Is the worst now over for Gladstone...?

Having an interest in the area, I've been closely watching the Gladstone market. A few things happened on the ground to indicate the worst may be over.

- New building approvals have basically stopped all together (no more adding to supply).
- A vacant property got two good applications shortly on market - one at asking rate, one asking for a discount for a 3 year lease.
- A drop in listings on re.com.au.

And now finally, this has been represented in SQM research data - http://sqmresearch.com.au/graph_vacancy.php?postcode=4680&t=1

A drop of over 11% down to 8.8%. A far cry from the near 0% rates for the last while.

Still not a pretty place to be a seller at the moment, although there is still a huge amount of buy/sell/rent/economic activity with good long term prospects. Wish I was buying in this market rather than two years ago.
 
On the supply side of the chain, the difference between now and two years ago is that there is now plenty of land ready to be built on, as lots of empty lots are now popping up everywhere.

I wouldn't be so quick as to suggest the high vacancy rate issues are nearing an end just yet, as this is typically the busiest sign up period for rentals in Gladstone - the situation has certainly firmed up a bit from an investor's perspective though.

4 bedroom houses that are in good condition and not asking too much seem to be moving okay (anything that isn't exclusive or unique asking above mid-400s per week are sitting), but it varies from suburb to suburb.

Mid-year will be the interesting point, as Bechtel has indicated in advance 2000 layoffs on Curtis Island. The less watched/known alumina industry should also be watched as it is still suffering from low prices.
 
I do not know the Gladstone area well...but we provide the screens for G&D Lawrie builders http://www.gdlawriebuilders.com.au/index.htm. We send 4-5 house lots up every week and they tell us they have around 3 years of work ahead of them still.

Far out. I wonder if any of these would fall through? I couldn't think of anything worse than building a new H&L package now. Sure, it's the 'easy option' for the interstate investor, but they'll be bitten for not getting their backside on a plane.
 
Still think Gladdy is @ about 3:00am. As Norwoodman mentioned there is a load of blocks ready for houses once the property market shows any sign of life.
Developers are still trying hard to flog h&l packages locally as well. So we are in it for the long haul.
 
I was speaking with a FIFO worker on Curtis Island the other day. He said that the story with Gladstone was that the mining companies originally leased out heaps of properties in Gladstone to house the workers, creating a huge shortage of properties and forcing rents through the roof. They subsequently built mining camps on the islands and moved all workers out of the rentals and into the camps, creating a glut of rentals and forcing rents back down.

Cheers

Jen
 
There is a whole lot of new but crappy homes in Gladstone.

So maybe the market will correct these values/rents down to where they should be and leave the better properties at higher values/rents and still perhaps in some demand.

When the overall demand for accommodation was massive, these crappy homes would still attract huge rents.
 
There is a whole lot of new but crappy homes in Gladstone.

So maybe the market will correct these values/rents down to where they should be and leave the better properties at higher values/rents and still perhaps in some demand.

Agreed. If anyone was considering this area, go for the older OO type properties. I'm happy I did, otherwise I'd be in pain right now. My places still rent out OK and still CF+.
 
We spent time on the weekend with someone who works for a very big company up there. He said that once everything settles and the harbour goes back to normal, there will be a concentration on major tourism.
 
We spent time on the weekend with someone who works for a very big company up there. He said that once everything settles and the harbour goes back to normal, there will be a concentration on major tourism.

Tourism and Gladstone don't really belong in the same sentence. Unless you like looking at industrial plants, the only places in the region worthy of visiting are 1770/Agnes Water and Heron Island (a boat ride from Gladstone).
 
Come on, where's your sense of adventure? We have to hang onto whatever slivers of hope that are flung our way.

Actually I looked at him like he had three heads...
 
Theres been some jobs advertised en masse in gladstone on perth radio. Usually that says something about the local economy?
 
Theres been some jobs advertised en masse in gladstone on perth radio. Usually that says something about the local economy?

