Sim , you had to be the one sim , didn't you ..
see change
see change
Bust and then what....????
- Thread starter Harris
- Start date
I must tell the truth, I have worn tie's on a few occasions, the most memorable being my meeting with the Governor of the Bank of England, and again with the MD of the CBA in Sydney, and I suppose I should include my Wedding
However, back to property investing from Singapore, One point struck me about using Singaporean Dollars to invest here is AUS
Because of the changing value of currency, they would also gain from the conversion rates.
ie: 486,000 SGD's (singapore dollars) would have bought a $500,000 property in Jan 2003, if that property sold today for a 10% increase ie: $550,000, and then was converted back to SGD's it would realise 621,000 SGD. A 28% rise, from a 10% property rise.
No wonder the Singaporeans are smiling at Australian property.
However, back to property investing from Singapore, One point struck me about using Singaporean Dollars to invest here is AUS
Because of the changing value of currency, they would also gain from the conversion rates.
ie: 486,000 SGD's (singapore dollars) would have bought a $500,000 property in Jan 2003, if that property sold today for a 10% increase ie: $550,000, and then was converted back to SGD's it would realise 621,000 SGD. A 28% rise, from a 10% property rise.
No wonder the Singaporeans are smiling at Australian property.
Ok, now we are reallly getting off topic and getting invoved with word play
Being a professional and acting professional are in my opinion the exactly the same thing. Unfortunately society doesn't accept this.
IMHO You are a professional because you act professional and you behave as a professional. I think MB364 is saying having a "professional" job is not the same as being a professional. ie. I have had the unfortunate experience of being treated by unprofessional (stupid and uncaring ) doctors.
Now this then brings into focus what is professional? what does it look like. Naturally IMHO "not wearing a tie" has zero to do with being professional. I wonder if the forum's resident accountant here, DaleGG puts on a grey suit before sitting at a keyboard and entering any reply to this forum?
Professional is a person who takes responsiblity for outcomes, takes a personal interest in there own training/knowledge to upgrade their skills, trustworthy, dependable and has demostrated skills and experience in their area of experitize.
How can we tell what is a characteristic of a professional, ask the question "If I took that characteristic away, would a person be diminished as a professional ?".
Take the Winsor knotted tie away from a business man and he can still be professional still be 100% effective. Take away trustworthiness and the business man is diminished as a professional. If Sim quit his job from IBM and started work for SAP, would he be diminished as a professional? If a doctor stopped work as a doctor and started work as a bricklayer, the professional characteristic she showed as a doctor (or not) would carry over to the new job. A professional is not the job, it is not the environment, it is the person!
BTW Strange but true this Dilbert comic hit my inbox today.
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Dear ABCDiamond,
1. I can fully agree with your views.
2. However, I understand that Malaysians have already replaced Singaporeans as the biggest investors group in the Goldcoast property market this year.
3. Given the present economic recession and negative home equity situation in Singapore, not too many of my fellow Singaporeans are thinking about investing in properties at this point in time, let alone investing into the Australian property market. Majority of them either lack the cashflow or the courage to do so, at this point in time but when the Singapore economy and property market starts to pick up again, I have no doubt that I can see more Singaporeans investing into the Australian property market in the near future.
4. Returns on the Singapore property market in the past has been very attractive too, as compared to the Australian property market. I bought my own 5-room HDB flat for S$100,000 in 1987 and sold it off for S$530,000 in 1997. Between 1995 to 1997 alone during its peaking years, the same $100,000 HDB flat price increased by more than S$20,000 per quarter or S$80,000-$100,000 per year. This is comparable to the same price increase I have seen for my own 2 IP houses in the Goldcoast year during the last 24 months.
5. So, do you want to invest in our Singapore property market, ADCDiamond? You are most welcome to do so, together with the other interested members..
