Building a PPOR in Perth

[HiEquity]

Hi guys and gals

We are staring down the barrel of building a large custom designed double storey PPOR in Perth to capture views etc. I'm looking for ideas on how to go about it. Some of the options seem to be:

- Go to a few of the majors and let them design something up for you but they keep copyright. Select whatever looks best and go forwards.
- Find a builder / designer combo who is well regarded and just entrust it all to them and hope they won't rip you off.
- Find an architect / designer you like who looks like they might know what they are doing, take them through working drawings, planning and engineering and keep copyright to the plans and then tender to a few builders yourself.
- Use a building broker to assist with the process but get constrained to the builders in their stable.
- Just go to Giorgi and resign yourself to working for another couple of decades to pay it all off...

I know there are a few people around here who have built a bit of stuff in Perth lately so I thought I would put it out there and see what the brains trust thinks?

 

[Aaron_C]

If you were going to build something custom then surely you wouldn't go to a spec builder?

 

[Singo]

- Find an architect / designer you like who looks like they might know what they are doing, take them through working drawings, planning and engineering and keep copyright to the plans and then tender to a few builders yourself.

I reckon this is a good option.

 

[Colin Rice]

- Find an architect / designer you like who looks like they might know what they are doing, take them through working drawings, planning and engineering and keep copyright to the plans and then tender to a few builders yourself.
- Use a building broker to assist with the process but get constrained to the builders in their stable.

I have built two units on an R40 based on a recommendation from a real estate agent who built with them. The builder recommended the designer and I owned the drawings. All went well and even moved in to one of the units 4 weeks before it was finished. Couldnt do that with one of the bigger players

Building Broker option would be worth considering as it will cost you nothing but some of your time. Even if you didn't proceed you will learn something worth while. I can recommend a few that I know of who are experienced & reputable with a long industry record.

 

[westminster]

Hi guys and gals

We are staring down the barrel of building a large custom designed double storey PPOR in Perth to capture views etc. I'm looking for ideas on how to go about it. Some of the options seem to be:

I know there are a few people around here who have built a bit of stuff in Perth lately so I thought I would put it out there and see what the brains trust thinks?

I suppose budget plays a big part but I assume custom large and two storey are my budget clues.
I'm not fussed on copy right as long as I can find a designer ( in house or out) who can understand requirements and translate that into something that is what you want.
I have had a friend who had an awesome experience building with Webb Browne Neaves

Me? Well I'd probably use my builder that I use for my developments as we have built that level of trust, they understand the way my brain works, my builders wife is fab at going over my plans for another female perspective to make sure it's liveable etc

I see no harm in going to a few nice spec builders and seeing what they come up with for your block.

If that doesn't work then I'd go designer and quotes.

 

[MTR]

Hi guys and gals

We are staring down the barrel of building a large custom designed double storey PPOR in Perth to capture views etc. I'm looking for ideas on how to go about it. Some of the options seem to be:

- Go to a few of the majors and let them design something up for you but they keep copyright. Select whatever looks best and go forwards.
- Find a builder / designer combo who is well regarded and just entrust it all to them and hope they won't rip you off.
- Find an architect / designer you like who looks like they might know what they are doing, take them through working drawings, planning and engineering and keep copyright to the plans and then tender to a few builders yourself.
- Use a building broker to assist with the process but get constrained to the builders in their stable.
- Just go to Giorgi and resign yourself to working for another couple of decades to pay it all off...

I know there are a few people around here who have built a bit of stuff in Perth lately so I thought I would put it out there and see what the brains trust thinks?

Very exciting stuff good for you.

As you have views I would go with- find a designer that looks like he knows what he is doing and tender it out. I would prefer a designer over architect to keep the costs down.

As WM mentioned also would not hurt to get quotes from spec builders, though from my recent experience was disappointed with their plans and organised my own, I know end value of build will be much higher because the design is superior and maximised the block's potential.

MTR

 

[Joe D]

HE

I suggest driving your suburb (given the sloping terrain) and picking out a few new house builds which you like and which are located on blocks similar to your own. (orientation, block size, frontage etc).

