Is Australia facing the first recession in 20 years?

What economic outlook does Australia face over the next 12 months?

  • TEOTWAWKI (google it)

    Votes: 4 2.1%
  • Depression

    Votes: 7 3.7%
  • Recession

    Votes: 42 22.5%
  • Slight Downturn

    Votes: 64 34.2%
  • Steady As She Goes

    Votes: 54 28.9%
  • Continue To Boom

    Votes: 16 8.6%

  • Total voters
    187
That 2008-9 period I bought the whole doom and gloom thing and was scared whitless when I think back.
I worked on a short term contract for a bank at the time and they were just stopping mid project, pretty much everything. It was an incredible time.
All contractors (bar me - lucky because of the project) were put off.

It was a frightening time really..
 
Well to be honest I don't remember my 15-20% call being that early... (September 2008). Can you provide a link to where I said it?

You can start quibbling now about whether your prediction was Sept. 08 or mid 09 the pertinent fact is that you stated in August 2011 that,

"I stand by that prediction so I guess we'll see."

Either of these dates are before the latest peak and according to the ABS House Price Index Chart that I am using compliments of Steve Keens Debtwatch(http://www.debtdeflation.com/blogs/2012/05/01/australian-house-prices-down-10-from-peak/) the index was at approx. 125 for both dates.

At no time did you state that you were wrong and this prediction no longer applied and that you were now using the 2010 peak.
 
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Is that all you are here to do turk? Squabble over whether I got a prediction wrong or right? Would it help you move on if I admitted that I got the 2008 prediction wrong (one that you can't even find) and my expectation is a 15-20% fall from the peak? :rolleyes:
 
At no time did you state that you were wrong and this prediction no longer applied and that you were now using the 2010 peak.

in theory then, wouldn't hobo's predictions require MORE fall, not LESS thereby effectively increasing his position in his overall predictions, thereby going against what he's been saying all along?

sorry - you seem to be tying yourself in knots trying to suggest that hobo has altered his predictions when you both;

a) cannot find what you state he said, and
b) your suggestions imply he would be increasing his initial position, to which he has said over and over he has not.

you may be a bull and he may be a bear, but if everyone is going to go around misquoting each other we all may as well go join a health union and be done with it.
 
you may be a bull and he may be a bear, but if everyone is going to go around misquoting each other we all may as well go join a health union and be done with it.

LOL but so true. What someone said 2 years back does not impact on now because it not a game who was most right. If I could predict the future I will put in Saturdays Lottos numbers now and sell every IP i own on Monday.

What we want is open debate so collectedly we can make our own assessments on risk, v return, buy v sell, etc...

Not a peeeing contest, Peter 14.7
 
Turk - Poor form mate, pulling a Steve keen article from May (already proved incorrect), where he compares in simple line graph terms the house prices from three separate nations, almost 20 years apart, without any context or comparison give as to reasoning.

God I wish that article didn't get any more link juice, so I could die the death it deserved.
 
Turk - Poor form mate, pulling a Steve keen article from May (already proved incorrect), where he compares in simple line graph terms the house prices from three separate nations, almost 20 years apart, without any context or comparison give as to reasoning.

God I wish that article didn't get any more link juice, so I could die the death it deserved.

Hi jacbmw

Probably would be poor form to use the chart you refer to, but I specified which chart I was referring to which was the

ABS House Price Index Chart

I have no problem with using an Australian Bureau of Statistics chart.
 
From here:

http://finance.ninemsn.com.au/newsbusiness/aap/8541075/retail-call-for-interest-rate-cut

It's particularly concerned following the release of the Australian Industry Group's latest manufacturing performance index, which showed new orders going down for the seventh straight month to 44.3 points.

CFMEU secretary Michael O'Connor says there's now a compelling case for a significant rate reduction and has urged the RBA to act decisively.

"For too many months now they have sat on their hands whilst jobs were lost and industries suffered," he said in a statement.

"Construction and manufacturing are in a parlous state ... they're telling us they need a rate cut."

He believes a cut should be in the order of 50 basis points.

Retailers are also pressing for a cut, arguing the sector is desperate for a change in consumer spending.