6...But please do your own independant research and due diligence before investing.... Despite what you may read in the Singapore Business Times newspapers recently, which has recommended investors to start investing into the Singapore property market now, personally, I think that there is some more room for the Singapore property market to further bottom out first before it will really start to recover back. Our PM GOH Chok Tong and the Govt have just told Singaporeans that they need to take more pay and CPF cuts in order to save their jobs during this year's National Day Rally Speech, just 2 Sundays ago.
7. For your update amd kind consideration,please.
8. Thank you
Regards,
Kenkoh2000
Hi
Still a good thread, even though it is deviating somewhat from the original, but someone pushed the wrong button.
Ties.!
The most useless invention in the history of man. I read an article years ago 2 pages long, relating how useless the piece of material is, that you tie around your neck, and the sad thing is, I lost the article.
There is no-one that can convince me that a person will work better, be more productive, or be more professional, just because he has a piece of pretty material tied to his throat. Not even the Boss of the company I work for who walks around H.O. without a tie. You guessed it. It basically is a condition of employement that I wear a tie. Have done for nearly 30 years. My rant now finished.
AL
. "Being a professional and acting professional are mutally exclusive."
Speaking of word play, I would think the difference is "acting" just my opinion
jahn
Still a good thread, even though it is deviating somewhat from the original, but someone pushed the wrong button.
Ties.!
The most useless invention in the history of man. I read an article years ago 2 pages long, relating how useless the piece of material is, that you tie around your neck, and the sad thing is, I lost the article.
There is no-one that can convince me that a person will work better, be more productive, or be more professional, just because he has a piece of pretty material tied to his throat. Not even the Boss of the company I work for who walks around H.O. without a tie. You guessed it. It basically is a condition of employement that I wear a tie. Have done for nearly 30 years. My rant now finished.
AL
. "Being a professional and acting professional are mutally exclusive."
Speaking of word play, I would think the difference is "acting" just my opinion
jahn
Hi
Back to the original post
There is a good article in this months API magazine, and it would seem like the same topic that has been discussed here.
Interesting reading. The author does make a comment that the "RBA and other market commentators only rarely distinguish between relatively stable and high- risk sectors of the residential property market", and also comments - "it is incumbent on market analysts to provide a properly differentiated critique of market sectors - clearly not all residential property performs uniformly or has the same risk profile."
Food for thought .
jahn
Back to the original post
There is a good article in this months API magazine, and it would seem like the same topic that has been discussed here.
Interesting reading. The author does make a comment that the "RBA and other market commentators only rarely distinguish between relatively stable and high- risk sectors of the residential property market", and also comments - "it is incumbent on market analysts to provide a properly differentiated critique of market sectors - clearly not all residential property performs uniformly or has the same risk profile."
Food for thought .
jahn
After 2 hours of reading this thread from the begining, I am now too tired to post.
However I do know a Dentist who has purchased 18Million in property in sydney this year alone
Regards
Investor
PS. Alot has been said about sydney being in correction NOW, apart from some people, mainly from overseas, buying OTP with a deposit bond and not being able to complete on settlement, can anyone show me some proof of a market correction in inner sydney appartments even ?
However I do know a Dentist who has purchased 18Million in property in sydney this year alone
Regards
Investor
PS. Alot has been said about sydney being in correction NOW, apart from some people, mainly from overseas, buying OTP with a deposit bond and not being able to complete on settlement, can anyone show me some proof of a market correction in inner sydney appartments even ?
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Bear in mind sample size of 1 here.
A colleague was looking at this 2br aprt in Darlinghurst
http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bin/rsearch?id=1886695&a=qfp&t=res&submit.x=14&submit.y=9
It had a price tag of $520K at the end of July. I suggested they wait a bit. by the 8th August it had been reduced to $495K and just had a look a few days back and its now $470K.
I know this happens a lot anyway. You naturally try to get the best price first thing on the off chance of panic buyers.
But for the past few years a lot were actually getting that price and this is what makes up "median prices".
If its taking a little longer to sell you would expect that the buyers have that little bit more negotiating power to knock that 5 -10% off.
