Navra Blue Chip Retail Fund Question

gad

gad

What sort of a return % wise are people expecting from their investments in the Navra Blue Chip retail fund?
I'm asking because I'm thinking of re-drawing some funds from an IP mortgage to invest in them. I would like to be confident that the Navra investment would have a superior return to the proportional interest I would then be paying on the IP mortgage. I am not planning on another IP at the moment.
I would be paying 6.45% interest on those re-drawn tax deductable funds.
Your thoughts, positive or negative, would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
 
Hi Gad,

I suppose I might be veiwed as being a little biased :D

Mind you, I am also an investor in the fund . . .

It is very easy for me to quote MY personal historical returns using the system . . . but that is just history. (And should be no indication of what tomorrow might bring)

I could suggest that my expectation is to continue to outperform the index by approx 10% pa . . . but this is just my personal opinion / expectation. (And should not be relied upon)

The fund is new . . . started 01/05/03 and from this date forward it will create its own history. Suffice to say it is a quantitative process, is objective and consistant. PLEASE read the full PDS for a full explanation of the detail.

Factually:

The return on realised profit to the end of the quarter 30/06/03 (2 months) was approx 1% net of all cost fees et al. (This is the actual payout the investors received)

The return for the first 25 days from 01/07/03 is approximately 1.5% (The exact figure will appear on the website tomorrow morning. (Friday's close)

So far so good . . . at these returns this is far better than the cost of your LOC.

HOWEVER . . . it is still very early days.

It will be interesting to get other forum members opinion.

Regards,

Steve
 
What many people fail to consider the effect that a few thousand dollars will have on the term of their loan or LOC.
How much is taking out that 10K going to really going to cost you in the next 5 or 10 yrs? What kind of return do you need elsewhere to come out even? Not only the interest returned on the 10K, but also the less interest that would have been payable on the whole loan for it's term.

Any one who read my other posts knows that I think real estate is still the best investment by far, but i have to admit that if I was looking at funds Steve's looks much better than most out there, including the property funds. :eek:

best wishes
bbg2003
 
Hi Gad,

I am an investor in the Navra Fund. I have put in a resonable amount around the 15th of May and have received (reinvested the money in the same fund) 1.1% distribution at the end of June.

Previously the same money (actually it was a couple of grand!!! more) was placed with one of the biggest and best advertised manager in the country and on that amount in the past 3 years I did not even once!!! received this kind of distribution (maybe around half of it) and at the same time (apart from 2 quarters) it has ALWAYS lost from its capital value. This time the capital value (redemption price) was higher than my investment price as well.

I agree with Steve that is early days as the fund does not have much history, so an investor up to a point has to rely on Steve's experience and knowledge and integrity as well as their own
judgement.

I personally do trust him (and respect him) this is why I invested with him (and will further funds in the future).

Hope it helps. If you get to know the person (Steve) or come along one of their client get together, you can also meet him as well as can talk to other people who affairs is managed by his firm.

Hope it helps,

Tibor
 
I have invested a fair percentage of my self managed super fund. I hope that returns will be even half of what Steve expectes them to be.

Steve, you publish the Performance figures of the fund. But you no longer compare it to the ASX. As fund fees are dependant on performance against the ASX, should those figures be put back into the Performance page?
 
Originally posted by geoffw
As fund fees are dependant on performance against the ASX, should those figures be put back into the Performance page?
Click to expand...

Yes, the website is being re-designed . . . so a work in progress at this time . . . (hopefully 10 days away)

The trading system is about buying low . . . selling high to lock in the profit . . . then employing these dollars to buy in low again.
There is a compounding effect from the redeployment of the ever increasing locked in profit . . . to take advantage of the next low opportunity.

The effect of compounding starts off gradually and then exponentially forges ahead.

It was felt that the comparison to the index at this point would be perceived as a negative. . . .

1) The reality for an investor is: Am I making dollars or not?

Clearly we are making dollars for our clients.

2) The out-performance relates to: do we get a fee or not?

At this point we have earned NO FEE (even though the clients are making dollars) BUT we will . . . give the compounding effect a chance to kick in!

Am I running a Charity Organization? (Making dollars for everyone else and not getting paid for it)

DEFINITELY NOT: We will be handsomely paid when we deserve it . . . and only when we have added EXTRA value over and above the returns we are currently making for our investors.

Sincerely,

Steve
 
Thanks to all you guys that have replied.

Steve, I suppose you could be viewed as being a little biased but I have been reading this forum for some time, as well as having a brother who has consulted you & I believe that your integrity speaks for itself.
I have read the full PDS.
bbg2003, the loan was actually my ppor loan which I paid off in 3 yrs (with a little help), I then re-drew enough for dep & costs on IP 1 & paid it back down in 6 months, I then re-drew enough for dep & costs for IP 2 (twice as expensive as IP 1) which I am not in a real hurry to pay back down as all monies are going into an offset account for the loan on that IP. I have funds available for re-draw but because of the recent boom in house prices in my prefered area I would rather wait for a more opportune time to invest in our next IP. That being the case, in the meantime, I'm trying to see if those idle dollars could be earning me more, rather than just sitting there doing nothing. I would want those funds earning more than the 6.45% (variable) interest I'd be paying while paying back those funds. (Hope that makes sense).
I acknowledge your, Tibor & Geoffw's comments on the Navra fund & appreciate them. Thanks heaps.

If I were to make a re-draw, check the internet site for the current application price, send off a cheque & the application price changes in between, what would happen then? Thanks
 
gad,

It may be a little late for this...

Steve's fund had a moratorium on application fees for applications received up until July 31.

If the application price changes between writing your cheque and it being received by them, you would get fewer or more shares.
 
