Have a holiday overseas and pay for it yourself, that's my plan.
I'm convinced I will have a better time of it, more affordable in the long run and a holiday to boot.
Is health insurance worthwhile?
- Thread starter cimbom
- Start date
I'm convinced I will have a better time of it, more affordable in the long run and a holiday to boot.
Well this is very timely.
I have never had health insurance. So I figure we have saved a LOT of money over the last 30 odd years.
Now we are getting older (well hubby is) we have started looking. Hubby's knee aches and doctors say he'll need a knee replacement eventually.
So we are looking. It's so confusing, reading different policies and what's covered, what's not. Hard comparing apples with apples. We figure we need top cover so the knee will be covered. We of course have to pay the extra loading but that's fair.
I have never had health insurance. So I figure we have saved a LOT of money over the last 30 odd years.
Now we are getting older (well hubby is) we have started looking. Hubby's knee aches and doctors say he'll need a knee replacement eventually.
So we are looking. It's so confusing, reading different policies and what's covered, what's not. Hard comparing apples with apples. We figure we need top cover so the knee will be covered. We of course have to pay the extra loading but that's fair.
I have private health insurance and wouldnt be without it.
I used it when I gave birth. I had significantly more positive experience than many of my friends who went public. Many of them were out the door within a day before their milk came in. I really appreciated those extra days to get a handle on the basics.
Dental, optometrist, orthotics. medication subsidies. we use the health insurance dental clinic, so rarely pay anything out of pocket.
We now have 2 teenage children... orthodontics. My son had to have surgery prior to having the braces fitted.
My husband has been going to physio for 6 months.
He just this week had surgery, and was able to get into surgery within 1 week of his specialist consultation. When you are in pain, that has to count for something.
I have been having treatment for cancer for 2 years. I love the fact that I can combine public and private services. Health insurance pays for about $300 for each day of chemo. I guess I probably wouldnt pay anything in a public hospital, but I think there would be a lot more pressure to not continue treatment. the other great thing is that they cover the costs of wigs.. what a blessing that has been. 2 wigs per year pretty much covered. each wig is around $400.
I realise that if we had a traumatic injury, or sudden major health issue like a stroke, that we would use the public system. But its good having options, and particularly being able to get things like wigs is great.
I used it when I gave birth. I had significantly more positive experience than many of my friends who went public. Many of them were out the door within a day before their milk came in. I really appreciated those extra days to get a handle on the basics.
Dental, optometrist, orthotics. medication subsidies. we use the health insurance dental clinic, so rarely pay anything out of pocket.
We now have 2 teenage children... orthodontics. My son had to have surgery prior to having the braces fitted.
My husband has been going to physio for 6 months.
He just this week had surgery, and was able to get into surgery within 1 week of his specialist consultation. When you are in pain, that has to count for something.
I have been having treatment for cancer for 2 years. I love the fact that I can combine public and private services. Health insurance pays for about $300 for each day of chemo. I guess I probably wouldnt pay anything in a public hospital, but I think there would be a lot more pressure to not continue treatment. the other great thing is that they cover the costs of wigs.. what a blessing that has been. 2 wigs per year pretty much covered. each wig is around $400.
I realise that if we had a traumatic injury, or sudden major health issue like a stroke, that we would use the public system. But its good having options, and particularly being able to get things like wigs is great.
If you don't want to be on a public health waiting list, and don't want to pay private health cover, simple, self insure. That way, when your knees wear out from living an unhealthy lifestyle, you've got the money to pay private.
Why so many people think the govt should pay for their knee replacement, and not their brand new car several times over, amuses me. (my point being some people tie more money up in their cars over a life time, rather than put away a bit for when their knees/hips/both wear out).
Why so many people think the govt should pay for their knee replacement, and not their brand new car several times over, amuses me. (my point being some people tie more money up in their cars over a life time, rather than put away a bit for when their knees/hips/both wear out).
My Mum's going in for a knee operation tomorrow (she's got private health). I'd be curious if anyone has an idea of the cost of knee replacement surgery.
Around the time of her first operation years ago, she did ask the specialist what the cost might be and was told she wouldn't be able to afford it. My parents aren't exctly wanting for cash either.
Around the time of her first operation years ago, she did ask the specialist what the cost might be and was told she wouldn't be able to afford it. My parents aren't exctly wanting for cash either.
My wife and I haven't had private health insurance for over 20 years now. We did have it before that with the birth of our first son and found we got slugged left right and centre with all these gap charges. Second son we went in as public and didn't pay a cent. That was enough for us.
As for the public system, yes you do incur waiting lists with elective surgery. Well that's because it's elective, ie. non-urgent, so as long as you can curb your desire to have things fixed right away, it's acceptable. And even if you do decide you want to go to the front of the cue, you just pay with a small portion of the massive savings you've made by not having health insurance all those years.