I wouldnt be surprised to hear median prices are starting to fall a little soon.
A colleague was looking at this 2br aprt in Darlinghurst
http://www.realestate.com.au/cgi-bin/rsearch?id=1886695&a=qfp&t=res&submit.x=14&submit.y=9
It had a price tag of $520K at the end of July. I suggested they wait a bit. by the 8th August it had been reduced to $495K and just had a look a few days back and its now $470K.
I know this happens a lot anyway. You naturally try to get the best price first thing on the off chance of panic buyers.
But for the past few years a lot were actually getting that price and this is what makes up "median prices".
If its taking a little longer to sell you would expect that the buyers have that little bit more negotiating power to knock that 5 -10% off.
I wouldnt be surprised to hear median prices are starting to fall a little soon.
LB,
A lot of times it is these sort of buyers
that buy OTP and sell before settlement
to try & make a profit
They know that they can't afford to settle anyway
thats why now they panic
Rather than go bankcrupt
they rather drop their prices
I know a few people who buys direct from the developer at discount prices and with Capital Growth all of a sudden they make over 100K in less than 12 mths and they will try to sell and make a profit just before settlement
Let me give you an example,
A flipper buys a 2 b/r apt directly from the Developer at 420K
When it comes to settlement he knows that he can't settle so he try to sell it at what the market price is which is 520K
NO SALE
Drop to 495K
Still NO SALE
Drop to 470K
Still waiting
He is still making a profit but you don't know that till you find out
LB unless you are one of them as i mention above
If not
Why the hell do you bother about the prices so much
If you were to
buy and hold for the long term LB
LB i still don't get the point here of what are you worrying about???
Let me use my brain and see if i got this right LB
You are a Doctor
and you don't worry much about money at all
You must be in private banking ( only high net worth over 2 mil plus ) like yourself
You drive a car which is worth over 50K
You live in a very nice house
You have a very good peer group that you talk to
who are high net worth individual as well
Your age is about 50 or close to it
You are a conservative investor
If i were to say anything that is wrong above please tell me LB?
Have you ever not let all this minor things worry you
Do you know what your life would be like?
Have you ever take your partner to a surprised trip and just not worry about it all and just LET GO
What is really important to you LB?
If you know how to make the money back just as quick as you lose it
would you worry about the minor price drop?
Regards
Jerry
A lot of times it is these sort of buyers
that buy OTP and sell before settlement
to try & make a profit
They know that they can't afford to settle anyway
thats why now they panic
Rather than go bankcrupt
they rather drop their prices
I know a few people who buys direct from the developer at discount prices and with Capital Growth all of a sudden they make over 100K in less than 12 mths and they will try to sell and make a profit just before settlement
Let me give you an example,
A flipper buys a 2 b/r apt directly from the Developer at 420K
When it comes to settlement he knows that he can't settle so he try to sell it at what the market price is which is 520K
NO SALE
Drop to 495K
Still NO SALE
Drop to 470K
Still waiting
He is still making a profit but you don't know that till you find out
LB unless you are one of them as i mention above
If not
Why the hell do you bother about the prices so much
If you were to
buy and hold for the long term LB
LB i still don't get the point here of what are you worrying about???
Let me use my brain and see if i got this right LB
You are a Doctor
and you don't worry much about money at all
You must be in private banking ( only high net worth over 2 mil plus ) like yourself
You drive a car which is worth over 50K
You live in a very nice house
You have a very good peer group that you talk to
who are high net worth individual as well
Your age is about 50 or close to it
You are a conservative investor
If i were to say anything that is wrong above please tell me LB?
Have you ever not let all this minor things worry you
Do you know what your life would be like?
Have you ever take your partner to a surprised trip and just not worry about it all and just LET GO
What is really important to you LB?
If you know how to make the money back just as quick as you lose it
would you worry about the minor price drop?
Regards
Jerry
sample size 2
LB BEAR IN MIND SAMPLE SIZE 2!
