PM classifies damages by tenant as wear and tear

[rodimus]

We are having problem with our managing agent now. MICM (Melbourne Inner City Management).

In one of our apartment, we found that when the current tenants moved in 2 years ago, there were many things in the Incoming Conditions Report noted by the tenant that

-carpet has stains
-blinds control wand is broken (in 2 rooms)
-chipped floor tiles
-dusty blinds

All these were done by the previous tenants. The current tenant noted in their handwriting these damages that they saw. The agent merely ticked in the ratings boxes "Ok condition" or "good condition".

Now we are trying to ask MICM why didn't they deduct the previous tenant's bond (whichever tenant was responsible), and MICM just claims that they do not know which of the previous tenants did it, and they are classifying it as "wear and tear" (because MICM says it is not malicious damage, no bond was deducted - excuses excuses). The second excuse they give is - "The property is more than 15 years old (built in 1997). So does it mean if the property is more than 15 years old the tenants can do whatever they want and walk away free and call it wear and tear? Also MICM has been the manager for every tenant since the beginning.

I remember when I was renting last year in Sydney, a small accidental scratch on the floor board by my bed costed me $400 deducted from my bond by L J Hooker. And that apartment I rented was built in the early 1990s.

As for the dusty blinds remark on the incoming conditions report by my current tenant, MICM says "it is subjective how dusty it is - a matter of perspective".

So basically
-Chipped tiles = wear and tear
-dusty blinds = it is a subjective matter (now the current tenant is never going to clean the blinds because it was dusty to begin with).
- carpet stain = wear and tear
- broken blinds = maintenance issue ("and we don't know which tenant broke them anyway")

Now MICM is telling us to bear all the cost for these items.

Is this normal for an agent to shrug shoulders and push everything to the Owner to fix?

When I confronted the agent about these damages, the agent told me they could not find any photos (they say they didn't have the practise of taking photos during inspection in the past), basically they don't know which tenant caused the damages even when they have been managing every tenant of the property since the beginning.

 

[Sez]

This is a tricky one and I wouldn't like it to go to VCAT.

Chipped tiles = Ok, your PM probably should have sought some compensation from the tenants for this, however, depending on the size of the chips a member at VCAT may not have awarded anything. With regards to the property being 15 years old, they would be mentioning this because depreciation is taken into account with every VCAT claim with less money being awarded for older items.

Carpet stains = how old are the carpets? It shouldn't seem like it would matter but it does when you get in front of a member at VCAT. You should have been able to at least get a proper carpet clean & Spot treatment paid for by your tenants though.

Dusty blinds = Unfortunately in VIC tenants only have to leave the property in a reasonable condition. Your PM probably should have sent the old tenant back to re-clean them though. (It is true that some tenants move in and go over the place with a white glove). Basically the VIC tenancies act comes down to 'the tenant has to leave it in a reasonable condition but it is up to the landlord to get it up to rentable condition'

Blinds = Those control wands break all the time, they are typically plastic and exposed to a lot of sun so I do actually agree that this is a maintenance item.

IF proper ingoing & outgoing inspections had been done you would know which tenant had caused all the damage, I have to agree that it sounds as though your PM is getting a little slack with their responsibilities. Have a talk to them about being a bit more on the ball or start shopping around.

A tenant can't just get away with anything in an older property but unfortunately the longer they are in a property and the older the items are the less compensation a landlord is entitled to.

It's tricky for your PM as they have to advise you based on the law and the rules which a VCAT member will base their decision on, perhaps if they had given you a little more information from the beginning you would feel a bit better?

With your $400 deduction did you happily pay it or did the matter go to tribunal? If it had gone to tribunal I'd be surprised if you had to pay the full $400 (or anything much at all for that matter) depending not on the age of the building, but when the floor boards were last polished.

Hope this helps a little !!

 

[Scott No Mates]

Has the agent taken photos this time around?

 

[Sez]

Has the agent taken photos this time around?

Without being told to?? Unlikely

 

[beachgurl]

I've just had the same issue. 3 security sliding doors have damaged lock mechanisms (one looks like it has been jimmied open with a screwdriver and snapped off) and a wire sliding door has a broken wheel. I was told this is all under wear and tear. Probably doesn't help that the ongoing or outgoing inspections have no mention of the damage.

 

[MPmelb]

You can read about my experience here:

http://somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88791

I learnt a few things the hard and expensive way from this experience:

(1) Having IP's can be like throwing money down the drain. The net rental yield in Melbourne is around a lousy 2%. Pathetic

(2) Many tenants don't care about your IP and will damage it if they can get away with it when they see the PM is slack.

(3) Many real estate agents won't care about your IP because they've got hundreds just like yours under mgmt. It's just a job to them, but it's your asset. So YOU have to carefully watch over your asset yourself to ensure it's looked after properly, and not simply leave it to the PM. Make sure the PM does inspections regularly (every 6 months), attend the inspections with them, and take many photos. When the tenants see a the PM is active in their duty, they will treat your IP nicer.

