is any sale will do. If you'd like more of a chat pm me.
Good luck
nonrecourse
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As some of you know, I have recently had a baby and when he was only 6 weeks old, went back to work 2 days/week, travelling over an hour each way, to try and meet the shortfall on our IP mortgages. I also have a part-time job I fit in on weekends and a couple of hour in the week.
Now hubby is flaberghasted that I would consider selling the family home rather than our IP's but I see it as bad debt, alot of it, and I simply cannot bring myself to put our latest addition to the family into daycare to work Full-time. I would probably work close to 25 hours a week as it is. Needless to say there is a bit of tension at home right now.
More than anything else, I am sad to see that you have (obviously unintentionally!) found yourself in a situation where money has been placed before your family, particularly your young child who is 100% dependent on your emotional availability to him. Can you be the best possible parent when you are under so much emotional and financial stress?
You say that you have other IPs and a best-street house. I find it alarming that people will try to have it all at the expense of their children. Is this 'keeping up with the Joneses'? Why have the best material posessions if you and your family are suffering emotionally with financial burden. It doesn't make sense.
If you want an honest answer, this is it. Be humble and sell your dream home. Buy something that you can afford and keep going with your IPs so that you can achieve another dream home outright without sacrificing the emotional security of your children (i.e., if you are stressed to the max, your parenting skills will be substantially reduced).
Hope this helps...a child and family-focused view.
Now hubby is flaberghasted that I would consider selling the family home rather than our IP's but I see it as bad debt, alot of it, and I simply cannot bring myself to put our latest addition to the family into daycare to work Full-time. I would probably work close to 25 hours a week as it is. Needless to say there is a bit of tension at home right now.
More than anything else, I am sad to see that you have (obviously unintentionally!) found yourself in a situation where money has been placed before your family, particularly your young child who is 100% dependent on your emotional availability to him. Can you be the best possible parent when you are under so much emotional and financial stress?
You say that you have other IPs and a best-street house. I find it alarming that people will try to have it all at the expense of their children. Is this 'keeping up with the Joneses'? Why have the best material posessions if you and your family are suffering emotionally with financial burden. It doesn't make sense.
If you want an honest answer, this is it. Be humble and sell your dream home. Buy something that you can afford and keep going with your IPs so that you can achieve another dream home outright without sacrificing the emotional security of your children (i.e., if you are stressed to the max, your parenting skills will be substantially reduced).
Hope this helps...a child and family-focused view.
As some of you know, I have recently had a baby and when he was only 6 weeks old, went back to work 2 days/week, travelling over an hour each way, to try and meet the shortfall on our IP mortgages. I also have a part-time job I fit in on weekends and a couple of hour in the week.
Now hubby is flaberghasted that I would consider selling the family home rather than our IP's but I see it as bad debt, alot of it, and I simply cannot bring myself to put our latest addition to the family into daycare to work Full-time. I would probably work close to 25 hours a week as it is. Needless to say there is a bit of tension at home right now.
More than anything else, I am sad to see that you have (obviously unintentionally!) found yourself in a situation where money has been placed before your family, particularly your young child who is 100% dependent on your emotional availability to him. Can you be the best possible parent when you are under so much emotional and financial stress?
You say that you have other IPs and a best-street house. I find it alarming that people will try to have it all at the expense of their children. Is this 'keeping up with the Joneses'? Why have the best material posessions if you and your family are suffering emotionally with financial burden. It doesn't make sense.
If you want an honest answer, this is it. Be humble and sell your dream home. Buy something that you can afford and keep going with your IPs so that you can achieve another dream home outright without sacrificing the emotional security of your children (i.e., if you are stressed to the max, your parenting skills will be substantially reduced).
Hope this helps...a child and family-focused view.
Hi Miss Honey,
If you read Joskos post in it's entirety you will understand that she is concerned about her family and their general and financial future.
No where does she indicate or give the impression that she places money before her children or that she is emotionally unable to parent well. Quite the opposite imo.
She is under stress at this time and is seeking to improve that by coming here for some constructive advise before making some hard decisions.