Residential land 800sqs .
Land price $235k purchased 2/6/03. I sugested that the owner should hold on to it instead of making a quick $20k for a fortnights work. But he said no "we are at the high side now"
So he sold it.
New buyer than did the same,,,,, 3/7/03 $268k.
And as it hurts my mate,, (who is reading this ) the block just Re sold for a 3rd time in 9 weeks 22/8/03 for $310k.
Research tells me that the land will reach $400k by April 2004. Without an earthquake pending that is.
I can see this median price falling soon ,,,,,,,,,,,,,maybe 2009
OV
LB BEAR IN MIND SAMPLE SIZE 2!
Residential land 800sqs .
Land price $235k purchased 2/6/03. I sugested that the owner should hold on to it instead of making a quick $20k for a fortnights work. But he said no "we are at the high side now"
So he sold it.
New buyer than did the same,,,,, 3/7/03 $268k.
And as it hurts my mate,, (who is reading this ) the block just Re sold for a 3rd time in 9 weeks 22/8/03 for $310k.
Research tells me that the land will reach $400k by April 2004. Without an earthquake pending that is.
I can see this median price falling soon ,,,,,,,,,,,,,maybe 2009
OV
Jerry
I was just giving Investor some evidence as he asked for. It could be taken any way you want or ignored entirely. Ocean view also gave good eg. If everyone contributes what they experience we all learn. If only one side of story is given or we only believe what we want to beleive we do not see true picture.
Anyway, since you asked -
You are a Doctor -CORRECT
and you don't worry much about money at all - MONEY CAN BE CONVERTED TO FREEDOM AND TIME. WORRY WOULD NOT BE THE WORD I'D USE BUT I ENJOY MANAGING IT.
You must be in private banking ( only high net worth over 2 mil plus ) like yourself - NO
You drive a car which is worth over 50K - NO WAY! I COULD THINK OF PEOPLE THAT WOULD ENJOY 50k FAR BETTER THAN FOR ME TO WASTE IT ON A CAR. MY CAR COST $6k.
You live in a very nice house - I LIKE IT, BUT IT ISNT FLASH
You have a very good peer group that you talk to - WHO DOESN'T? IF YOU DONT LIKE YOUR FRIENDS GET NEW ONES. MY CLOSEST FRIENDS EARN B/W $35k AND $60k
who are high net worth individual as well - NOPE SORRY. JUST ORDINARY FOLKS
Your age is about 50 or close to it - TAKE OFF A DECADE AND THEN SOME.
You are a conservative investor - I LIKE TO THINK SO HOWEVER I HAVE LOST SOME VAST SUMS IN MY TIME. BUT I RARELY MAKE THE SAME MISTAKE TWICE (IE. DIVERSIFY!!)
Have you ever not let all this minor things worry you - DONT UNDERSTAND QUESTION.
Do you know what your life would be like? WHEN I COMPARE IT TO THE REST OF WORLD POPULATION MY WORRIES ARE MINOR.
Have you ever take your partner to a surprised trip and just not worry about it all and just LET GO. I SPEND 2 MONTHS A YEAR TRAVELLING TO PLACES SUCH AS INDIA, SRI LANKA, BANGLADESH ETC. I HIGHLY RECOMMEND IT TO THOSE WHO THINK THEY HAVE IT TOUGH.
What is really important to you LB? FULFILLING HIERARCHY OF NEEDS JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE. PROVIDING FOR FAMILY. CREATING ENOUGH WEALTH TO ALLOW ME TO DONATE MORE TIME TO CHARITABLE CAUSES.
If you know how to make the money back just as quick as you lose it
would you worry about the minor price drop?
IF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT the property market I would be worried about a small price drop. As this will inevitably lead to a large price drop and end in a recession that we dont need and dont 'have to have'.
