When negative gear how much holding cost

Hi All,

I have negatively geared properties in my portfolio which I have worked out the holding cost to maintain for the long term. They range from $25 pw to $125 pw to hold at present.

Was wondering how much holding cost is a property worth to keep? Does anyone aim for a target or range for holding cost before they determine that IP is better of being sold and moving on.

Would appreciate your views.
 
Was wondering how much holding cost is a property worth to keep?
I think this depends entirely on:

1) Whether you can afford to keep putting in this amount each week, and

2) Whether you anticipate capital growth that significantly exceeds this cashflow shortfall.

Elaborating on the second point:

i. Firstly, you do need to at least cover the cashflow shortfall, ie if it costs you $5K per year to hold, you need to anticipate CG of at least $5K.

ii. You have to get a decent return on the equity that you have invested in the property. So if you have a $320K debt on a $400K property, in simple terms* you have $80K of your money invested. You would want to get at least 20% return on your equity, in my opinion, so at least another $16K CG to cover a decent ROI.

[*It's actually a little more complex than this; if you can wrap your head around it, I calculate "my equity" by figuring out what I'd have left over if I sold the property. So you have to subtract agent's fees, CGT already accumulated, etc. This gives a real figure of the equity you'd have to invest elsewhere if you sold this property, which is what's important when considering the opportunity cost of holding this property.]

iii. Additionally you're accumulating a future CGT debt of about 20% of the increase (conservatively), so in addition to the $5K + $16K = $21K, you need to divide by 0.8 = $26,250, to ensure the CGT is covered.

So on a $400K property owing $320K and costing you $5K per year to hold, you need to be anticipating capital growth of at least $26250/400,000 = 6.56% pa. The dollars it's costing really are irrelevant, if you can afford the cashflow, and the return is good.
 
Hi All,

I have negatively geared properties in my portfolio which I have worked out the holding cost to maintain for the long term. They range from $25 pw to $125 pw to hold at present.

Was wondering how much holding cost is a property worth to keep? Does anyone aim for a target or range for holding cost before they determine that IP is better of being sold and moving on.

Would appreciate your views.

This would depend on many things. For instance, say you have a nice home near a CBD, in a rising market. It costs you $400pw to hold, but is increasing in equity by many times this amount & rents are also increasing quickly. In this instance, I would say the property is definately worth keeping.

Then, you may have a home in a Regional area that is only costing you $10pw. However, you bought poorly & have no equity in it. The market is falling fast, rents don't look like they are going to increase for many years & you get nothing but no-hoper type tenants & you are stressed to the max. I would say, given the circumstances that this property is not worth keeping.
 
Did I read that right?

Yep, about 2mil a year in holding costs.

The point I was trying to make was it's all perspective. So what if it's $10 - $40,000pw, if you can afford to hold it and the end result is beneficial then it's worth it.

Oasis, these are my holding costs on a couple of developments I have running at the moment.

Mark
 
Thank you for all your responses.

So on a $400K property owing $320K and costing you $5K per year to hold, you need to be anticipating capital growth of at least $26250/400,000 = 6.56% pa. The dollars it's costing really are irrelevant, if you can afford the cashflow, and the return is good.

ozperp, regarding your method of anticipated CG do you need to take into consideration inflation as well?

I did some calculations on 2 properties and it seems the more equity that is used the higher the anticipated CG. Does that sound right?
 
I don't think you have to complicate things that much. :D

If you look at how much it's costing you to hold right now, and how much growth you'd anticipate this year, and things look good, then hold. Time (inflation) will only help all the numbers, because your major income - rent - will go up, whereas your major expense - mortgage interest - will stay the same. So the amount of cashflow shortfall decreases each year, in fact you'll eventually even make a profit! :eek:

So in summary, if this kind of analysis says "hold", then hold, and time will improve the situation even further, increasing your ROI.

If this kind of analysis shows that the investment is marginal, I'd still be inclined to hold if I can afford it, because as stated, time will help.

If this analysis shows you need CG > 10%, I'd be thinking hard about selling, as I don't think that kind of return is going to be "the norm" in the coming years. (Unless you're in a particularly strong market.)
 
I did some calculations on 2 properties and it seems the more equity that is used the higher the anticipated CG. Does that sound right?

If you use no money of your own, then your rate of cap growth will be higher compared to someone who put in a cash deposit, but the actual cap growth rate compared to what you paid for the property won't change.

From a return on investment standpoint, it's better to put in as little of your own money as you can.

The problem is, the less cash you put in, and the more you borrow, the bigger the interest bill is and this impacts on your cashflows.
 
Back
Top