Sometimes life throws you challenges and you just have to deal with them... that's life. This is where Josko is now. She is wanting to do what she considers to be in the best interest of the family and she appears to me to be taking everything into consideration.
People want to improve their financial position for various reasons. You'll find on SS its probably less so to keep up with the Jones' than the general non PI population.
To many a valuable PPOR is more an asset than status and the foundation to their investment journey which at the end of the day is their business and if successful will eventually will allow them more stress free time with their family.
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My PPOR payments are $6500/month! My total rental return/month would be $3040/month. I already receive 840/month from the flat attached.
weg:
Thanks weg.
nonrecourse:
This is exactly what we do! Sure your relative isn't my husband???
We have been madly painting, gardening and cleaning all weekend and the agent I had booket today rang me sick! In any case, I have a few more coming over the next couple of days.
Rockstar, I hope you are right!
PS: I have a second inspection on Beenleigh.
Regards JO
Only one IP is P&I and I couldn't have it changed as it was a Full DOc. The bank wanted to treat it as a new product, asking for full financials. That's a no go for me now.
Regards JO
Ok you've sure blown all my assumed numbers out f the water.
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Ok you've sure blown all my assumed numbers out f the water.
Hi GoAnna,
I have not tried that path yet, and assumed I would be unable to due to the fixed loan.
I will give it a go though once I have it on the market.
By the way, I am still trying to think of other ways to ease the load....and will never give up until the hammer drops! I also sent you a private email.
Thanks GoAnna
Regards JO
Just to let anyone who's interested know,
I just had one lot of agents through and my asking price was pretty on the mark. I was having nightmares of 200k drops!
I think auction is the way to go......
Pretty sad though, three of them stood on the deck and raved about the view and the potential the house has.
Regards JO
I just had one lot of agents through and my asking price was pretty on the mark. I was having nightmares of 200k drops!
I think auction is the way to go......
Pretty sad though, three of them stood on the deck and raved about the view and the potential the house has.
Regards JO
Josko, I met a woman last year whose husband was transferred up to Singapore shortly after they planned and built their dream home on a personally selected block of land in Brookfield, an up market rural western suburb of Brissy. But hubby's job came first. It was high paying and they expected to be away for 3-5 years. So they sold it.
As things turned out, hubby work ended 18mths later. back they came to Brissy. They approached the owner of their old house about buying it, but they were reticent. So they bought another house close by. She couldn't get comfortable in that house, and pined for the old one. Her husband seriously loved this girl (very attractive btw), and he eventually agreed to pay whatever the owners wanted.
They are in that house now and happy. It cost them over $400k to go through all that.....but they don't regret anything.
I raise this because at some time in the future, when there's less risk on the horizon, you may find yourself back in that house.
Have more faith in the universe that life has a better option than that house for the time being. Open yourself to that option. Clinging to your ppr might be holding you back from greater happiness and growth.
As things turned out, hubby work ended 18mths later. back they came to Brissy. They approached the owner of their old house about buying it, but they were reticent. So they bought another house close by. She couldn't get comfortable in that house, and pined for the old one. Her husband seriously loved this girl (very attractive btw), and he eventually agreed to pay whatever the owners wanted.
They are in that house now and happy. It cost them over $400k to go through all that.....but they don't regret anything.
I raise this because at some time in the future, when there's less risk on the horizon, you may find yourself back in that house.
Have more faith in the universe that life has a better option than that house for the time being. Open yourself to that option. Clinging to your ppr might be holding you back from greater happiness and growth.
Hi Josko,
I've been following this thread with interest. Thank you for having the courage to share bad news. I am positive that if you continue to have a balanced mindset you will get through this.
Please take some comfort in knowing that some of us who are new to this journey will learn a valuable lesson from you about not over stretching ourselves, as we move into a somewhat more difficult investing climate.
My humble opinion has always been that a home, is where family is. Wherever that may be. Whenever I am away from home, it is family that I want to get back to, not my house or the material possessions that it contains.
