New credit rules - 5 days late - black mark on credit filecredit file

What's the point in getting all worked up about it? It's coming and there's nothing you can do to change it.

Kudos for informing yourself but I think you're making a mountain out of a mole hill.

If you want to borrow money from banks it's going to be a part of life, even though the process already is, just less formally. Don't like it? Don't apply for credit.
 
What's the point in getting all worked up about it? It's coming and there's nothing you can do to change it.

Kudos for informing yourself but I think you're making a mountain out of a mole hill.

If you want to borrow money from banks it's going to be a part of life, even though the process already is, just less formally. Don't like it? Don't apply for credit.

Kesse, I merely provided info on the New Privacy Legislation regarding credit reporting.I'm not worked up about it. I'm as cool as can be :cool:
Just wanted to share with other people what I found out and its implications.
 
What's the point in getting all worked up about it? It's coming and there's nothing you can do to change it.

Kudos for informing yourself but I think you're making a mountain out of a mole hill.

If you want to borrow money from banks it's going to be a part of life, even though the process already is, just less formally. Don't like it? Don't apply for credit.

Why are you not convinced? Just because you are living one way does not mean the majority are.

With my work I was in a position where I could see the ins and outs of peoples' financial lives. I was able to see a good cross section of the country and an overwhelming majority are living pay day to pay day or not even that, they weren't even making it to pay day.

Really sad to see because as a whole, the community does not seem to have the financial smarts about them or if they do they just want to live in the now.

Kesse, do you work for the finance or banking industry? The second post seems to indicate that you do.
If you're 'really sad that the community does not seem to have the financial smarts, they just want to live in the now', Then what's wrong with providing people with information regarding new privacy legislation - credit reporting that may have significant changes in the way banks will view them or use their credit report information come Mar 2014?
You can't have it both ways, do you want the community to be educated or not? Thanks for saying 'kudos for informing yourself' but I'd rather much you say 'kudos for informing the community'. Besides informing myself, I enjoy sharing what I learnt with the community, no dog in the manger here.
 
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Kesse, do you work for the finance or banking industry? The second post seems to indicate that you do.
If you're 'really sad that the community does not seem to have the financial smarts, they just want to live in the now', Then what's wrong with providing people with information regarding new privacy legislation - credit reporting that may have significant changes in the way banks will view them or use their credit report information come Mar 2014?
You can't have it both ways, do you want the community to be educated or not? Thanks for saying 'kudos for informing yourself' but I'd rather much you say 'kudos for informing the community'. Besides informing myself, I enjoy sharing what I learnt with the community, no dog in the manger here.

If you're wanting to inform the community then I think the majority of somersoft has the 'financial smarts' about them or are on their way to obtaining it. The community I was referred to was the 'live in the now' community where visiting a property investing forum would be the last thing on their mind. All they would be caring about is the 50 months interest free at Harvey's to get the new 4K TV and which car finance company will give them money to buy the new HSV. These people don't need education about the CCR, they'd be screwed pre or post March 2014. The need to be informed about managing their finances, budgeting and saving.

It just seemed from the tone of some of your previous post that 'the man' was out to get you and screw you over when it comes to credit reporting, particularly post 35.
 
If you're wanting to inform the community then I think the majority of somersoft has the 'financial smarts' about them or are on their way to obtaining it. The community I was referred to was the 'live in the now' community where visiting a property investing forum would be the last thing on their mind. All they would be caring about is the 50 months interest free at Harvey's to get the new 4K TV and which car finance company will give them money to buy the new HSV. These people don't need education about the CCR, they'd be screwed pre or post March 2014. The need to be informed about managing their finances, budgeting and saving.

So as someone from the banking industry, you're admitting that large sectors of the community will be 'screwed' post March 2014, no? and your airily dismissal that

'These people don't need education about the CCR' - Why not?
You banking types are just going to pounce on people post March 2014, aren't you? Just like what the Canberra reporter said, banks are going to target disadvantaged people and offer them higher interest rates on car loans, personal loans, mortgages and credit cards because they are labelled 'high risk?'

Is that why the Credit reporting scheme was made retrospective from Dec 2012? To catch people out? Let them have little black marks on their credit records? Unknowingly become labelled 'high credit risks' for just 5 paltry days late on a credit payment? No warning, no education, nothing. Utility bills and Telcos likely to follow suit shortly.

As for your assertion that the 'majority of somersoft has the 'financial smarts' about them or are on their way to obtaining it', is that how you banking types makes excuses for not educating people on the new Comprehensive Credit Reporting (CCR)?

