Advice from experienced bathroom renovators.

[beachside]

Hi all

Hoping some of the experienced renovators can give some advice, suggestions on a reno I intend to do to a small bathroom (no w/c) on a 1973 highset with timber floor. Doing work on this type of construction is a little new to me although I am reasonable handy. I could visit the various trade suppliers and pick their brains – or do it from in front of keyboard .

Current bathroom is original with half gyprock walls, half screw on panelling (laminate type) around bath and shower. Bath is normal size with a worn enamel spot at high end, separate shower has a base - see photos. Floor covering is worn lino tiles (asbestos).

I may just put down new lino tiles for now and possibly install a glass shower screen (which can be reused when I do a more extensive reno later). So if just doing vinyl floor tiles is there any reason I could not install over old tiles to save taking them up?

If I do a near full reno which would include new bath, replacing screw on wall panelling with the relevant wet wall sheeting, tiling to walls (not to ceiling height), cement sheeting for floor and ceramic floor tiles, I reckon I would probably get out of it for about $1500 reusing vanity (not original) and shower base.

Apart from needing help lifting bath, can anyone see any problems I may experience. I have not previously installed wall sheeting (other than some minor gyprock repairs), waterproofed floor or wall prior to tiling, replaced a bath or waste plumbing. (But as I said I am reasonably handy) Most cornice will have to be removed also. I don’t think there is a floor waste so may install one (plenty of room under house to work). For fall on tiled floor…….may just build up slight fall with tile cement or trowel a thick self levelling mix on outer sides – floor only about 2.4m x 1.5m at widest.

Possible problems I can see:
 New wall sheeting may be a different thickness to gyprock which meets mid wall (vertical edge).
 New bath may have different dimension particularly height – and have to be built up under for support.

The cost of doing near full reno is not expensive compared to value added, so cost is not an issue, just time due to venturing into some new territory and working alone.

As a compromise in every way I could leave bath in place and try to patch wear spot at one end (reasonable condition otherwise). Not over keen on respraying and too expensive for doubtful durability. I suppose I may also be able to tile over existing screw on wall sheeting and paint balance above tiles assuming I can overcome screw heads and joiner strips - just a wild idea!
Or……., have a play with White Knight and Tub and Tile as others have done. May also be able to paint apricot acrylic vanity white.

Any thoughts or suggestions on any or all of the above, advice on materials etc? I am looking for a good degree of durability and appearance, not a temporary quick fix.

On a slightly different topic, can anyone in Brisbane suggest some good places to buy cheap kitchens on the northside? I have a few S/H building supply companies to check out and an auction company. (Want something better than the basic stuff at Bunnings – which looks cheap) Should be able to get a good package without appliances for under $2000 new, or less for S/H.

See photos shower/floor , bath.

Thanks

 

[wylie]

Don't know about the asbestos floor, would be inclined to tile over it, but someone else may help with that. If you call a tiler, they will give you an idea of what to do.

I would replace the bath with an acrylic one because you don't want nice new tiles and have a chipped bath, it will spoil the look, not to mention that you will have to replace it later and do the walls again

I would replace the bath, sheet the walls either to the ceiling or a good height. If the plaster and tile end up being different thickness it should be easily concealed by the last tile (either a trim tile or normal tile) which will be up high anyway. We usually edge the tiled area with either a trim tile or timber trim.

I'd go all white to keep it timeless.

I would definitely not try to paint an old vanity. I would buy a simple white pedestal or modern vanity, depending on the look you want. We have had baths and basins re-surfaced and it doesn't last, and costs more than buying new.

Wylie

 

[pulse]

Rip out the whole lot, it will let you get the wiring and plumbing in the right spots. Flooring should be 15mm FC sheeting. Visit the james hardie of CSR websites for the construction manuals.

Cheers
Pulse

 

[beachside]

Thanks Wylie and pulse for replies, a bit light on response from people considering the the level of experience on this forum. Perhaps I should offer people a bigger stage so they can gain greater exposure by getting involved in this thread, or turn the thread into a useless debate that does not benefit anyone, just supplies a soapbox for those who like to express their opinions.

Wylie, if replacing bath I would have replaced with steel, but after thinking about a comment I read elsewhere an acrylic one may be better because it can't be ruined by chipping enamel. I have always been concerned with acrylic scratching, but I guess the least of the two evils. The possible difference in gyprock thickness at join between old and new is vertical. ceiling to floor - clarified this.

Pulse, ripping everything out would be going a bit too far and I would not have time - although I would do this if living there. But you have given me thought about removing thin wall forming one side of shower and replacing with shower screen.

 

[handyandy]

Pulse, ripping everything out would be going a bit too far and I would not have time - although I would do this if living there. But you have given me thought about removing thin wall forming one side of shower and replacing with shower screen.

I would vote for ripping everything out. All the problems you mention relate to working around the negligeble things that would be left (like the gyprock to the ceiling). If you do want to leave gyprock at the top then this is 10mm thick villaboard type products are between 4-7mm plus the tiles will actually end up thicker than the 10mm gyprock you could use 12mm which will be closer but in any case there will be a join that you will have to dress up. My personal preference is to go to ceiling with tiles and then find some cheap border tiles to give the bathroom a lift.

All things considered there is very little to gain whilst the tenant is in place apart from heartache and impossible deadlines. (the same for the kitchen) If its not tenanted then you could still do a full bathroom reno by first renoing the shower area using the bath as both bath and shower and then finally knocking out the bath etc.

Cheers

 

[see_change]

I'd also vote for the ripping everything out.