Before his death J.P.Getty, one of the worlds richest men, said he would have given away all his riches just to have better health. If you have your health, then you are far richer than he. Some of the happiest people I know of, are aged pensioners who do not own their own homes, shares, i.p's or any other investments and likely never will. They simply are content with their needs being met, not their wants. They have learned to define the difference. Something we could all benefit from to some extent.
You will get to the crest of the hill you're climbing soon, and then you can coast downhill for a while, and new opportunities will present.
My hopes for you now, are for lots of sleep, a lot more quality family time and plenty of hugs from your kids. I wish you well.
Jodie
I've been following this thread with interest. Thank you for having the courage to share bad news. I am positive that if you continue to have a balanced mindset you will get through this.
Please take some comfort in knowing that some of us who are new to this journey will learn a valuable lesson from you about not over stretching ourselves, as we move into a somewhat more difficult investing climate.
My humble opinion has always been that a home, is where family is. Wherever that may be. Whenever I am away from home, it is family that I want to get back to, not my house or the material possessions that it contains.
Before his death J.P.Getty, one of the worlds richest men, said he would have given away all his riches just to have better health. If you have your health, then you are far richer than he. Some of the happiest people I know of, are aged pensioners who do not own their own homes, shares, i.p's or any other investments and likely never will. They simply are content with their needs being met, not their wants. They have learned to define the difference. Something we could all benefit from to some extent.
You will get to the crest of the hill you're climbing soon, and then you can coast downhill for a while, and new opportunities will present.
My hopes for you now, are for lots of sleep, a lot more quality family time and plenty of hugs from your kids. I wish you well.
Jodie
Josko,
I am very sorry to hear about your precarious position.
At a cashflow bleed of 12k per month...this is serious!
Personally, you may have to implement more strategies than one but some of them are:
1. With a 144k CF bleed, I am presuming that you have a tax variation form with the ATO to ease CF. (short term measure)
2. I would look at selling at some IPS at a loss and offset against one property with a large capital gains. This way the net tax paid is neglible. (Medium term)
3. It looks like your PPOR will have to go! (Medium term)
Use this as a learning opportunity! Do something quickly because your CF bleed is huge! Having said that....you have time over the next few years to build again....(Longer term)
Good luck!
Cheers
Sash
I am very sorry to hear about your precarious position.
At a cashflow bleed of 12k per month...this is serious!
Personally, you may have to implement more strategies than one but some of them are:
1. With a 144k CF bleed, I am presuming that you have a tax variation form with the ATO to ease CF. (short term measure)
2. I would look at selling at some IPS at a loss and offset against one property with a large capital gains. This way the net tax paid is neglible. (Medium term)
3. It looks like your PPOR will have to go! (Medium term)
Use this as a learning opportunity! Do something quickly because your CF bleed is huge! Having said that....you have time over the next few years to build again....(Longer term)
Good luck!
Cheers
Sash
Hi there,
My Non-tax deductable debt is @ $500k.
I have 7 IP's - My shortfall for all loans is nearly $12k/month!
To cut the details down, to sell in this market is absolutely ludicrous as we all know.
One property I have on the market has about 70k in it, but the killer Mobius at 12.5% property that I really want to sell, will see me pay an extra 15k to settle it!
If I sold these two properties I could keep the PPOR. They are just not selling.
Other properties are 80% LVR. (Except Commercial at 70%)- Which by the way is Neutrally geared. Has alot of equity but I would rather sell the PPOR than this one.
Again, I can tell you market values, but nothing market value is selling. To sell a property in this market is to take a CG loss and lose alot of money.
With my PPOR - I can afford a 75k loss and be happy with the gain I have made.
A .5% drop in interest rates is not enough, and 5 of the properties are with non-banks. Who knows if they will drop their rates and when. Re-financing comes with exit fees on most and lower vals at the moment. My PPOR is the only property with enough equity to make it worth the sale., but not enough to pay a break fee in fixed rates and refinance to be in this situation again in 6 months.
Regards JO
A bit of perspective from a remote village in Nepal (where virtually everyone is alway smiling).
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Thanks KeithJ that's spot on. Always room for perspective.