The rich and/or smart will be able to figure it out
The poor and undeserving and those who live paycheck to paycheck/hand to mouth deserve what's coming to them.:eek:

Everybody is time poor. The ordinary person does not even know where to begin to look, let alone understand the implications of the new credit reporting code or the new privacy legislation that accompanies it.

"Kudos to me for informing myself', thanks! How about using your banking/financial knowledge to inform us about the implications of what's coming rather than continue to let us stumble in the dark. You already admitted people are going to be screwed post March 2014. Care to elaborate on that?
 
This will be my final response to this thread because I can't be stuffed arguing with someone who obviously has an axe to grind, won't see reason or logic and wants to play victim.

Risk based pricing is happening already and has been for a long while. I'm sure Brady will correct me, but as far as I know, CBA do risk based pricing on their personal loan product and as other brokers have stated, risk based pricing happens already with mortgages.

Why are these people continually paying late? If it's because they cannot afford to meet their commitments then they should not be granted lending. If it's a once off with a valid reason then I highly doubt it would affect their lending. Same as it happens today.

As I stated before what the CCR is doing has been happening for years. I'm assuming you've applied for finance? You were asked to provide 3-6 months of transactional statements, 1-3 months of credit card statements and loan statements? What do you think they're looking for? They're looking for account conduct. Dishonoured direct debits, overdrawn account, late payment fees, undisclosed debts etc etc. That's the CCR right there, just not formalised like it will be.

Sure, I'll elaborate. When I said "they'd be screwed pre or post March 2014. " I was referring to the opposite of what you're implying, so please don't twist my words to suit your agenda as you've done on several occasions. I was saying that the implementation of the CCR won't make a difference for these people. Poor credit history will be poor credit history no matter what is implemented.

That's all I will be saying in this thread I feel like I'm in an episode of ACA.
 
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Why are these people continually paying late? If it's because they cannot afford to meet their commitments then they should not be granted lending.

I was saying that the implementation of the CCR won't make a difference for these people. Poor credit history will be poor credit history no matter what is implemented.

Kesse, do you think that people who pay late want to pay late?
Do you think people with poor credit history deliberately set out to pay their numerous bills late? "Today, I'll decide that I am going to pay all my bills late! Whoo-hoo!'

Fact is lots of people are struggling to meet all their bills and payments. Lots of ordinary folk pay bills late from time to time.
I'm talking average working Australians, most with families.
They end up juggling bills, paying the ones which are the most important first, paying the least important ones last. Why?

Everything - cost of living, accommodation, mortgages - has gone up astronomically. Food, groceries, rent, petrol, utilities (gas, water, electricity), council rates, insurances (building, contents, car, life), medicine, public transport, telco, rego, children's school fees, uniform fees, excursions etc.

Just for day to day living, we have so many bills to pay. Sometimes all the bills come at once, many people struggle with paying them off on time so they prioritise and some bills end up late, not 60 days late, but a couple of days is pretty mainstream, I am sure you have experienced that and have had to do some juggling too.

14 years ago, 2 kg of lamb cost $6.99. Houses were cheap. Land was cheap.
Lots of things were a whole lot cheaper.

Now the Comprehensive Credit Reporting will record date due and when paid. 5 days late and you have a little black mark. We don't not know how each bank/lender will configure their credit scoring to take into account 1-4 days late, which are mainstream scenarios. Minus credit points?

The cruel fact remains that CCR is retrospective from December 2012. People have not been forewarned that even a few days late can have serious implications and consequences for their credit file/report.

If utilities and telcos are also included and retrospective from Dec 2012, you can be sure that a WHOLE HEAP of people will have little black marks criss-crossing their record.

I find it ironic that the old CRAA system only recorded credit defaults of 60 days and over and bankruptcies as being serious black marks on your credit file in the days when everything was so CHEAP compared to now.

Now in these ever increasing expensive days, not only does the new credit reporting system incorporate and keep everything the old system had (the para above and even number of credit enquiries (e.g. online pre-approvals) as negative), it now records 5 days late as a black mark and who knows how 1-4 days late will be regarded. Utilities and telco expected shortly to be part of the credit reporting system.

Now, credit providers can reject your credit application on your total indebtedness, inadequate salary or unsatisfactory repayment history ('unsatisfactory' not defined, remaining subjective) amongst other things.

list below from new credit reporting code: -

  1. the adequacy of the applicant's level of income and other resources to meet repayments of credit;
  2. the extent of the applicant's indebtedness and other commitments;
  3. the security of the applicant's employment;
  4. the applicant's credit history including previous bankruptcy, defaults, serious credit infringements, high number of credit applications and unsatisfactory repayment history;

Kesse, you said, 'It's coming and there's nothing I can do to change it' and 'Don't like it? Don't apply for credit!' :(

Well, there is something I can do - which is to inform people of the little bit I do know. Or point people to the right sources of information and not the spin websites.
 
