Your Strategy At Bidding (Auctions)

[Bill.L]

Hi all,

For those with all the different tricks, do any of you think you have been able to purchase the property cheaper than you otherwise would have without the tricks??

My attitude to auctions, all, not just property, is that you want the other party to stop at their limit, and not think that with one more bid they may get it.

I was serious before about leaving the hand raised, the other party can see what you're doing, and knows that one more bid will not win it, therefore they stop at their limit. (of course you lower your hand if you reach your limit).

bye

 

[Jonathon]

My attitude to auctions, all, not just property, is that you want the other party to stop at their limit, and not think that with one more bid they may get it.

Couldn't agree more. I've been to countless auctions in Melbourne where couples have some kind of emotional attachment to a property and clearly go over their limit. It's quite obvious when you stand next to them and you hear them justifying to themselves that it's worth it for just a few extra k, even though they've clearly gone over their predetermined limit.

If you can change their mindset early doors by letting them think you're going to buy it no matter what, then perhaps they'll retreat.

I don't know about holding my hand up the entire time (it'd get sore!) but when I'm bidding I bid immediately, literally as soon as the other person has bid, all the better if the auctioneer doesn't get a chance to acknowledge their bid.

I've never understood the logic of not bidding first, if noting else it stops the auctioneer crapping on with the usual lines like "Did I mention how quiet the street is?"

And as others have pointed out, it'd illegal to disrupt auction proceedings in Victoria through any kind of intimidation of other bidders.

Cheers
Jonathon

 

[willair]

Going to attend a few auctions in the next few weeks so thought might ask for best strategies.

Been to few auctions in the past so have a fair idea of what happens- Just curious as to what strategies are used by most:
a) Snipe bidding: staying quiet up untill the third hammer
b) opening with a big bid and making big bids quickly until your limit (which should be a good one for this to work lol).
c) slowing the auction down (small bid increments, being on phone etc)
d) bid as you go...

Pros and cons of each??

Any other advice (except for sticking to a limit which isnt most help in current climate!! LOL).

Turn up early and watch who the agents talk too very important the auction game is open to all different types of people most that turn up don't have 20 cents in their back pocket,look at the people that turn up to tell everyone that will listen they intend to buy it at any price,most just want to have a look and see,very few end up with their hand in the air,then before the start move down the back and watch everything,and everyone have your limit set and wait,if it goes above your limit then keep both hands in your pockets,,and walk,it can all happen that fast and if you get into a bidding war with someone else make sure you make eye contact,and see if it was one of the people that was there talking at the start,,who knows you could be bidding against the crow in the tree or the back fence..good luck..willair..

 

[Piston Broke]

Hi all,
For those with all the different tricks, do any of you think you have been able to purchase the property cheaper than you otherwise would have without the tricks??

True but you have to kill the boredom and make it fun.
My favourites are still the noobnowitall investor type people and the "****".
They go round talking to people trying to sus everybody out, and when they come to me I casually say "Yeahhh, I think it go will pretty cheap like 400 or 450" knowing full well that no one in their right mind would pay a dollar over 350.
And watch the look on their face of shock, horror and then contempt.
It's very funny.

If someone tries the "staredown" (as noob as it gets lol) just start taking pictures of them, you can even ask them to smile. Make sure your phone/camera is set to click and at max volume.

And take the esky.
If someone slows it down, instead of bidding walk to the car and take out a sandwich and a drink and start eating.
Raise your hand, finish chewing your food, then bid.
Or can even play snake on your phone.
If anyone is being disruptive, then question their presence (as in not required and should be asked to leave) to the auctioneer only.
Also note if you follow the "****" technique like **** & **** seem to do, then don't ever do it in your local area or where you know the vendor REAs. Chances are they will remember you, and be more than happy to make sure your last on any list they may have or even worse.

 

[Syrah]

The whole purpose of making a scene is to direct the attention off peoples game. Your there to secure the property at the lowest price and vendor at the highest price. I dont see how a person can have police called upon for having a little humour at auction.

I have purchased hundreds at auction and have a different strategy at each auction attended.

As for asking the questions, its asked to slow the bidding down and does work if you have a weak auctioneer, if you have a strong auctioneer and you pull tricks on them they will shoot you down and you will have the whole reverse happen.

Goodluck all.

How exactly does slowing the bidding down 'work'? So a young couple are ready to bid on their dream home but think, "gee this is taking too long, let's just walk away" or " that crazy man is staring at us, let's not bid". Honestly, I reckon these tactics are just going to make people more determined not to lose out to you in the auction.