If I haven't made it obvious already, IMO private health insurance is a scam.
As for the public system, yes you do incur waiting lists with elective surgery. Well that's because it's elective, ie. non-urgent, so as long as you can curb your desire to have things fixed right away, it's acceptable. And even if you do decide you want to go to the front of the cue, you just pay with a small portion of the massive savings you've made by not having health insurance all those years.
If I haven't made it obvious already, IMO private health insurance is a scam.
Keep in mind Medicare will pay between 75% and 100% of this cost, excluding hospital.
Deduct from this what you might pay in gaps and insurance as an insured patient, and this would be your cost difference as a public patient going private.
The other thing most people don't realize is, doctors usually charge private patients more for the same procedure than they do a public patient.
So the knee replacement, probably the most costly of the non urgent surgeries, that also happens to be in the area of health that has the longest of waiting lists, may only cost you a few K - but definately not anywhere near 50K.
As I'm turning 30 this year, my wife (who used to work for an insurance company) told me I need to look into Hopsital cover to avoid the loading.
We currently pay about $200 a year each for "essentials" It pays for itself in free glasses and contact lenses. Makes dental work cheaper and gives me peace of mind about the cost of an ambulance.
From what I have learnt while looking into it the last couple of weeks, I have no intention of getting private hospital cover.
I've had two surgeries over the last 3 months without paying a dollar or waiting more than a couple of weeks on the public health system. One was emergency surgery, the other definitely elective - a chronic, non painful hernia I decided to finally do something about after 5 years. As soon as I decided to see a doctor, I was in and out of hospital.
My wife has had two babies now on the public health system and, again, we haven't paid a dollar.
I think it'd be folly not to self-insure, saving/investing what I would expect to pay in premiums, but the private system has worked amazingly well for me so far and I will trust it for the forseeable future. If I ever see a change in my health that would require hospital cover, I recon the premiums I save in one year alone will cover the loading for a good 10 years.
For me, the arguement that I can chose my doctors or surgeons is ridiculous. What the hell do I know about their qualifications or capabilities? I'm more than happy to trust that if they can hold down their position in a hospital and haven't been sued for malpractice yet, they are more than capable of performing my required procedure and I will recieve all the care I need. If I were to chose my doctor, it'd no more effective than eenie, meenie, minie, mo.
We currently pay about $200 a year each for "essentials" It pays for itself in free glasses and contact lenses. Makes dental work cheaper and gives me peace of mind about the cost of an ambulance.
From what I have learnt while looking into it the last couple of weeks, I have no intention of getting private hospital cover.
I've had two surgeries over the last 3 months without paying a dollar or waiting more than a couple of weeks on the public health system. One was emergency surgery, the other definitely elective - a chronic, non painful hernia I decided to finally do something about after 5 years. As soon as I decided to see a doctor, I was in and out of hospital.
My wife has had two babies now on the public health system and, again, we haven't paid a dollar.
I think it'd be folly not to self-insure, saving/investing what I would expect to pay in premiums, but the private system has worked amazingly well for me so far and I will trust it for the forseeable future. If I ever see a change in my health that would require hospital cover, I recon the premiums I save in one year alone will cover the loading for a good 10 years.
For me, the arguement that I can chose my doctors or surgeons is ridiculous. What the hell do I know about their qualifications or capabilities? I'm more than happy to trust that if they can hold down their position in a hospital and haven't been sued for malpractice yet, they are more than capable of performing my required procedure and I will recieve all the care I need. If I were to chose my doctor, it'd no more effective than eenie, meenie, minie, mo.
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Why don't you just get ambulance cover? I think it's $100 a year for families. Maybe less I cannot remember. This is in VIC.
Jake D i'm not sure how long ago you had your baby in the private health system. But there is no way you will not be out of pocket these days.
First of all the medicare safety net no longer covers obstetrics. Your management fee where you would use to get reimbursed by Medicare ... you'll be lucky to get $200 back out of $2500 or whatever that they charge.
First of all the medicare safety net no longer covers obstetrics. Your management fee where you would use to get reimbursed by Medicare ... you'll be lucky to get $200 back out of $2500 or whatever that they charge.
Thought I should ad, Car insurance is a completely different animal.
With health insurance, if you don't have the cash to pay for treatment upfront, either the treatment is elective and can wait, or it's urgent/emergency and you get it free on the public system.
If I choose to be frugal and drive a non-financed car I can afford, deciding I can live without it if it gets destroyed in a crash does not remove somebody else's right to compensation if I'm at fault.
If they're driving a $100k car, there's no backup public insurance system stopping me from going bankrupt of losing assets if I can't pay up front.
Also, being the most amazing driver in the world doesn't stop other people doing something stupid and causing accidents, even in a a situation where it will legally be "your fault'.