Gad, Geoffw,

While the moratorium will expire on 31 July 2003, Steve has also organised that people can invest via Neville Ward discount broker, who actually refunds large percentage (maybe even 100%) of the application fees. In plain English, if you invest $1000 then you will buy (at the actual application price) $1000 worth of units if NW has a 100% refund on this specific trust.

Maybe Steve can confirm it, or alternatively visit http://www.nevward.com.au/

Tibor
 
Frankly, I'm not so concerned over the cost of entering the fund.

Saving a few dollars to get in early is nice & some people will say that the early bird catches the worm - realistically if the Navra Fund is successful it will continue to deliver good returns the cost of avoiding the risk of the Fund not working (or having some initial bugs) is worth paying entry costs a few months into the fund's life.

It all depends on your risk tolerance, confidence in the fund management's ability to deliver on Steve's promise (and personal returns) and whether you actually believe that only the first ones in the water will get wet (I believe that either everyone will get wet (make money) or not).

Cheers,

Aceyducey
 
Originally posted by bbg2003
What many people fail to consider the effect that a few thousand dollars will have on the term of their loan or LOC.
How much is taking out that 10K going to really going to cost you in the next 5 or 10 yrs? What kind of return do you need elsewhere to come out even? Not only the interest returned on the 10K, but also the less interest that would have been payable on the whole loan for it's term.
bbg2003
Click to expand...

This doesn't make a lot of sense.

Say, your LOC costs 6% pa (actually normally compounded monthly at about 0.5% per month, but that muddies the calculations).

So you take $10K out. It costs you $600 pa (remember it's an LOC not a P&I loan). So if your income from any investment exceeds $600 you are ahead. Basic business really.

Unless you are talking about the bank voodoo of "pay your mortgage off in 8 years" and you like having a low-leveraged property asset.

Interest over the life of the loan is 6% per annum. Either your income exceeds the cost of borrowing or you are (hmmm what's that phrase?) negative geared.

Regards

Paulzag
Dreamspinner
 
PROMISE DELIVERED

Hi All,

AT LAST . . . We can now accept Super Roll-Overs into the fund!!

Confirmed this morning . . . the Trustees of a large Superannuation Platform have completed their due diligence and NavraInvest will appear on their approved list.

I will post full details when I have the confirmation in writing.

To answer your questions regarding entry fees:

Tibor is correct . . . Neville Ward is a wholesale platform and you can enter the fund without an entry fee through them.

Alternatively, you can work through a Financial Planner:

If you sign a "No Advice" form . . . the planner can affect a o% entry fee. (After all they have not given you advice, nor done any work to justify a charge.)

On the other hand, if the planner has given you advice by way of a financial plan (And generally this is not a bad idea) then they are entitled to be paid for the work they have done.

Structure IS IMPORTANT . . . so the correct balance between property, cash and shares could prove to be vital. Don't be too proud to accept some financial advice . . . where it might be warranted. (Especially regarding the intricacies of all the Super regulations.)

There are NO EXIT fees . . . (If we do not perform to your satisfaction, you are not locked in.)

Sincerely,

Steve

PS: Be sure to note the fund performance as reflected after 11-00am tomorrow :D
 
Hi Steve,

Just a question about the fee calculation in the PDS.

The PDS states that NarvaInvest will take 39.46% of the annual outperformance as a performance fee.

It also states that a performance fee of .3946% of the value of the fund is payable if the index is outperformed.

Which fee is it? Or is it both?
 
Originally posted by Folken
Which fee is it? Or is it both?
Click to expand...

Hi Folken,

They are one and the same . . .

EXAMPLES:

1)
S&P 200 Index 10%
NavraInvest 10%
Outperformance: 0%

Then investor receives: 10.00%
Fee: NIL (Don't deserve a fee!)

2)
S&P 200 Index 10%
NavraInvest 11%
Outperformance: 1%

Then investor receives: 10.6054%
Fee: 0.3946%

3)
S&P 200 Index 10%
NavraInvest 15%
Outperformance: 5%

Then investor receives: 13.0270%
Fee: 1.9730%

See pages 8 & 9 in the PDS.

Regards,

Steve
 
I emailed Neville Ward discount brokers via their web site yesterday as I could find no information on their site in regard to the Navra fund. I have not had a reply (24 hours later).
Do I just fill in the application form from the PDS & post it with a cheque to Neville Ward????????
The PDS states that distributions are not pro-rated, so I won't see a distribution for this quarter. Wondering if it's worth the $300 odd in interest I'd be paying on that redraw over this period. Or would I be better off waiting until towards the end of Sept. (just thinking aloud).
I guess the above didn't apply to the original investors who received a dist. at the end of June, right.
Thanks
 
Originally posted by gad

The PDS states that distributions are not pro-rated, so I won't see a distribution for this quarter.
Click to expand...

Hi Gad,

You will see a distribution for this quarter!

Simply this means that you receive your distribution for the number of days you are in the fund. So you will get your full distribution at the end of each quarter, but from the date of entry.
(Has to be done this way so that each investor is treated equally.)

Regards,

Steve
 
For Steve, maybe this is a bit of a nasty question. Lets say I want to invest in the stock market. Warren Buffett's Berkshire Hathaway exceeded market (outperfomed) by12.2% on average each year since 1964, last year 2002 the group outperformed the market by 32% ( per share book value increase of +10%, whilst market was down -22%).

If Navra invest had such a year, then my +10% return would in fact be a capital loss as Navra group would take 38% of the 32% outperformance ie 12.2% leaving me a Navra investor with an effective -2.2% loss.

However Buffett and his group didn't take 38% of this outperformance! Nasty question but why should I invest my $ with Navra rather than lets say with a proven winner like Berkshire Hathaway?
 
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