Might have something to do with the impending first operations of LNG plant out on Curtis Island scheduled for later this year.
 
Saw this last week $650 down to $530/week 4bed,2,1 with pool in town

There seems to be a lot about the slow down and lay offs in the paper, but it may be a bit exagerated to sell papers, people will just simply be sacked there will be movements of people to other roles. There will no doubt be a slow down but not overnight (although vacancy rates may say something else). There has been a massive amount of money spent over a short time, but have they built to many home for the long term? I was up here in 2009 just as the papers were being signed to start and the stats were out for how many thousand people were needed for construction phase and then the ongoing maintenance work. Looking overall, have to many homes be built?? Say there is another couple of years of major construction work to go what will happen after that??

And can/should I get a bargain now off an anxious investor??
What time is it? 4-6 o'clock?
What are guestimates for when prices will start going back up? By the looks its a tough one to call
 

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Yes, it's a tough call.

I don't really know what the short to medium term is for Gladstone but some things I've learnt from my 12+ years of property investing.

It's best to buy when everybody is all doom and gloomy. I bought at the peak in Gladstone, and once before... never again. I will only buy in dead areas now, so much potential to get a very good buy under market. Some of the deals my Gladstone REA tells me about nowadays are amazing. Vendors selling properties they built for $550k 'may' take low $400's. This is excellent investing, below replacement cost.

If the cashflow is good, it matters much less what's going on with the values. If they stagnate for 2 years then so what? You are still ahead on cashflow. That 'low $400's' property would still rent for $500pw (at least?) at a guess making it CF+ (including new house depreciation).

You really need to look at the long term prospects of an area. Gladstone is our countries designated Industrial muscle city (and it ain't pretty, either!). There will be booms and busts of activity in that area for as long as we'll be around.

Based on all the above, I think it's worth considering.
 
I know this is a bit of a tangent, but muswellbrook,the agent gave me a call telling me of the bargains going around at the moment,

yes they are pre mining boom prices, but there is nothing holding it up ie stopping it from continually falling in obscuirty and becoming another "small town"

I simply wouldnt buy just because its cheaper then it has been

you wouldnt do that in shares ie averaging down unless you were certain that it was a temporary blimp

just my two cents plus gst
 
All,

I've followed just about every 'Gladstone' thread on the forum for the last few years, but haven't contributed too much to any of those the discussions; maybe now it would be opportune to remind speculators on some fundamentals to consider.

Drawing on my past, present, future exposure to Karratha and these very same discussions about investing in the Pilbara, what will happen in Gladstone is that as soon as the construction & commissioning of the LNG plants is done - every company on site will demob - period; they will be gone in a very short space of time.

Forget the 10,000 workers needed and all that political & media BS..once construction is complete, the first major demob will occur, then any remaining staff required for commissioning & handover will go very shortly afterwards..there will be no jobs for people to hang around in Gladstone for..they will chase other jobs, probably back over in WA as Ginas' Roy Hill gets underway and Twiggy & Co start recruiting again (that is if the ex Gladstone drones have the skill sets req'd by Gina & Twiggy etc. doubtful, but ya never know).

For Gladstone (bearing in mind not all the touted full scale of the LNG projects is going to happen - most of it has been scaled right back and some of the major players are still reviewing their commitment & Cap ex positions), the only new / sustained work and growth will come from the peripheral / ancillary / support businesses the LNG plants may seek to extend contracts to for local ongoing civils, plumbing, electrical, laundry, cleaning & catering services etc. These are all very small scale and not the employers of thousands of people.

Sadly the Bligh Govt and I guess "Can Dos" army of sycophants didn't read the state of global economies (they couldn't read Qld's finances let alone the larger world wide LNG industry markets) and the massive cessation of Cap Ex by the four major LNG players spruiked ad-nauseum for Gladstone a few years ago. Without being able to crystal ball very well, it was a case of open slather broad acre development of real estate in the Gladstone region at all costs driven recklessly on blue sky forecasting.

