Retaining wall nightmares!

All you experts out there but for newbies like me this came as a bit of a shock.

We are considering a house with a massive retaining wall out the back. The block is on a downward slope towards the road and the retaining wall is on the back boundary. There is another house behind the block on stilts.

The lawyer told us yesterday that if the wall falls over and takes some of the block behind (or even weakens the other house footings) we would be liable for all. :eek: :eek: :eek: It doesn't matter if the wall is approved, or if the wall is there to hold up the neighbours house/block behind etc, if something goes wrong the liability all falls with the prop owner who owns the retaining wall.

He said for fences it is 50:50 between neighbours but for retaining walls no such law exists. Boy do we still have much to learn!
 
That's what insurance will cover.

Similar issue applies for swimming pools: all that water could do a lot of damage to a neighbour's house.
 
Check with your state leglislation.

In Queensland if the retaining wall forms part of the fence, i.e., the fence is built right on top of the wall then fencing leglislation applies to the wall too.

Insurance may not cover you for earth slippage or if the wall collapses due to age or disrepair.

Frankly the situation you describe would be a deal breaker for me.
Marg
 
That's what insurance will cover.

Similar issue applies for swimming pools: all that water could do a lot of damage to a neighbour's house.

I have the same issue with my house and havent been able to find any insurance which covers me, if you know of any i'd love to hear about it! All of mine are on my property and as far as I have looked into it im completely liable. Going to be quite expensive to repair/replace when the time comes...
 
Since you say massive I assume its going to be greater than 1m so probably your council will require a structural design done for the wall.

It costs money of course but after construction get an engineer to inspect it and sign off that it has been built correctly. A full report will check for proper compaction and that the wall was built as per the specification. Might sound a bit redundant but its something that you can point at latter and say yes the wall was done correctly.

However I hope the house above is not too close to were the wall is going to be. I would be considering getting an inspection done of the house above to note any cracks, and other problems before you start any works. That way if they report latter they have problems you will know what has occurred since you started.

Is the block big enough to bring the wall inside your boundary a few meters?
As others have said I would be very iffy on buying a block that required a wall as you have described with a house already built above.
 
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I spent a bit of time last year looking at PDS for a number of insurance companies. From memory, none covered subsidence except as a result of earthquake
 
Check out this crap !

I have a beauty for you all out there and feel I need to get it off my chest as it is eating away at me right now and driving me nuts. I have a property in Goulburn NSW. My neighbors property slopes towards it and has so for many years. Approximately 5 years ago my neighbor approached me to build a garage. Thinking nothing of it I said "Do what you have got to do, it didn't bother me what you do on your side". This was a big mistake. Due to the slope of the land, my neighbor decided to add fill to level the block out but did not install a retaining wall to contain the soil and expected the fence to hold it back. Obviously it didn't, the fence completely collapsed and ended up on the side of my property.

As the property is an investment property, I was only made aware of the problem by a passing friend that routinely drove past to check the place from time to time at random. Wen I inspected the property there was a bobcat sitting on the property, the fence completely collapsed towards my house and in fact was completely resting on the wall of my property. When I knocked on the door, there no answer, even though their car was sitting outside. I did however hear laughter coming from inside. So I called the police. They told me this was a civil matter and that I needed to contact the council. As it was Saturday I left and first thing Monday I contacted my real estate agent telling them what happened. It took some months before contact was made by my agent and they got back to me saying that they were allright and said would fix the issue. All that my neighbor did to fix the issue up was straight straighten the fence up by pulling it back with the bobcat. The fill remained contained by the fence. I asked my real-etsate agent to take photos of the incident, none were taken. some months later when I finally made contact with the owner of next doors property we discussed what had happened. I told her we need to do something about the fence and for her to remove the soil as it was a problem. She agreed, so I left it at that but said that she was going through a messy break up with her partner and that he was violent and abusive and that she needed more time to take care of things. I gave her two years to come to the party. over the two years I sent her estimates for a fence and retaining wall construction, all my letters were not responded to, except for my last one through my solicitor five years later as the fence was in such a terrible state that it had become dangerous.