Then get details from council on who built them and approach the companies directly. Given they have already been built on similar locations you should be able to get a good idea on costs without any major surprises.

Starting with an architect from scratch is a long expensive option but would be the better option if you know exactly what you want and must have specific requirements.

 

[MTR]

HE

I suggest driving your suburb (given the sloping terrain) and picking out a few new house builds which you like and which are located on blocks similar to your own. (orientation, block size, frontage etc).

Then get details from council on who built them and approach the companies directly. Given they have already been built on similar locations you should be able to get a good idea on costs without any major surprises.

Starting with an architect from scratch is a long expensive option but would be the better option if you know exactly what you want and must have specific requirements.

Yep, starting with an architect, long expensive process, BIL just did this, I guestimate paid 50% more than I would have paid, they charge like wounded bull

 

[HiEquity]

Thank you everyone - much appreciated. It's good to get a few ideas as well as some confirmation that we might be on the right track. It seems a lot of money can be spent in this exercise without necessarily having a lot to show for it.

On the building brokers this seems like an attractive option but you are pretty well limited to their stable of builders who seem to be small builders using the broker as the front end sales agent for their business/es. A bit different to mortgage brokers who have access to 90%+ of the banks on the market.

Off to do some more research... almost none of which can be done online. This industry is completely opaque to outside research - the only way to find anything out is in the flesh.

 

[westminster]

If you have any inkling towards Solar Passive then we did use Griff Morris many years ago and found him great. Really down to earth, had some great ideas and I really enjoyed the experience.

http://www.solardwellings.com.au/about-us/our-team/griff-morris

 

[HiEquity]

Thanks WM. We are definitely interested in a solar passive design. As we are near the beach and have a pool, we are hoping to do without air conditioning, which is the biggest energy user in most homes. Fans will be the go - generations before us made do in houses far less insulated...

Griff was on our list to speak to. I hesitated though cos I know he is an architect! Hopefully he doesn't charge like most of them, although I suspect he does. But if it means we can get a practical and comfortable light filled home without needing air conditioners, I wouldn't mind paying a bit. Not so keen on paying for a work of art though!

 

[westminster]

Thanks WM. We are definitely interested in a solar passive design. As we are near the beach and have a pool, we are hoping to do without air conditioning, which is the biggest energy user in most homes. Fans will be the go - generations before us made do in houses far less insulated...

Griff was on our list to speak to. I hesitated though cos I know he is an architect! Hopefully he doesn't charge like most of them, although I suspect he does. But if it means we can get a practical and comfortable light filled home without needing air conditioners, I wouldn't mind paying a bit. Not so keen on paying for a work of art though!

He was brilliant and he even will take on clients who are building with spec builders and help them change the design to make it passive and then send them back to their spec builder.
This was 10 years ago but I'm sure he's still the same and not about designing a stupid work of art.

 

[MTR]

Thanks WM. We are definitely interested in a solar passive design. As we are near the beach and have a pool, we are hoping to do without air conditioning, which is the biggest energy user in most homes. Fans will be the go - generations before us made do in houses far less insulated...

Griff was on our list to speak to. I hesitated though cos I know he is an architect! Hopefully he doesn't charge like most of them, although I suspect he does. But if it means we can get a practical and comfortable light filled home without needing air conditioners, I wouldn't mind paying a bit. Not so keen on paying for a work of art though!

My BIL employed architect to build solar passive home and he came highly recommended, their house is north-facing, high mass, summer eaves shading, maximum roof and wall insulation, living areas on the north etc.
22 degrees all year around NOT.

We can not go over in summer because the house is too hot, they spend time at the shopping centres to get away from the heat, they have blinds wrapped around the house now, looks totally ridiculous, did I mention they paid about an extra $250,000 for this and now they need ducted aircon.

My g/friend who designs, develops and completes fit outs for commercial buildings told me that if you want to pay a premium mention the word "solar passive design" plenty of professionals ready to rip people off.