With health insurance, if you don't have the cash to pay for treatment upfront, either the treatment is elective and can wait, or it's urgent/emergency and you get it free on the public system.
If I choose to be frugal and drive a non-financed car I can afford, deciding I can live without it if it gets destroyed in a crash does not remove somebody else's right to compensation if I'm at fault.
If they're driving a $100k car, there's no backup public insurance system stopping me from going bankrupt of losing assets if I can't pay up front.
Also, being the most amazing driver in the world doesn't stop other people doing something stupid and causing accidents, even in a a situation where it will legally be "your fault'.
Got a two year old and six month old. You'll have to forgive my ignorance, even though I've had babies this recently, I have no idea what "obstetrics" covers. (Not trying to be a smart ****, seriously don't know) Is this something that is required in all pregnancies/births? Has the change happened more recently than last november?
As we and a lot of our friends have had babies over the last couple of years, the debate is pretty fresh as to whether to "Go private or Public". For those of my friends who went private, if they were only out of pocket $2300, they would have been much better off. For those of us who went public, all we ever paid for is about $150 for the 19 week ultrasound and then nappies once we got home.
Just reread your post again Jake D, did you mean to say that you went public?? I didn't mind going public honestly I did not want to stay in some hotel room and I did not care that I saw different doctors. I just wanted to get home.
As private you definitely would be out of pocket like you said. It's definitely more than $2300 out of pocket to have a baby in the private system. I was referring only to the management fee ... not everything else on top.
This was around 2010 January I believe that they stopped covering IVF and Obstetrician (the medical specialty dealing with the care of all women's reproductive tracts and their children - from Wiki).
As private you definitely would be out of pocket like you said. It's definitely more than $2300 out of pocket to have a baby in the private system. I was referring only to the management fee ... not everything else on top.
This was around 2010 January I believe that they stopped covering IVF and Obstetrician (the medical specialty dealing with the care of all women's reproductive tracts and their children - from Wiki).
We don't have health insurance, we've always just thought of our investments as that insurance and we are so heavily into them that we can't afford the high cost of insurance so it has to be
Also, I personally think private health insurance is a load of crap. I've only really heard a few win stories about it, mostly losers.. Think about it: They've gotta make money somehow. Our accountant did say she'd get back to us about it if it were worth it for tax purposes though.
I don't doubt that it's good to have if money's no worry, something really bad and expensive might happen, and you may even be covered for it (if it fits policy guidelines that is.. Which by the way I hear it rarely does) Then it would be worth it.
Also, I personally think private health insurance is a load of crap. I've only really heard a few win stories about it, mostly losers.. Think about it: They've gotta make money somehow. Our accountant did say she'd get back to us about it if it were worth it for tax purposes though.
I don't doubt that it's good to have if money's no worry, something really bad and expensive might happen, and you may even be covered for it (if it fits policy guidelines that is.. Which by the way I hear it rarely does) Then it would be worth it.
I think like most things in life, you could put a valid argument for and against.
For the record, I had health insurance (cost over $1300 for single cover) for many years as part of the tax saving but I then dropped it a few year ago.
After several “private” hospital visit’s, I really started to question it value. One visit was going to cost me $578 per day x 5 days ($2,900) as there was a shortfall on the bed even though my policy had “Gold Hospital” cover..WTF..
I then went in for elective surgery and was told there would be no out of pocket as I was privately covered… WRONG again. That 3 hour visit cost my nearly $2,000.
Fast forward 2 more years and I went in for a colonoscopy and was yet again told… no out of pocket…WRONG.. another $2,000 down the tube.
Added to this many were other things that simply weren’t covered and a fiancé that didn’t believe in it and it was scrapped (unless both husband and wife are insured, you lose the tax rebate).
BTW, I had to go back in for another colonoscopy the other week and was told there might be a wait via the pubic system so I asked what my options were and was referred to a private surgery that had some public funding however there would be some out of pocket. I was expecting another hit of $2,000 (or more as I had private health cover the last time) and was pleasantly surprised when they asked me to settle the bill there an then for ….wait for it… $237.
What sort of system penalises those that have insurance versus those that don’t…
Whilst we’re on the subject, we recently went through the public system during the birth of our first child whilst other friends went private. The net result…. We were out of pocket $37 for the TV rental that was ordered for my wife’s room during her stay whilst my private counterpart was bleeding somewhere between $6,000 and $8,000. We even had our “public” specialist present and assisting during the birth unlike any of our “private” friends who’s doctor’s were busy working on the 18th hole.
My mother however has a very sick husband (terminally ill cancer) and obviously has a very opposing view as she feels without the private cover, they wouldn’t be getting the level of care and drugs available to them. She needs the SANF (Sleep at night factor) and for that reason alone, I wouldn’t suggest she drop it.