Moving on from the hyperbole the following site may answer some questions,

AUSTRALIA IS BUILDING A CLEARER CREDIT HISTORY REPORTING SYSTEM

http://creditsmart.org.au/

Turk. Big Fail. That is the peak spin website.
This is what Jenna Price, columnist of The Canberra Times had to say about this ACRA website in her article dated 11 Feb 2014 'Big black mark for new credit reporting rules'

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/com...rting-rules-20140210-32d1i.html#ixzz2tHyTpOk6

"There are no advertising campaigns. There is no education process. Just a daggy little website called Credit Smart run by ARCA, the peak body for those same lenders that will be running surveillance on your records. The animations. The script. Cringeworthy.

When did ARCA launch the website? The press release says late January".
 
Turk. Big Fail. That is the peak spin website.
This is what Jenna Price, columnist of The Canberra Times had to say about this ACRA website in her article dated 11 Feb 2014 'Big black mark for new credit reporting rules'

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/com...rting-rules-20140210-32d1i.html#ixzz2tHyTpOk6

"There are no advertising campaigns. There is no education process. Just a daggy little website called Credit Smart run by ARCA, the peak body for those same lenders that will be running surveillance on your records. The animations. The script. Cringeworthy.

When did ARCA launch the website? The press release says late January".

In the interest of educating us Plebs, perhaps you can point out all the errors in the information on this website?

We all need to start somewhere in understanding the new system.
 
In the interest of educating us Plebs, perhaps you can point out all the errors in the information on this website?

I didn't say it had any errors. I haven't read all of it thoroughly to catch any errors yet. If I do, you'll be the first to know, promise.;)
 
I didn't say it had any errors. I haven't read all of it thoroughly to catch any errors yet. If I do, you'll be the first to know, promise.:rolleyes:

So without reading it thoroughly or knowing the value of the site you rate it as a

"Big Fail. That is the peak spin website."

The hyperpole continues.
 
So without reading it thoroughly or knowing the value of the site you rate it as a

"Big Fail. That is the peak spin website."

The hyperpole continues.

I sat cringing through the video (Ugh!). Then I read most of the FAQs, of course they are shorter answers than the original sources of information I refer to. So after a while, because the answers are not as detailed or comprehensive, I feel dissatisfied and switch off. I prefer to go to the original codes and privacy legislation, thanks.
 
The big picture, peeps!

Enough of the tunnel-vision snow jobs from the shills of the financial sector! :mad: What do these new rules mean for property prices? These rules are way more than about black marks against those who constantly miss loan repayments. It seems that even tiny momentary lapses will result in black marks. So, if more and more potential buyers are deemed of low credit worthiness, what are the flow-on effects on property prices?
 
I sat cringing through the video (Ugh!). Then I read most of the FAQs, of course they are shorter answers than the original sources of information I refer to. So after a while, because the answers are not as detailed or comprehensive, I feel dissatisfied and switch off. I prefer to go to the original codes and privacy legislation, thanks.

So, I would take it that there are no mistakes and it would be a starting point for people to start educating themselves.

Perhaps not a "Big Fail" after all.

I think I will follow Kesses example,

This will be my final response to this thread because I can't be stuffed arguing with someone who obviously has an axe to grind, won't see reason or logic and wants to play victim.
 
So, I would take it that there are no mistakes and it would be a starting point for people to start educating themselves.

Oh Turk, there is one small thing I've noticed on the website and that I should bring to your attention.... Under 'Fixing an Error under your Credit Report', why are Telco Ombudsman and Energy/Water Ombudsman listed as authorities to refer to if there are errors in credit report? I thought telco and utilities are NOT going to be included in the new reporting credit system? Or when will they be included, hmmmm? :rolleyes: I'm guessing soon, as this peak ACRA website lists them as authorities to refer to in the event of errors.

Remember, I didn't ask people to refer to this website, you did, Turk.:D

Fixing an Error under your Credit Report

"Credit providers and credit reporting bodies are required to correct errors that you bring to their attention. If they do not take action following the first contact, your request can be escalated to their external dispute resolution (EDR) scheme, or to the OAIC. For financial services companies, contact the Financial Ombudsman Service (FOS) or Credit Ombudsman Service Limited (COSL). For telecommunications companies, contact the Telecommunications Industry Ombudsman. Call the Energy and Water Ombudsman in your state or territory if you have concerns about utility bills".

link to 'Fixing an Error under your Credit Report'
http://creditsmart.org.au/what-to-check-on-your-credit-report
 
Kesse, do you think that people who pay late want to pay late?
Do you think people with poor credit history deliberately set out to pay their numerous bills late? "Today, I'll decide that I am going to pay all my bills late! Whoo-hoo!'