One of the SS members has a caption below his name, I love it "tread carefully and carry a fish"

MTR

 

[HiEquity]

Fair enough MTR - thanks for that feedback. We will be putting ducting in for air con and may well go for an evaporative system, which probably reduces the number of uncomfortable days to a week per year and hardly uses any power. Passive solar seems to be a lot better at keeping winter heat in than summer heat out - especially on those weeks where it doesn't cool down at night, which is when the thermal mass works against you. But if we can do without winter heating while staying comfortable that would be a win...

 

[MTR]

We have refrigerated ducting now, very expensive to run, prior to this had evaporative much more cost effective but of course when humidity is high its not effective.

 

[Ausprop]

I love evap, am not sure why people insist on putting in refrigerate. In a 2 storey house heating and cooling will be difficult, throw in west facing and it's all the red flags.

west facing 2 storey macmansion - doesn't sound very green at all

so.. why wouldn't you jut go to w&b, Oswald, riverstone?

here's one from experience, built a 2 storey architect home that cost a bundle. next door built a w& b home. similar attributes. do you think REAs and buyers gave a stuff about the design, the architecture, the thickness of my slab vs. next door? It's all about sqm and number of bedrooms. Whoever sells the cheapest and biggest value meals gets the customers

 

[sanj]

MTR - imo all that confirms is that the architect didnt do a good job, doesnt mean the concept is a bad one imo. I went to quite a few homes during the recent sustainable open house day and you can certainly see where passive solar design done well can make a big difference.

I do find the massive distrust of architects on here a bit odd, like any profession there will be good and bad ones.

HE - if youre looking at Giorgi then obviously youve got a fairly signficant budget. With that in mind it may be worth at least chatting to a couple of architects, there are a fair few good ones in Perth. Joe Chindarsi and Iredale Pederson Hook come to mind but again it all depends on what youre going for.

IMO building brokers are a bad idea for a luxury home like this with prob a $2-$3m end value as theyre prob more suited to smaller, cheaper builds although i could be wrong.

Of course Giorgi also do a pretty great product, i would certainly be seeing them before someone like Zorzi who imo build luxurious but boring products. Weststyle have also built a few interesting homes recently, maybe check them out.

How big is your site? Is it possible to go with a single storey home instead of double? you can get a quite outstanding, quality single storey home that is architecturally outstanding for cheaper than a meh W&B double storey home with all the fruit that looks like hundreds of other homes out there. although to contradict myself i did go through a W&B home in churchlands green recently that was quite nice, i think as displayed it was around $1.2m but it did include a fair few significant upgrades.

 

[MTR]

I love evap, am not sure why people insist on putting in refrigerate. In a 2 storey house heating and cooling will be difficult, throw in west facing and it's all the red flags.

west facing 2 storey macmansion - doesn't sound very green at all

so.. why wouldn't you jut go to w&b, Oswald, riverstone?

here's one from experience, built a 2 storey architect home that cost a bundle. next door built a w& b home. similar attributes. do you think REAs and buyers gave a stuff about the design, the architecture, the thickness of my slab vs. next door? It's all about sqm and number of bedrooms. Whoever sells the cheapest and biggest value meals gets the customers

I would not say No to evap that is for sure, I nearly die when I receive my electricity bill with refrig.

Also my relatives built with APG apparently they build the cheapest double storey, have no idea... anyway their homes look great, they made sure included higher specs, the houses are in nice areas of North Beach, around $300,000 mark but that was around 4 years ago.

 

[MTR]

MTR - imo all that confirms is that the architect didnt do a good job, doesnt mean the concept is a bad one.

Hi Sanj
Perhaps but I don't think so, architect been doing it for years and came recommended, don't know what went wrong. Its certainly not chicken feed.

I do not have an issue with architects whatsoever, I just would not pay their hourly rate.

MTR

 

[Ausprop]

Also my relatives built with APG apparently they build the cheapest double storey, have no idea... anyway their homes look great, they made sure included higher specs, the houses are in nice areas of North Beach, around $300,000 mark but that was around 4 years ago.

interesting - I love their homes but their pricing looks too good to be true. how is the second storey slab - much sound transmission from top to bottom? are they happy over all?