I contacted council outlining the issues above in full with dates correspondence and all the details. It became apparent that council had inspected the site before building, and passed it like this. I couldn't believe my ears. I contacted the prime minister, the ombudsman and everyone I could. They told me that nothing could be done and that because of the time that had gone by that this matter could not be enforced. I was peeved so I contacted my solicitor. He instructed me to write my neighbor letter giving them one final chance to fix their stuff up. I had a visit from my neighbors father. We discussed at length the problem. He admitted that the sol was put there before they built and that a retaining wall should have been build before the fill was added. I asked him what he was going to do about it. He said he was going to build a wall on hi side to contain it. I agreed it was a good idea and that this would resolve all the problems we had. I offered home concrete blocks so we could build it properly as I acquired 57 of them for nothing from my work. He said he wanted to throw them in with the fill to help contain it. This frustrated me. So I said why don't we do it properly so we don't have any more issues. he said he and his daughter had no money and couldn't afford it from the messy break up and that once again her former partner was violent and abusive. AT this point was starting to think these people were full of crap, as the garage was a brand new color-bond construction, they had installed a new water tank and irrigation system, had renovated their house fully and were driving a brand new Holden cruz. So I gave her father a last chance to fix the problem. The agreed time frame was 2 months. The next thing they did dumbfounded me. He started to remove the soil up against the fence behind the garage and install a treated pine retaining wall. Only problem was he didn't install any posts and expected the fence posts to hold it up. and in the two months only did approximately 1 meter of the fix. The fence by now became so unstable it was dangerous and pieces were constantly falling down. Contacted my neighbor, no response once again, ignoring me Contacted the council asking them to enforce compliance with the relevant building codes, and they said that because I had agreed to allow them to build the wall that I was party to the works and no enforcement action could be taken. I contacted my solicitor about this matter outlining the matter and my concerns for the structual integrity of the fence. He told me to inform my neighbor and remove the dangerous section of the fence. This equated to be 16 meters of it that was severely affected.

The response to my SMS was Stop contacting me any more about this matter, this is harassment, you are violent and abusive, I have contacted the police. At this point I was furious. I pulled the thing down in front of her, she glared at me as eh drove away and I made sure that it was photographed in detail including the fill that caused the problem. So I contacted the local court and opened up a case. My solicitor instructed me to subpoena all the relevant documents, the council applications, name of the builder, the bobcat operator, where the fill come from the name of the company that provided the garage. After two successful adjournments later, on the day that finally I was ready to have the matter heard, my requests for the documents were denied by the local courts magistrate siting that it was going to cost too much money to get these documents and that it would be cheaper to have the matter heard there and then. I accepted only on the grounds of cost. The magistrate did not want to hear anything about the fill.

After 6 hours in court in front of the court a court order was given. I agreed the build the retaining wall on the boundary for the cost of materials which my neighboor was to contribute half the costs. The cost was to be paid up front by myself and then my neighbor was to pay the debt off in installments of 50 dollars per fortnight. My neighbor was to help remove the debrit coming onto my side to allow the build to commence and to remove a tree up against the back of the fence.

Immediately after the court case I sent council applications to clear the area for the build. This involved demolition of a concrete staircase and footpath on my side with a jack hammer. My neighbor complained to council saying that I had started work without council permission. It was dismissed by council as I told them I was just preparing the area for the build. Typical nasty **** from my neighbor. A the wall was to be installed on the boundary, the application required both signatures on the application for everything. I sent three letters, none were responded to. I finally made contact with my neighbor and asked them to sign the paperwork there and then. They refused. So I contacted the local court and asked them for enforcement of the court order citing they were obstructing the court order. They made me hand over copies of the plans and the applications which were not signed till two weeks later. There was one final application required. This was the appointment of the principle certifying authority. We both nominated council. SO after all this, the court case finished in February, I had approval to start in May. That's some 3 months after the court case. Unfortunately we now had to wait till my father returned from Europe before we could start. He returned in December.