Fact is lots of people are struggling to meet all their bills and payments. Lots of ordinary folk pay bills late from time to time.
I'm talking average working Australians, most with families.
They end up juggling bills, paying the ones which are the most important first, paying the least important ones last. Why?

Everything - cost of living, accommodation, mortgages - has gone up astronomically. Food, groceries, rent, petrol, utilities (gas, water, electricity), council rates, insurances (building, contents, car, life), medicine, public transport, telco, rego, children's school fees, uniform fees, excursions etc.

Just for day to day living, we have so many bills to pay. Sometimes all the bills come at once, many people struggle with paying them off on time so they prioritise and some bills end up late, not 60 days late, but a couple of days is pretty mainstream, I am sure you have experienced that and have had to do some juggling too.

14 years ago, 2 kg of lamb cost $6.99. Houses were cheap. Land was cheap.
Lots of things were a whole lot cheaper.

Now the Comprehensive Credit Reporting will record date due and when paid. 5 days late and you have a little black mark. We don't not know how each bank/lender will configure their credit scoring to take into account 1-4 days late, which are mainstream scenarios. Minus credit points?

The cruel fact remains that CCR is retrospective from December 2012. People have not been forewarned that even a few days late can have serious implications and consequences for their credit file/report.

If utilities and telcos are also included and retrospective from Dec 2012, you can be sure that a WHOLE HEAP of people will have little black marks criss-crossing their record.

I find it ironic that the old CRAA system only recorded credit defaults of 60 days and over and bankruptcies as being serious black marks on your credit file in the days when everything was so CHEAP compared to now.

Now in these ever increasing expensive days, not only does the new credit reporting system incorporate and keep everything the old system had (the para above and even number of credit enquiries (e.g. online pre-approvals) as negative), it now records 5 days late as a black mark and who knows how 1-4 days late will be regarded. Utilities and telco expected shortly to be part of the credit reporting system.

Now, credit providers can reject your credit application on your total indebtedness, inadequate salary or unsatisfactory repayment history ('unsatisfactory' not defined, remaining subjective) amongst other things.

list below from new credit reporting code: -

  1. the adequacy of the applicant's level of income and other resources to meet repayments of credit;
  2. the extent of the applicant's indebtedness and other commitments;
  3. the security of the applicant's employment;
  4. the applicant's credit history including previous bankruptcy, defaults, serious credit infringements, high number of credit applications and unsatisfactory repayment history;

Kesse, you said, 'It's coming and there's nothing I can do to change it' and 'Don't like it? Don't apply for credit!' :(

Well, there is something I can do - which is to inform people of the little bit I do know. Or point people to the right sources of information and not the spin websites.


I agree with kesse - if you're consistently late on bill payments and have a poor credit history due to bad spending habits, low income or social problems, its probably not a good idea for you to get into further debt and definitely not a good idea for a bank, who are not a charity to give you more money

Unfair as it may seem, its the nature of a capitalistic society we live in and owning a home in major cities around Australia is fast becoming a luxury rather than a standard - like most 1st world major cities around the world.
 
Enough of the tunnel-vision snow jobs from the shills of the financial sector! :mad: What do these new rules mean for property prices? These rules are way more than about black marks against those who constantly miss loan repayments. It seems that even tiny momentary lapses will result in black marks. So, if more and more potential buyers are deemed of low credit worthiness, what are the flow-on effects on property prices?

Banks WANT to lend.

They would only want to weed out those who are potentially a higher risk (can't see the odd late bill payment when everything else appears fine being a problem).

High risk means potentially more bankrupcies and firesales.

Better credit screening would probably mean stability and prices being mainained.

Remember, it was the lax (and dodgy) lending practices like those in the US and Ireland that assisted in the collapse of their housing markets which was the main factor leading to the GFC.
 
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Fact is lots of people are struggling to meet all their bills and payments. Lots of ordinary folk pay bills late from time to time.
I'm talking average working Australians, most with families.
They end up juggling bills, paying the ones which are the most important first, paying the least important ones last. Why?
Anyone struggling like this should definitely not be involved in property speculation, it's good for everyone the banks are weeding them out.
 
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