We've had three bathrooms reno'ed in the last year while living in the house ,so I saw what was being done though I didn't do anything except paint.

Simple things like the walls won't be square , so you have problems with tiling etc. and if the fittings are different sizes you'll spend more time trying to reuse things that don't give you the perfect finish.

Having seen what it took to get things perfect , I wouldn't try it myself but I'm not that handy ( though I do live there ....)

Cliff

 

[beachside]

Thanks Cliff and Andy. If my PPOR or a a reasonably good house worthwhile going the whole hog on I would do a full refit. But for a very average highset chamferboard it is probably going too far. I want to get in and out in 2 weeks while vacant, which I would not be confident in doing on a first attempt. Kitchen is not much more than a days work all up which can be done between things drying in the bathroom - once I find one.

Re the walls not being square - good point as I can't tell with no tiles there at the moment. How is this rectified - packing the new walls out from the studs?

If replacing any of the walls I realise the cornice will have to come off and I would be sheeting full height to ceiling - then replace/renew cornice. I am not contemplating only going half way up wall if that is where you have the impression the edge between old and new is. Join would be vertical, and if different thickness I can remove remaining old back to next wall corner so complete wall sheeting is new.

I was not contemplating removing the shower base - which I assume is enamelled metal, but I'm now wondering if replacing the current screw on laminate type sheeting with villaboard and then tiling - this all my overlap the edge of the shower base too much. Does anyone know how thich the laminate type sheeting is - I would guess at only 3mm max.

I'm beginning to think that I either go all the way or just do a tart up of what is there for best compromise between increased rental, time and cost, then do full reno later when I am better prepared.

 

[ani]

If you are just after a quick tart up, I'd just paint over the laminate in white. paint the rest of the walls and White Knight the bath. Put in a fresh basin.

I use Resene Waterborne Smooth Surface Sealer on the laminate then paint as normal. I used it on the laminate in 4 showers and 2 kitchens 3 years ago and it still looks great.

 

[beachside]

Ani - great! Just what I was looking for in advice for the tart up option if I go that way!

Is the Resene Waterborne Smooth Surface Sealer readily available. The laminate is not just around the bath, it lines the shower and is full height from ceiling to floor/bath etc. Wouldn't you have to use a special paint even if primed with Resene - like White Knight etc. I assume the paint bonds just as well to the aluminium edges and corners.

Re vanity, the current one is not bad so I thought it may benefit from facelift - aka White Knight as I read someone else do with good results. See photo. A bit of paint would be cheaper than replacement at even a couple of hundred bucks - or am I wrong.

thanks

 

[karina]

Hi Beachside,

Do you expect to get a lot more in rent if you reno the bathroom and kitchen? Maybe worth putting a tenant in as is. From the pics I saw the place didn´t look to bad on the inside? I like to keep things simple!

 

[beachside]

Karina..........Ohhhhhh yes!!!!!

The kitchen is past its use by date twice over - missing doors, stuffed benchtop.....original.

The kitchen is so easy and cheap to replace, can almost do with eyes closed and one hand behind my back - unless I have to replace some gyprock when removing splashback tiles, but still not a big hassle. It will probably take me 10times longer to find a good s/h kitchen or a cheap kitchen supplier in Brissy (like Paradise in Sydney) than it will to pull out and replace. This will definately increase rental and desirability.....although in the tight rental market anything will rent. When getting and insurance quote the other day the girl I was speaking to asked where the house was .....was interested in renting it if in her area - which it wasn't.

Bathroom - would be quite acceptable as is other than new floor tiles. Tarting it up will not cost much and will improve overall appearance and rentability. Doing a full bathroom reno will increase value, rental etc but not to the same extent as a quick tart up (value for $), hence my preferance for this if possible, at least for now. Improving the appearance will hopefully get better respect from tenant than leaving as is - which may give the impression I don't care about the place and therefore asking for same in return.

Kitchen photo.

 

[arms]

Karina..........Ohhhhhh yes!!!!!

The kitchen is past its use by date twice over - missing doors, stuffed benchtop.....original.



even if i were to do this as a paying job ,i would allow at least 3 weeks work ,unknown problems ,cracked plumbing,uneven flooring and walls ,etc,etc .
do a simply makeover on the bathroom( you are only there for a short time )
gut the kitchen and put your time into that ,even then 2 weeks is unrealistic

 

[beachside]

G'day Arms

I have previously:
* designed and drawn up plans for a new kitchen in my unit - relocating stove and oven
* removed old kitchen
* rectified uneven floor surface by so called expert laying self leveling cement over concrete spalling repair.
* installed new kitchen
* layed new floor tiles through kitchen and laundry
* installed new kitchen splashback tiles (note: never install 50mm tile again)

Apart from the wall tiles (good quality but not not same dimensions each way ) this was meditation for me. Admitedly this was in a double brick building where I could drill where I liked and not have to look for a stud, but if I can cut a hole in brickwork internally and externally and be within 5mm when linking to fit exhaust ducting - I ain't too bad!

I also routed waste plumbing as close as possible to wall and under shelf to avoid taking up space as per original plumbing - brilliant result if I so so myself.

Kitchen is small, basic L shape with a kick back on one end. No probs! The only issues I may have to outsource is any cutting/adjusting and joining of benchtop (laminate or granite) to fit any non square issues in adjoining walls.

 

[arms]

G'day Arms


* installed new kitchen splashback tiles (note: never install 50mm tile again)

seems to me that you have the kitchen covered so i say go for it ,by the way i draem of glorious 50mm tiles after doing a floor in 25mm mosaics