(4) If you can't find a PM who is reliable and you can trust, then DIY. I did it - believe me it's not as difficult as it seems.

 

[Lil Skater]

VCAT sucks when it comes to compensation for most properties over 10years as they have their own little "depreciation" calculations.

However, I have been to VCAT for properties around 15years old where there were no stains prior to a tenancy, but a number afterwards and regardless of the age I've won (as long as the tenants were only in there max 2/3years)

I agree the control wands for blinds break all the time, especially if you're talking about them being 15years old.

Dusty blinds - the agent should've got the tenant to clean them after they left - however the act states that the property needs to be left "resonably clean" so if there's dust here and there, particularly if it was noted when they moved in, then it's not something VCAT will award you any costs to clean.

How large are the tile chips and how are the blinds broken? Tiles don't chip easily, but if they're not cracked and just a few small chips (I dropped a full bottle of wine and chipped ours by accident) it could be seen as fair wear and tear. If the blinds are damaged due to misuse it's not fair wear and tear in my opinion, but if we're talking in VCAT terms you mightn't be so lucky.

Unfortunately because your current tenants have noted the damages, it seems the damage is caused by the previous one and reclaiming any costs from them isn't going to happen. I'd suggest talking to the principle to get some sort of compensation.

I have had some issues previously with the company, and even if it wouldn't win at VCAT you should've been informed at the time and they should've attempted to mitigate your loss.

 

[chilliblue]

If you are not happy with their services, move to another agency.

Just remember to let the licensee of the business know why you are going.

Just have a quick read of what timings and notices you need to give them in the management agreement.

 

[INVSTOR]

That sounds similar to what I've been through recently. My plastic laundry trough has a huge tear in it (wear and tear???) and the dishwasher had been booted also. I also paid cleaners, blind cleaners/fixers, etc between the two tenants and tenants wrote on incoming report the items weren't cleaned/fixed properly so on vacate they left stuff broken and dirty. I spent hours working out which tenants did what but in the end it was just a waste of my time. I also spent hours compiling photos and writing to property manager. Apart from the chipped tiles, I'll be replacing as much as I can and claiming the loss. I spent about 3 x 8 hours days scrubbing also. Get a new PM or consider managing yourself as its a lot less time consuming. Also take as many of your own photos as possible and document stuff as they may be needed in the future. My accountant said I didn't need to replace things immediately if I didn't have the finances and to make a note as such.

 

[Lil Skater]

Just to add further on claiming costs from VCAT (not sure about other states) but it is very unlikely that you will be able to claim replacement/compensation costs from the tenants on a quote as it is not seen as a loss (go figure).

Except in some instances, like carpets where you're only after say $100 for a stain, in which case you need to provide a quote for full replacement costs and then claim a % of that cost appropriate to the damage caused.

 

[rodimus]

After making a lot of complaints to MICM, I got a call from one of their manager saying yeah they admit that these damages were not noted, and they don't know who damaged these items. The previous PM managing our property has passed it to another PM, and now this PM has passed on to a newer younger PM. It seems a waste of time and energy talking to her because she wasn't involved until a few months ago.

But after I continued to rant rant and rant to her saying how could they as a "reputable" agent be so negligent in their management and claiming they don't know who caused those damages, she says as a goodwill she will ask their builder for one of those blind control wand to replace. I hope she really will replace them because i dont know where i can get them, as our blinds are the 1997 model which will be different from current type.

 

[Token Funder]

After making a lot of complaints to MICM, I got a call from one of their manager saying yeah they admit that these damages were not noted, and they don't know who damaged these items. The previous PM managing our property has passed it to another PM, and now this PM has passed on to a newer younger PM. It seems a waste of time and energy talking to her because she wasn't involved until a few months ago.

But after I continued to rant rant and rant to her saying how could they as a "reputable" agent be so negligent in their management and claiming they don't know who caused those damages, she says as a goodwill she will ask their builder for one of those blind control wand to replace. I hope she really will replace them because i dont know where i can get them, as our blinds are the 1997 model which will be different from current type.

Seems a lot of effort for a 16 year old piece of plastic.

 

[Sez]

After making a lot of complaints to MICM, I got a call from one of their manager saying yeah they admit that these damages were not noted, and they don't know who damaged these items. The previous PM managing our property has passed it to another PM, and now this PM has passed on to a newer younger PM. It seems a waste of time and energy talking to her because she wasn't involved until a few months ago.

But after I continued to rant rant and rant to her saying how could they as a "reputable" agent be so negligent in their management and claiming they don't know who caused those damages, she says as a goodwill she will ask their builder for one of those blind control wand to replace. I hope she really will replace them because i dont know where i can get them, as our blinds are the 1997 model which will be different from current type.

Just about any blind installation company or repair company will have those plastic wands. .
I would consider the plastic wand the least of your concerns, they are exposed to a lot of sun which weakens them and they do break - it's a part of the maintenance on your property.

How did you go with the chipped tiles and carpet stains??