"The economic ducks have lined up for a drop in interest rates," Australian Retailers Association (ARA) director Russell Zimmerman said.

Retailers have had negative growth across all categories over the past two months, despite a relatively stable Australian dollar and only modest rises in inflation, proving it will take more to convince people to buy.
Enjoy....:eek:
 
A recession on the back of the mining/commodities bust is taking longer than I anticipated to play out (when I started the recession thread 18 months ago), but still looks like we are heading that way:

The slowdown in China has deflated prices for Australia's key resource exports while forcing miners to scale back on their most ambitious expansion plans. When the country reported its widest trade deficit in three years for August, it seemed just a taste of what was to come.

"It's like we're watching a slow motion train wreck," said Su-Lin Ong, a senior economist at RBC Capital Markets.

"The decline in export earnings will take toll on wealth, incomes and consumption right across the economy," she explained. "And it's happening when fiscal policy is being tightened and the Australian dollar is restrictively high."

As a result, she expected the economy's strength would bleed away into 2013, leaving it dangerously exposed should a seven-year old boom in mining investment also top out that year.

The government and central bank still forecast growth of around 3 percent for the next couple of years.

But when the mining splurge turns, as it must, there will likely be significant quarterly falls in investment even as the level of spending stays high.

And since investment is set to reach a heady 9 percent of Australia's A$1.5 trillion ($1.53 trillion) in annual gross domestic product (GDP), such falls could easily cause a couple of quarters of contraction, the textbook definition of recession.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/07/us-australia-economy-boom-idUSBRE8960IL20121007
 
From ANZ (courtesy Macro Business: http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2012/10/a-mining-bust-charted/):
While most first-generation projects will be built, many projects plotted out on drawing boards in recent years will not come to fruition in the foreseeable future. In part, this is due to the reality that there simply would not be sufficient available capital or labour to complete them. Indeed, this report suggests that of the 950 projects identified as currently underway or proposed in Australia, up to two-expenditure between 2013-20 would fall from A$759 billion to A$450 billion, while the required construction and operational labour along the supply chain would drop from 310,000 roles to 160,000 roles.

The project pipelines in New South Wales, Victoria, South Australia, Tasmania and the Northern Territory are most fragile, while projects in Western Australia and Queensland are generally more robust.
 
So what should we do in anticipation?
Every persons situation is different, but in my opinion it's time to get defensive (if not already) e.g.

Pay down debt/reduce LVR (through sale of property if necessary). Build cash buffer.
Mortgage protection w/ unemployment benefits if in high risk job.
Consider sale of properties in areas most at risk (mining towns, etc). Although maybe too late for some: http://www.abc.net.au/pm/content/2012/s3598530.htm
Look at invesment opportunities which might do well in a downturn or with a falling AUD.

etc

(not investment advice)
 
Purely anecdotal, but a friend of mine is currently back in Melbourne having been away for the last six months. She said that restaurants seemed emptier than they were, and the economy generally felt worse than earlier in the year.

I've made the point before, but falling housing markets can be a leading indicator for recessions. There's a lot of chatter about it turning in the news, but it could just be a spring bounce, and we won't know for another few months.

Hobo-Jo's suggestions seem good. I'd add that putting money into the US, UK or Eurozone could be a good move. The AUD is currently extremely strong, and the expectation is that it will fall eventually, so you could make a decent return on the FX rate over the medium to long term.
 
Pretty sad that you have to resort to uninformed childish insults pieman (says more about you than me).

I wasn't old enough at the time of the last recession to bring any personal experiences to the discussion (but I have been out of home for a decade :p). If you remember the 90's recession (or an earlier one!) why not contribute something useful to the discussion rather than making petty comments? What would you be doing in preparation for a recession?
 
Hobo-Jo's suggestions seem good. I'd add that putting money into the US, UK or Eurozone could be a good move. The AUD is currently extremely strong, and the expectation is that it will fall eventually, so you could make a decent return on the FX rate over the medium to long term.

Would you suggest putting some money ($10k) into say euro, rather than keep $ sitting in a bank with 3.50% interest ?

@ hobo-Jo , thanks, much appreciated !
 
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