We will eventually have to go back to private as that’s just the way the system is heading but at least for the next few years whilst we have healthy children, a healthy lifestyle of no smoking or booze, a healthy diet and a good amount of exercise, we’ll give it a miss thanks!
Cheers
B.D
For the record, I had health insurance (cost over $1300 for single cover) for many years as part of the tax saving but I then dropped it a few year ago.
After several “private” hospital visit’s, I really started to question it value. One visit was going to cost me $578 per day x 5 days ($2,900) as there was a shortfall on the bed even though my policy had “Gold Hospital” cover..WTF..
I then went in for elective surgery and was told there would be no out of pocket as I was privately covered… WRONG again. That 3 hour visit cost my nearly $2,000.
Fast forward 2 more years and I went in for a colonoscopy and was yet again told… no out of pocket…WRONG.. another $2,000 down the tube.
Added to this many were other things that simply weren’t covered and a fiancé that didn’t believe in it and it was scrapped (unless both husband and wife are insured, you lose the tax rebate).
BTW, I had to go back in for another colonoscopy the other week and was told there might be a wait via the pubic system so I asked what my options were and was referred to a private surgery that had some public funding however there would be some out of pocket. I was expecting another hit of $2,000 (or more as I had private health cover the last time) and was pleasantly surprised when they asked me to settle the bill there an then for ….wait for it… $237.
What sort of system penalises those that have insurance versus those that don’t…
Whilst we’re on the subject, we recently went through the public system during the birth of our first child whilst other friends went private. The net result…. We were out of pocket $37 for the TV rental that was ordered for my wife’s room during her stay whilst my private counterpart was bleeding somewhere between $6,000 and $8,000. We even had our “public” specialist present and assisting during the birth unlike any of our “private” friends who’s doctor’s were busy working on the 18th hole.
My mother however has a very sick husband (terminally ill cancer) and obviously has a very opposing view as she feels without the private cover, they wouldn’t be getting the level of care and drugs available to them. She needs the SANF (Sleep at night factor) and for that reason alone, I wouldn’t suggest she drop it.
We will eventually have to go back to private as that’s just the way the system is heading but at least for the next few years whilst we have healthy children, a healthy lifestyle of no smoking or booze, a healthy diet and a good amount of exercise, we’ll give it a miss thanks!
Cheers
B.D
Just think of it like this - my good friend came back from being overseas for 3 years. She had frozen her health insurance while over there as she was able to seeing as her hubby was on a posting over there.
When she got back, she tried to unfreeze her health insurance but got into some sort of argument with the girl behind the counter and ended up cancelling it instead.
Unfortunately for her that was a very costly mistake. Only a couple of months later she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She was told that she had a 70% chance of living if she had the surgery and started chemo straightaway. If she waited to get through the public system, she'd have to wait at least 6 months (he said most likely a year) and then her chance of living would be around the 20% mark.
So now she had no choice but to pay for everything herself. She's been told it'll cost somewhere between $50,000 - $80,000 all up for the treatment. Thankfully she has some investment properties so she's going to sell one in order to pay for her treatment.
Very sad but true.
When she got back, she tried to unfreeze her health insurance but got into some sort of argument with the girl behind the counter and ended up cancelling it instead.
Unfortunately for her that was a very costly mistake. Only a couple of months later she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She was told that she had a 70% chance of living if she had the surgery and started chemo straightaway. If she waited to get through the public system, she'd have to wait at least 6 months (he said most likely a year) and then her chance of living would be around the 20% mark.
So now she had no choice but to pay for everything herself. She's been told it'll cost somewhere between $50,000 - $80,000 all up for the treatment. Thankfully she has some investment properties so she's going to sell one in order to pay for her treatment.
Very sad but true.
Only a couple of months later she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She was told that she had a 70% chance of living if she had the surgery and started chemo straightaway. If she waited to get through the public system, she'd have to wait at least 6 months (he said most likely a year) and then her chance of living would be around the 20% mark.
FALSE! She would get in immediately (or in a very short time frame, much like a private patient), as she would be considered urgent.
So now she had no choice but to pay for everything herself. She's been told it'll cost somewhere between $50,000 - $80,000 all up for the treatment. Thankfully she has some investment properties so she's going to sell one in order to pay for her treatment.
Friend of mine who had advanced cancer who isn't insured went private because he wanted a specific Oncologist, and his out of pocket expenses after Medicare in the first 12 months of treatment came to around 3K. He was also initially concerned about cost.
He went into remission following that so can't tell you what he paid 3 years later when the cancer came back but I can't imagine it being that much more. Like I said earlier Medicare pays for most of the bill.
No need to sell any IP's.
Very sad but true.
Sounds like scaremongering by the Oncologist.