 

[travelbug]

The thing is when it goes up quickly in (say) $1,000 increments. It goes quickly back and forth and people sometimes get caught up in the game, sometimes without thinking. I've seen people go over their limit. When it ends they realise what they've done. It's an emotional thing. They keep thinking it's only $1,000 more.
When it's odd numbers they need to think. This sometimes causes them to realise they are beyond their limit and they stop. Of course if their limit is above yours you lose no matter what increments you use.

 

[Dazz]

With Auctions, the sale is on the fall of the hammer

Are you quite sure about that Kristine ?? Most substantial things in life are determined by written Contracts, and there is usually quite a large gap in both time and distance between the end of the theatrics and the business end of things, usually inside with the pens and paper.


It is quite within the Vendor's discretion to accept an unconditional cash offer and sign up someone other than the "winner" of the theatrics out on the front lawn.


Banging a gavel down on a clipboard, piece of paper or a human hand means diddly squat in terms of Contracting. Signatures down on paper of both the Buyer and Seller.....now that's when you have a sale.


Could be wrong, but I seem to re-call quite a famous incident a few years ago when the tradition of the "fall of hammer" was challenged and found to mean not a jot. What do you reckon ??

 

[ianvestor]

Signatures down on paper of both the Buyer and Seller.....now that's when you have a sale.


Could be wrong, but I seem to re-call quite a famous incident a few years ago when the tradition of the "fall of hammer" was challenged and found to mean not a jot. What do you reckon ??

So what we need is a system where all the bidders sign a copy of the contract, and then the vendors get a stamp made of their signature and paste it to the bottom of the hammer. Then just before the hammer goes down, they put the corresponding copy of the contract under it and BAM!

Being serious for a second, are there actually circumstances where a stamp can have the same legal standing as a signature?

-Ian

 

[turk]

Are you quite sure about that Kristine ?? Most substantial things in life are determined by written Contracts, and there is usually quite a large gap in both time and distance between the end of the theatrics and the business end of things, usually inside with the pens and paper.


It is quite within the Vendor's discretion to accept an unconditional cash offer and sign up someone other than the "winner" of the theatrics out on the front lawn.


Banging a gavel down on a clipboard, piece of paper or a human hand means diddly squat in terms of Contracting. Signatures down on paper of both the Buyer and Seller.....now that's when you have a sale.


Could be wrong, but I seem to re-call quite a famous incident a few years ago when the tradition of the "fall of hammer" was challenged and found to mean not a jot. What do you reckon ??

Hi Dazz

I would have thought that most substantial things are decided by legislation,
including contracts.

The legislation in Victoria to which I think Kristine is referring to binds both the vendor and purchaser to the contract on the fall of the hammer.

Then again Dazz with your experience you may be correct.

Cheers

Pete

 

[Peterw]

Dazz, not quite sure what famous incident you are talking about, however some times just sharing a fraction of a story or situation, clouds things rather than clarifies things.
May I share a couple of points. Fact verbal contracts are binding. The challenge always is proving the agreement, when people claim a different recollection of the verbal agreement. Now, when the agreement is in front of a croud, you have witnesses to the agreement. That aside, in Qld, and I believe in other states, the law states, that for agreements relaing to property, they must be in writing to be binding, and hence to be enforcable.
Now, the next point may not be know to many, the auctioneer, has the authority to sign the Contract (which has been on display) on behalf of, both the seller as well as the buyer. There are a number of court cases that support this situation. So the premise, that the sale is on the fall of the hammer, is a correct one.
Again that said, yes things can go off the rails, when the parties return into the privacy of the property. I have had the situation where the highest bidder has broken down, and advised that in the heat of the moment, has bid over their limit. At that moment, the seller can choose, have the auctioneer sign the contract and look to enforce the buyer to complete, or turn to the under bidder, and do a deal.
I do believe that on balance, the public sale has still more advantages over disadvantages, for both parties, than private sales, where buyers do not see or know what other buyers may be doing. Just my 0.02 cents worth.

 

[Monopoly]

Are you quite sure about that Kristine ?? Most substantial things in life are determined by written Contracts, and there is usually quite a large gap in both time and distance between the end of the theatrics and the business end of things, usually inside with the pens and paper.


It is quite within the Vendor's discretion to accept an unconditional cash offer and sign up someone other than the "winner" of the theatrics out on the front lawn.


Banging a gavel down on a clipboard, piece of paper or a human hand means diddly squat in terms of Contracting. Signatures down on paper of both the Buyer and Seller.....now that's when you have a sale.


Could be wrong, but I seem to re-call quite a famous incident a few years ago when the tradition of the "fall of hammer" was challenged and found to mean not a jot. What do you reckon ??