The job is now almost complete. The 13 meter retaining wall has been build out of concrete blocks and the fence posts installed on top. The rest of the fence is yet to be completed. We will complete the rest in the following weeks. No a word has been uttered by my neighbor to me during construction. Not once has her father offered any help with the build. We have been working in 40 - 45 degree heat to build it all.

I am currently compiling all invoices to be issued and will send them shorlty once complete, however there is for sure not going to be any sort of co-operation as there has not been in the past. If I can ofer anyone any advice in these matters its as follows. Trust no one. Show no pity or mercy as if you do scums of the earth like these will walk all over you just like they have me. I am not happy, feel unjustly treated by my neighbor, the police, the council, the court system and pretty much every one involved. I hope that no-one ha to go through what I have gone through at my property.
 
What terrible terrible neighbours you had nickyP00. Don't worry, Karma is a ******, it will come back to bite them up the **** eventually.

I hope it worked out well in the end.


I have a beauty for you all out there and feel I need to get it off my chest as it is eating away at me right now and driving me nuts. I have a property in Goulburn NSW. My neighbors property slopes towards it and has so for many years. Approximately 5 years ago my neighbor approached me to build a garage. Thinking nothing of it I said "Do what you have got to do, it didn't bother me what you do on your side". This was a big mistake. Due to the slope of the land, my neighbor decided to add fill to level the block out but did not install a retaining wall to contain the soil and expected the fence to hold it back. Obviously it didn't, the fence completely collapsed and ended up on the side of my property.

As the property is an investment property, I was only made aware of the problem by a passing friend that routinely drove past to check the place from time to time at random. Wen I inspected the property there was a bobcat sitting on the property, the fence completely collapsed towards my house and in fact was completely resting on the wall of my property. When I knocked on the door, there no answer, even though their car was sitting outside. I did however hear laughter coming from inside. So I called the police. They told me this was a civil matter and that I needed to contact the council. As it was Saturday I left and first thing Monday I contacted my real estate agent telling them what happened. It took some months before contact was made by my agent and they got back to me saying that they were allright and said would fix the issue. All that my neighbor did to fix the issue up was straight straighten the fence up by pulling it back with the bobcat. The fill remained contained by the fence. I asked my real-etsate agent to take photos of the incident, none were taken. some months later when I finally made contact with the owner of next doors property we discussed what had happened. I told her we need to do something about the fence and for her to remove the soil as it was a problem. She agreed, so I left it at that but said that she was going through a messy break up with her partner and that he was violent and abusive and that she needed more time to take care of things. I gave her two years to come to the party. over the two years I sent her estimates for a fence and retaining wall construction, all my letters were not responded to, except for my last one through my solicitor five years later as the fence was in such a terrible state that it had become dangerous.

I contacted council outlining the issues above in full with dates correspondence and all the details. It became apparent that council had inspected the site before building, and passed it like this. I couldn't believe my ears. I contacted the prime minister, the ombudsman and everyone I could. They told me that nothing could be done and that because of the time that had gone by that this matter could not be enforced. I was peeved so I contacted my solicitor. He instructed me to write my neighbor letter giving them one final chance to fix their stuff up. I had a visit from my neighbors father. We discussed at length the problem. He admitted that the sol was put there before they built and that a retaining wall should have been build before the fill was added. I asked him what he was going to do about it. He said he was going to build a wall on hi side to contain it. I agreed it was a good idea and that this would resolve all the problems we had. I offered home concrete blocks so we could build it properly as I acquired 57 of them for nothing from my work. He said he wanted to throw them in with the fill to help contain it. This frustrated me. So I said why don't we do it properly so we don't have any more issues. he said he and his daughter had no money and couldn't afford it from the messy break up and that once again her former partner was violent and abusive. AT this point was starting to think these people were full of crap, as the garage was a brand new color-bond construction, they had installed a new water tank and irrigation system, had renovated their house fully and were driving a brand new Holden cruz. So I gave her father a last chance to fix the problem. The agreed time frame was 2 months. The next thing they did dumbfounded me. He started to remove the soil up against the fence behind the garage and install a treated pine retaining wall. Only problem was he didn't install any posts and expected the fence posts to hold it up. and in the two months only did approximately 1 meter of the fix. The fence by now became so unstable it was dangerous and pieces were constantly falling down. Contacted my neighbor, no response once again, ignoring me Contacted the council asking them to enforce compliance with the relevant building codes, and they said that because I had agreed to allow them to build the wall that I was party to the works and no enforcement action could be taken. I contacted my solicitor about this matter outlining the matter and my concerns for the structual integrity of the fence. He told me to inform my neighbor and remove the dangerous section of the fence. This equated to be 16 meters of it that was severely affected.

