A Blacktown deal I walked away from

Had a very interesting and informative experience recently with a Blacktown/Marayong Property. Should be an interesting read for anyone planning on buying in Blacktown or nearby.

The Deal
I'm on the market for a cashflow nuetral/positive house in the Blacktown area and recently came across a place at 4 Attard Place Marayong that you can see here

http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-nsw-marayong-107619667

563sqm brick two floor property with a total rent of of $1070 from three leases. Lease one is second floor, three bedrooms 1 bathroom - $385 Lease two is first floor three bedrooms 1 bathroom - $400. Lease three is a granny flat with 2 bedrooms (not confirmed), 1 bathroom - $285.

Location is in a relatively low crime street for that area and walking distance of shops and the train station.

It was up for auction 8 days from when I discovered it.

Sounded great so with sweaty palms and a racing heart, I started to do some number crunching and checking before making an offer.

The offer
Checked sale and rent figures for that area, went over a residex report on that property, called the agent (LJ Hooker) who was handling the auction, called another agent (Astro Real Estate) who had the listing on RE.com, called council and went in search of some expert opinions.

Made a conservative written offer Sunday night of 520k that I did not expect to be accepted half way through all this due diligence. Received an email back Monday to say the offer had been passed onto the vendor. Received another email Tuesday to say the offer had been declined and the property was going to auction. Told the REA that my offer would still be open if the auction did not reach reserve.

Two agents and a vendor, A RE triangle
While making an offer to LJ Hooker and exchanging emails, the REA from Astro is also emailing me saying that they can make the sale for me and that they are in contact with the vendor. Checked with LJ Hooker who said they had exclusive rights to the sale. Strange. Astro kept sending emails from a gmail account that were written unprofessionally and with poor commucation skills saying that they had the right to sell. Stranger.

I'm not into games so I suggest Astro and LJ Hooker talk to each othe and the vendor.

A couple of days before the auction, Astro are getting more excited with emails and saying the vendor would not go to auction. LJ Hooker email me on the day of the auction to say the vendor pulled out and the property did not go to auction.

After the Auction
Astro sent an email saying the vendor has accepted my offer on the condition of a 25% deposit. Red warning lights flash here. Too strange.

A call to Blacktown councli who are great reveals that since digital records were kept in 1989 there have been no approvals for that property. That means that the granny flat is not approved (not surprised) and that the house itself is most likely not cleared for dual occupancy.

Outcome
The vendor is making an under the table deal iwth the cheapest agent, the agent is extremely unprofessional, the property is not legally tenanted for 2 out of 3 leases, even at 520k the property is over priced for its size and location.

So with some regret (awesome cashflow :eek:) I'm walking away from this deal. This has been an interesting and learning experience.

What would you do?
I'm fairly inexperienced and still learning so my reasoning/approach/dd/conclusion etc etc may not be the best. I'm curious to know what the more experienced and successful investors here would have done???
 
When dealing with multi-family properties, we check to make sure they are legal ones first.

As you have found out, they aren't always.
 
Follow up with a note to council, asking for confirmation that the 3 residences are legal.
let the R-swipes endure council hassles
 
After finding out how easy and cheap($50) it is to get all the council plans for a property(at least in my region) when I buy again it will be a condition of sale that approval is given for me to do so before settlement.

Not only does it ensure everything has approvals it also makes it easy to plan reno's.
 
Its this a butter beware scenario, ie lack of approved plans, our would this come up as part of title search and closing out the sale?
 
Hi Brendon
I think I may have spoken with this agent. Is it an Indian lady? I found her contact details on Gumtree and realised it's an agent advertising on Gumtree as many do. So I told her what I was after thinking she might be an agent who wants to make deals happen - win for me if I get a nice deal. The next morning after we spoke she emailed me about a house in Minchinbury for $600k by a local agent (Elders), has a market appraisal of $630k BUT since the vendor is her friend she can sell it to me for $565k. She also said that this property is under instructions to sell in the next 4 days. When I checked it on RP Data it had been on the market for 200 days by 'Astro' and 'Elders'...

I didn't get why she thought the other person is a fool (but then most agents think that). Her communication was okay via email but there was a desperation to sell. She wanted me to see the property the same day. I wasn't going to buy it anyway as I'd buy 3 IPs with that sort if money.....and the RP data Val (although dud) didn't appraise it more than $560k anyway.
 
Blacktown = 3 leases = already fishy

^ ^ what he said. Standard resi zoning would allow for 2 occupancies at most.

Additionally Brendon, when you get a copy of the contract (which I assumed would be one of the first things you did ;)), check on the front page, who the selling agent is. If it is agent X - fine, deal only with them, (and cut off contact with agent Y). If agent X and agent Y in conjunction, then take your pick.

You don't want to get caught in the middle of a commision claim by both agents - and if you check the contract carefully, you'll see that most likley there is an obsure clause in there, where you as purchaser indemnifies the vendor against such claims (i.e. you get to pay selling agent comm - beware!).

Cheers,
Alan
 
Check this out:

http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-nsw-minchinbury-109483511

http://www.eldersrealestate.com.au/residential/buy/property-house-nsw-minchinbury-493927

As of now RP Data says:
Published Date Sale Type Listed Price Days on Market Agency
18 Oct 2011 current $635,000 208
12 May 12 Normal Sale 635000 Elders Real Estate - Rooty Hill
12 May 12 Normal Sale 635000 Astro Real Estate - Blacktown

In fact both Astro listed it from 8th Feb and Elders from 21st April (not sure if RPData resricts the "listing date"

Does this seem familiar?
 
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Hi Brendon
I think I may have spoken with this agent. Is it an Indian lady? I found her contact details on Gumtree and realised it's an agent advertising on Gumtree as many do. So I told her what I was after thinking she might be an agent who wants to make deals happen - win for me if I get a nice deal. The next morning after we spoke she emailed me about a house in Minchinbury for $600k by a local agent (Elders), has a market appraisal of $630k BUT since the vendor is her friend she can sell it to me for $565k. She also said that this property is under instructions to sell in the next 4 days. When I checked it on RP Data it had been on the market for 200 days by 'Astro' and 'Elders'...

I didn't get why she thought the other person is a fool (but then most agents think that). Her communication was okay via email but there was a desperation to sell. She wanted me to see the property the same day. I wasn't going to buy it anyway as I'd buy 3 IPs with that sort if money.....and the RP data Val (although dud) didn't appraise it more than $560k anyway.

Hi Ms Ali, I spoke on the phone initally then emailed an Indian man by the name of Abdal. He gave me the impression of being very unprofessional, aggressive and unscrupulous. At one stage he also tried to upsell me on another property they have on their books. Even after firmly telling him I am no longer interested he was still telling me he could make a good deal for me if I was quick.


^ ^ what he said. Standard resi zoning would allow for 2 occupancies at most.

Additionally Brendon, when you get a copy of the contract (which I assumed would be one of the first things you did ;)), check on the front page, who the selling agent is. If it is agent X - fine, deal only with them, (and cut off contact with agent Y). If agent X and agent Y in conjunction, then take your pick.

You don't want to get caught in the middle of a commision claim by both agents - and if you check the contract carefully, you'll see that most likley there is an obsure clause in there, where you as purchaser indemnifies the vendor against such claims (i.e. you get to pay selling agent comm - beware!).

Cheers,
Alan

An excellent point Alan that I did not focus on. Just checked and the vendor's agent was LJ Hooker. Looks like the vendor was given a better deal by Astor.
 
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