Legislation changed in 2008 (for more indepth details refer Victorian Consumer Affairs website for information on sale of public land).

http://www.legislation.vic.gov.au/d...4fc58d6e0c486992ca25747e0081462e!OpenDocument

 

[Amadio]

Legislation changed in 2008.

http://www.legislation.vic.gov.au/d...4fc58d6e0c486992ca25747e0081462e!OpenDocument

Yes, but, in that very document...at the end, is this;

"The new regulations will not apply if the successful bidder or vendor fails to sign the contract after the auction"

 

[Dazz]

Thanks Monopoly. Interesting reading, especially ;

The new regulations will not apply if the successful bidder or vendor fails to sign the contract after the auction and the vendor wishes to continue with a private sale

As I thought. Still leaves the door wide open for the Vendor to refuse the highest knocked down "successful" bidder and sell it to whomever, whenever, at whatever.


Postscript - I see Amadio also reads the details.

 

[Monopoly]

There are actually 2 situations where the amended rules do not apply:

http://www.consumer.vic.gov.au/CA25...-Sale+of+Land+Amendment+Regulations+2008~#not

Sorry I should have been more specific...I wasn't trying to indicate that the "falling of the hammer" was final as far as a contractural agreement, only that it was pretty much all-over-rover, hammer down and contract signed, which is what I assumed was the scenario being discussed here.

If it wasn't then of course, there may be room for negotiation (if the vendor is willing to entertain it).

However, it baffles me why any auctioneer, throws down the hammer claiming a sale, being aware that the property hasn't met the vendors reserve. Unless the vendor has got caught up in the heat of the auction, and readjusted that figure during the event, by which time, its a sad situation for the poor unsuspecting buyer who thinks he's won the property!!

 

[Monopoly]

Postscript - I see Amadio also reads the details.

Touché Dazz, silly me...I "assumed" the contract of sale was signed.

I must be having a really bad day, I'm completely missing the fine print!!

 

[Dazz]

So the people reading this thread will probably be the only ones in Australia who confiently know that when the auctioneer knocks down the gavel at an auction, and the highest bidders squeal with joy and there is a polite round of applause, they'll be the only ones who know it means diddly squat and no sale has been entered into.

 

[Player]

So the people reading this thread will probably be the only ones in Australia who confiently know that when the auctioneer knocks down the gavel at an auction, and the highest bidders squeal with joy and there is a polite round of applause, they'll be the only ones who know it means diddly squat and no sale has been entered into.

Yep

The rest of the populace wouldn't fit on this server and if they did, it would be awfully crowded

Best we stick to our select SS cohort

 

[Monopoly]

So the people reading this thread will probably be the only ones in Australia who confiently know that when the auctioneer knocks down the gavel at an auction, and the highest bidders squeal with joy and there is a polite round of applause, they'll be the only ones who know it means diddly squat and no sale has been entered into.

Not at all. Besdies which, I can't speak for everyone reading this thread, only myself because (as I've said x 2 now) but will go for a third, I "assumed" that the contract of sale had been signed.

Yes, many of those squealing bidders will probably deem themselves winners, and for the most part, will be given all goes well and the vendor hasn't changed his/her mind.

However (without inviting open debate) I would like to make clear that there is weight in contracts/agreements other than those purely endorsed by the almighty pen!!!

 

[wylie]

I'd be curious to know how many people have ACTUALLY known this to happen. Mum was in real estate for many years, and I know a LOT of agents.

I asked one a few nights ago (this thread was running) and she knew of one instance only where the fall of the hammer didn't follow on with that bidder signing up. It ended up a frightful mess, and I don't remember the details, but it stood out for her memory because it was the only time she could recall it happening in many years of being in the industry.

It may be something that COULD happen, but like many things, is not something that DOES happen.

Anybody personally know of a single case????

 

[Monopoly]

I'd be curious to know how many people have ACTUALLY known this to happen. Mum was in real estate for many years, and I know a LOT of agents.

I asked one a few nights ago (this thread was running) and she knew of one instance only where the fall of the hammer didn't follow on with that bidder signing up. It ended up a frightful mess, and I don't remember the details, but it stood out for her memory because it was the only time she could recall it happening in many years of being in the industry.

It may be something that COULD happen, but like many things, is not something that DOES happen.

Anybody personally know of a single case????

Hi Wylie,

I don't know of it ever happening to anyone I know, but it can, albeit rare. More often than not, the hammer will come down and it's a done deal but there would be the odd occasion where the vendor gets caught in the heat of the bidding war and tries to get more.