The response to my SMS was Stop contacting me any more about this matter, this is harassment, you are violent and abusive, I have contacted the police. At this point I was furious. I pulled the thing down in front of her, she glared at me as eh drove away and I made sure that it was photographed in detail including the fill that caused the problem. So I contacted the local court and opened up a case. My solicitor instructed me to subpoena all the relevant documents, the council applications, name of the builder, the bobcat operator, where the fill come from the name of the company that provided the garage. After two successful adjournments later, on the day that finally I was ready to have the matter heard, my requests for the documents were denied by the local courts magistrate siting that it was going to cost too much money to get these documents and that it would be cheaper to have the matter heard there and then. I accepted only on the grounds of cost. The magistrate did not want to hear anything about the fill.

After 6 hours in court in front of the court a court order was given. I agreed the build the retaining wall on the boundary for the cost of materials which my neighboor was to contribute half the costs. The cost was to be paid up front by myself and then my neighbor was to pay the debt off in installments of 50 dollars per fortnight. My neighbor was to help remove the debrit coming onto my side to allow the build to commence and to remove a tree up against the back of the fence.

Immediately after the court case I sent council applications to clear the area for the build. This involved demolition of a concrete staircase and footpath on my side with a jack hammer. My neighbor complained to council saying that I had started work without council permission. It was dismissed by council as I told them I was just preparing the area for the build. Typical nasty **** from my neighbor. A the wall was to be installed on the boundary, the application required both signatures on the application for everything. I sent three letters, none were responded to. I finally made contact with my neighbor and asked them to sign the paperwork there and then. They refused. So I contacted the local court and asked them for enforcement of the court order citing they were obstructing the court order. They made me hand over copies of the plans and the applications which were not signed till two weeks later. There was one final application required. This was the appointment of the principle certifying authority. We both nominated council. SO after all this, the court case finished in February, I had approval to start in May. That's some 3 months after the court case. Unfortunately we now had to wait till my father returned from Europe before we could start. He returned in December.

The job is now almost complete. The 13 meter retaining wall has been build out of concrete blocks and the fence posts installed on top. The rest of the fence is yet to be completed. We will complete the rest in the following weeks. No a word has been uttered by my neighbor to me during construction. Not once has her father offered any help with the build. We have been working in 40 - 45 degree heat to build it all.

I am currently compiling all invoices to be issued and will send them shorlty once complete, however there is for sure not going to be any sort of co-operation as there has not been in the past. If I can ofer anyone any advice in these matters its as follows. Trust no one. Show no pity or mercy as if you do scums of the earth like these will walk all over you just like they have me. I am not happy, feel unjustly treated by my neighbor, the police, the council, the court system and pretty much every one involved. I hope that no-one ha to go through what I have gone through at my property.
 
I spent a bit of time last year looking at PDS for a number of insurance companies. From memory, none covered subsidence except as a result of earthquake

Yes correct
When you lodge claim with insurer insurer will investigate cause of retaining wall collapse. If it's not a covered event you will be uninsured ... Subsidence is generally a standard exclusion
 
If you are lucky enough to get insurance, them you will have to maintain the wall in good condition. You can't simply let it rot away and fall over and expect the insurance company to build you a new wall.

Insurance covers unexpected events, and is not an alternative to maintenance.
Marg
 
Insurance covers unexpected events, and is not an alternative to maintenance.
Marg

... unless you are a manipulative little old lady who pushes and pushes until the person dealing with you gives in and approves repairs that should never have be needed if the property had been maintained, just to shut you up... :roll eyes:

I've seen this first hand. Disgusting, and no wonder insurance premiums keep rising.
 
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