Surely anyone with a modicum of understanding would have realised that the emphasis in Australia on FIFO was always going to mean that not everyone was going to be housed in resi properties in Gladstone??? Sure, some supervisors and other players on these projects might be allocated housing on the mainland during construction & commissioning, but certainly there was never going to be a sustained demand for 'thousands' of houses.

Unfortunately investor greed and poor research is now biting people badly (I have colleagues who bought into Gladstone at its peak, even though I tried to warn them), but sadly the lemmings thought it was going to be Karratha & Hedland boom times all over again. The fact is this was never ever going to happen as there is too much free developable land in the Gladstone region; Karratha & Hedland had no spare tracts of land that could be quickly released as it was all tied up in Native Title or locked up with the WA Govt via Landcorp (they released land very very slowly and in tidbits at a time), so property was scarce and prices sky rocketed and held those heights for years until the construction & commissioning of the Woodside Pluto LNG plant was finished, then companies demobbed and over 300 houses went straight back onto the rental market and Karratha has dropped 30 - 40% ever since!

I drove into Gladstone once a few years ago and I noticed then the huge expanses of available land - this stayed in my mind ever since. I think those who came in and pinch hit in Gladdy i.e. they bought, rented and sold or for those bought, developed and sold out would have made good coin. For those who bought at peak retail prices and are still holding, you may be neutral or marginally positive on yields, but don't expect any return to those heady Capital Growth peaks any time soon.

I think guys like Matt NZ would have done extremely well in their development ventures and some of the long time Gladdy holders on the forum would have done quite ok too (Rooster, Big Tone and others), but unfortunately some of the Johnny come lately types could be hurting and have a not so happy tale to tell.

As I've stated a number of times in my commentary on Karratha, well researched & creative investors may still very well be able to make a few bucks out of Gladstone, but be very, very careful because even though it's not the cliched "one horse mining town", it ain't a hell of a lot different!!

When the industrial economics tank for any industrial or agricultural sector, the ar$e will drop out of its exposure in any town whether it's Karratha, Hedland, Blackwater, Renmark, Mildura, Newcastle, Woolongong, Roxby Downs, Kalgoorlie and yes, even Gladstone with its multi industry circumstance, they'll all hurt badly when companies stop splashing the coin around.

I'm not stating doom & gloom, just stating the obvious that happens in each and every one of these towns during & after the halcyon & prosperous construction days.

Personally I've had my fill with industrial supported towns, in particular Karratha (am still holding IPs there as the cash is too good to let go). I'm not bullish in any way shape or form, but I am happy to hold for the long term.

Now that my marriage separation and property settlement matters are done and dusted, it's time to make up the massive financial loss and to get back into some serious investing, so I've moved onto my first commercial office suite (zoned purely for a specialist field) acquisition in my SMSF. Figured because the ex got 66% of my super :mad: that I really needed to leverage what little was left in it; simply relying on company contributions and TTR in a few years time just was not going to make up the lost ground - leverage was going to be the sonly way to get the balance back up where it needs to be in 8 yrs time when I turn 60.

It's a new ball game, but carries with it some good reward.

I wish Gladdy holders well - at least you've had the nurries to have a go!!

Cheers!
 
Thanks Ian for your views...

Having bought an OTP unit at the top of the market and dreading the valuation coming back in a few weeks (with completion in May) I read your views with even more nervousness but still appreciate it all the same...
 
Hang in there Ems, it might turn out quite ok being OTP and being relatively recent in the construction pipe line....you might come out of this quite ok.

I don't know anything about the Gladdy current state of affairs wrt individual pricing on various styles of property, but the common line on this forum and in other discussions I've had is that a lot of the $500K+ house and land package investors are feeling the pinch....I actually work with guys who have bought into these and they are struggling with the downturn on values and rents from heights of 3 years ago.

Keep the faith and just keep your eye on your specific property purchase numbers once they become known.

All the best.
 
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