Would you offer a rent reduction?

[alplant]

We have a property with relatively long term tenants in place. The ceiling needs painting, it is flaking in places. This has been noted on a couple of inspection reports as a maintenance issue and my OH has attempted to do a quick fix but it just crops up in another spot. We have obtained a quote from a painter to redo the entire ceiling. The problem is that he suggests it would be better done between tenancies as it will mean considerable disruption to the tenants.

Our first thought was that we would tell him to go ahead and we would offer a rent reduction to the tenants for the inconvenience but it irks me a little to do that given that they are the ones actually asking for it to be done. Plus, while I know this has no bearing on the maintenance issues, they are always late with the rent. Not by much, usually only four or five days, although occasionally it has been more than a week. This has been the case for the last two years. I could count on one hand the number of times they have actually paid by the due date.

So my question is – what would you do, would you offer a rent reduction, and if so how much? They currently pay $260 a week, which before the floods was probably pretty much on the market, but I was reading only yesterday that there has been a bit of a bidding war starting to happen here in Ipswich for vacant rental properties since the floods and this property was high and dry.

 

[bluestorm]

No, would not offer a rent reduction. Why would you loose money in rent, and then have to spend extra money to paint ceiling.

In regard to disruption to the tenants, I would think that a good painter could get a room or two done in the time the tenants are at work for example, if it's just the ceiling. So it's more a matter of co-ordinating a suitable time.

 

[alplant]

I probably should have mentioned that the tenants don't work, so are home all day.

 

[agent007]

We have a property with relatively long term tenants in place. The ceiling needs painting, it is flaking in places. This has been noted on a couple of inspection reports as a maintenance issue and my OH has attempted to do a quick fix but it just crops up in another spot. We have obtained a quote from a painter to redo the entire ceiling. The problem is that he suggests it would be better done between tenancies as it will mean considerable disruption to the tenants.

Our first thought was that we would tell him to go ahead and we would offer a rent reduction to the tenants for the inconvenience but it irks me a little to do that given that they are the ones actually asking for it to be done. Plus, while I know this has no bearing on the maintenance issues, they are always late with the rent. Not by much, usually only four or five days, although occasionally it has been more than a week. This has been the case for the last two years. I could count on one hand the number of times they have actually paid by the due date.

So my question is – what would you do, would you offer a rent reduction, and if so how much? They currently pay $260 a week, which before the floods was probably pretty much on the market, but I was reading only yesterday that there has been a bit of a bidding war starting to happen here in Ipswich for vacant rental properties since the floods and this property was high and dry.

I would not offer them a rent reduction. I will ask them whether they want the repairs to be done during their lease or if they would prefer the landlord to do the maintenance after the lease expire.

 

[Propertunity]

No, would not offer a rent reduction. Why would you lose money in rent, and then have to spend extra money to paint ceiling.

I agree and I would also add that you should consider raising the rent (if the market will allow it)

In regard to disruption to the tenants, I would think that a good painter could get a room or two done in the time ....if it's just the ceiling. [/QUOTE] I agree here too - it's just a ceiling

 

[Ed Barton]

We have a property with relatively long term tenants in place. The ceiling needs painting, it is flaking in places. This has been noted on a couple of inspection reports as a maintenance issue and my OH has attempted to do a quick fix but it just crops up in another spot. We have obtained a quote from a painter to redo the entire ceiling. The problem is that he suggests it would be better done between tenancies as it will mean considerable disruption to the tenants.

Our first thought was that we would tell him to go ahead and we would offer a rent reduction to the tenants for the inconvenience but it irks me a little to do that given that they are the ones actually asking for it to be done. Plus, while I know this has no bearing on the maintenance issues, they are always late with the rent. Not by much, usually only four or five days, although occasionally it has been more than a week. This has been the case for the last two years. I could count on one hand the number of times they have actually paid by the due date.

So my question is – what would you do, would you offer a rent reduction, and if so how much? They currently pay $260 a week, which before the floods was probably pretty much on the market, but I was reading only yesterday that there has been a bit of a bidding war starting to happen here in Ipswich for vacant rental properties since the floods and this property was high and dry.

no rent reduction. are they even asking for one?

the painter wants to paint in between because i imagine he has experiences of tenants expecting the painter to move every last thing. it's easier to paint an empty house.

are you hinting at wanting to increase the rent because of the flooding? that would be very poor form.

if the tenant is long term and looks after the place i wouldn't worry about the payment history, but keep on they're back. others will disagree.

 

[kathryn d]

I'm mean.
I wouldn't give a rent reduction..but then again, I wouldn't be painting the ceiling either.Especially when they don't have a history of paying on time.

Just tell them when you decide to repaint, it will be between tenancies, and then you will be increasing the rent to cover that added expense.

 

[alplant]

No they haven't asked for a reduction.

I am definitely not hinting that I want to raise the rent. They have just signed a new six month lease for the same rent they've been paying. We will probably look at what the market is doing at the end of that lease though.

I only mention the bidding wars because it suggests that what was a glut of rental properties recently now looks like maybe a shortage, but that's probably only short term anyway. I just tend to think they're probably happy they still have a roof over their head, (and for the same amount of money) lots of people don't, so maybe that would lessen the inconvenience aspect.

Thanks for the input so far, it's strengthing my resolve to not offer a reduction.

 

[alplant]

I'm mean.
I wouldn't give a rent reduction..but then again, I wouldn't be painting the ceiling either.Especially when they don't have a history of paying on time.

Just tell them when you decide to repaint, it will be between tenancies, and then you will be increasing the rent to cover that added expense.

I like this and I'm leaning towards doing exactly that.

 

[Lil Skater]

Our first thought was that we would tell him to go ahead and we would offer a rent reduction to the tenants for the inconvenience but it irks me a little to do that given that they are the ones actually asking for it to be done.

I think you just answered your own question right there.

 

[Ed Barton]

No they haven't asked for a reduction.

I am definitely not hinting that I want to raise the rent. They have just signed a new six month lease for the same rent they've been paying. We will probably look at what the market is doing at the end of that lease though.

well sorry for the semi accusation then.

sounds like they are a little under market rent then?

you should look at what the market rent is doing at the end of every lease, even if you decide to keep it under market.

if they don't work are they on benefits? could you get centrelink to take it out of their benefits if late payment is an issue? they may be very happy with this

 

[Ed Barton]

I think you just answered your own question right there.

it's one of those border line maintenance/improvement issues, and depends how bad it is. a new washer's not going to get more rent, but a freshly painted place probably will.

if the walls are near needing painting i'd get them done at the same time.

 

[alplant]

Yes they are on benefits but I'm pretty sure our RE doesn't accept Centrelink payments. Anyway the late payments aren't that big an issue, we only get the money once a month anyway so unless they get more than a week behind it doesn't make all that much difference to us.

Tenants should think about how consistantly late payments affect them though, because if they decide to move on and the new LL asks to view their tenant ledger it could go against them.

At this point we are thinking along the lines of telling the RE we will tackle a full repaint (yeah, the walls could probably do with it too) when the place is vacant, as suggested by the painter. If the tenants aren't happy with that they have the option of moving out at the end of their lease. It wouldn't bother us too much if they did that, the place could do with a bit of a spruce up.

Edited to add ... They are a tad under market now, (the flood situation again) but weren't when they signed the lease. Bet they're glad they signed when they did.

 

[wylie]

If my tenants were asking for the ceiling to be painted, and if indeed it was something that I needed to do (as opposed to something the tenant just WANTED done), then I would arrange a quote, and ask the painter to liaise directly with the tenant for a suitable time.

I would NOT offer a discount on the rent in this instance. You are doing something they want (and if it suits you, then so be it).

Different matter if YOU wanted it done and were prepared to reduce the rent to compensate them for the disruption.

ADDED: I typed this before going out and posted it before reading the other responses.

If the walls probably need painting too, I would wait until they move out and do it all at once. Also, I imagine the quote will be more for a house with furniture than empty, so keep that in mind.

 

[skater]

I would not offer a reduction either, but like someone else said, I wouldn't be painting it in a hurry either. If it is something that needs doing, then I'd be waiting until I have vacant possession of the property, but I wouldn't be turfing them out at the end of the lease either. I'd probably just bide my time until the timing suited me, or they decided to move.

As far as the paint flaking on the ceiling is concerned, this can need more than just a paint too. I'm not exactly sure what causes it, but my MIL has a couple of places where this has happened and it is an ongoing issue. If it is the same as what we have seen in her place, it is probably much easier (and propably cheaper) to just resheet it and then paint.

 

[alplant]

As far as the paint flaking on the ceiling is concerned, this can need more than just a paint too. I'm not exactly sure what causes it, but my MIL has a couple of places where this has happened and it is an ongoing issue. If it is the same as what we have seen in her place, it is probably much easier (and propably cheaper) to just resheet it and then paint.

That's a good point. We completely repainted this place when we bought it in 2004 and the ceiling starting flaking again pretty quickly. It does seem like it might be an ongoing thing. OH scrapes it back and does a touch up but it just pops up somewhere else, or starts flaking again in the same place even. He thought it was because he wasn't scraping enough of it back. That's why when we got the latest maintenance report we thought about getting it done professionally, but he has mentioned himself that it might be better to resheet it and start again.

I was just passing these replies on and he said that the carpets are looking a bit tired now as well, so it's probably time for a full makeover when these tenants decide to move on. Sounds like a plan.

 

[Ed Barton]

At this point we are thinking along the lines of telling the RE we will tackle a full repaint (yeah, the walls could probably do with it too) when the place is vacant, as suggested by the painter. If the tenants aren't happy with that they have the option of moving out at the end of their lease. It wouldn't bother us too much if they did that, the place could do with a bit of a spruce up.

Edited to add ... They are a tad under market now, (the flood situation again) but weren't when they signed the lease. Bet they're glad they signed when they did.

tell them that. if they give notice, paint in the notice period. it will avoid you having no rent while you paint.

you seem obsessed with the floods. the market price now is not the long term price. if it's vacant rent it at the flood price. otherwise it will return to pre-flood market soon. which it will by the lease periods you've described.

 

[alplant]

I'm not obsessed with the flood at all.

You said that it sounded like they were a little under market (or something like that). I was just replying to that and saying that they are a little under market now. If you look up the suburb today on RE there is nothing comparable even close to what they are paying, but that wasn't the case back when they signed the lease, a little over a month ago, and that's purely because of the flood situation, and apparent shortages, (I think) which I already said I believed was only a short term thing anyway.

It was just an observation on the 'market'. The market is, what the market is, and if you were comparing todays market they are a little under, a month ago they weren't. In six month's time ... who knows? We will cross that bridge when we get to it.

PS ... Actually you could be right I could be a little obsessed. That probably comes from having four of our immediate neighbours (those we share a fence line with on our PPOR) go under water and those houses still standing empty. Every time I go out into the backyard I can't help but be reminded.

 

[priscilla]

Just thought I would share this with you.

If you ever do offer a rent reduction we have been advised in the past (by both OFT & REI) to call them rent rebates which would indicate for a fixed term i.e. 2 weeks. If you call it a rent reduction by law you could then be required to give 60 days notice to increase it back to the original rent.

 

[nww]

Sounds like a sealer was not used before the top coats,
Try using a sealer over the old coats before top coating,
But sounds like this might be an ongoing issue.

Big difference between undercoat and undercoat sealer.