CHEERS
L BERNHAM
I was just giving Investor some evidence as he asked for. It could be taken any way you want or ignored entirely. Ocean view also gave good eg. If everyone contributes what they experience we all learn. If only one side of story is given or we only believe what we want to beleive we do not see true picture.
Anyway, since you asked -
You are a Doctor -CORRECT
and you don't worry much about money at all - MONEY CAN BE CONVERTED TO FREEDOM AND TIME. WORRY WOULD NOT BE THE WORD I'D USE BUT I ENJOY MANAGING IT.
You must be in private banking ( only high net worth over 2 mil plus ) like yourself - NO
You drive a car which is worth over 50K - NO WAY! I COULD THINK OF PEOPLE THAT WOULD ENJOY 50k FAR BETTER THAN FOR ME TO WASTE IT ON A CAR. MY CAR COST $6k.
You live in a very nice house - I LIKE IT, BUT IT ISNT FLASH
You have a very good peer group that you talk to - WHO DOESN'T? IF YOU DONT LIKE YOUR FRIENDS GET NEW ONES. MY CLOSEST FRIENDS EARN B/W $35k AND $60k
who are high net worth individual as well - NOPE SORRY. JUST ORDINARY FOLKS
Your age is about 50 or close to it - TAKE OFF A DECADE AND THEN SOME.
You are a conservative investor - I LIKE TO THINK SO HOWEVER I HAVE LOST SOME VAST SUMS IN MY TIME. BUT I RARELY MAKE THE SAME MISTAKE TWICE (IE. DIVERSIFY!!)
Have you ever not let all this minor things worry you - DONT UNDERSTAND QUESTION.
Do you know what your life would be like? WHEN I COMPARE IT TO THE REST OF WORLD POPULATION MY WORRIES ARE MINOR.
Have you ever take your partner to a surprised trip and just not worry about it all and just LET GO. I SPEND 2 MONTHS A YEAR TRAVELLING TO PLACES SUCH AS INDIA, SRI LANKA, BANGLADESH ETC. I HIGHLY RECOMMEND IT TO THOSE WHO THINK THEY HAVE IT TOUGH.
What is really important to you LB? FULFILLING HIERARCHY OF NEEDS JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE. PROVIDING FOR FAMILY. CREATING ENOUGH WEALTH TO ALLOW ME TO DONATE MORE TIME TO CHARITABLE CAUSES.
If you know how to make the money back just as quick as you lose it
would you worry about the minor price drop?
IF YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT the property market I would be worried about a small price drop. As this will inevitably lead to a large price drop and end in a recession that we dont need and dont 'have to have'.
CHEERS
L BERNHAM
Hi all,
LB, I still think you need to look further than apartments. Here is my sample size of 1.
House on 585 sqm bought recently(settled last tues, I hope the figures on this one aren't too out of date for you) price $150,000 plus reno costs $15,000 plus purchase costs $6000, total $171,000. House in nearby street on 350 sqm( and busier road) sold at auction last week for $240,000. Both are californian bungalows similar distance to shops,beach,transport, schools etc.
You could say I'm happy
I don't think that this shows a reversal in prices just yet IN THIS AREA, FOR THIS TYPE OF PROPERTY.
If you haven't yet read Jan Somers book Story to Story, I think you should in regard to timing of the property market. If you were overextended on property at present, then it might be NEAR the time to take some profits. If you had 10 or 20 properties, and wished to reduce your loan size, it maybe time to take SOME profits. But if you only have 1 or 2 properties and can easily hold them(especially if they are houses with good land content in good location), then you are crazy to sell just because you have made a gain.( My opinion anyway).
bye
LB, I still think you need to look further than apartments. Here is my sample size of 1.
House on 585 sqm bought recently(settled last tues, I hope the figures on this one aren't too out of date for you) price $150,000 plus reno costs $15,000 plus purchase costs $6000, total $171,000. House in nearby street on 350 sqm( and busier road) sold at auction last week for $240,000. Both are californian bungalows similar distance to shops,beach,transport, schools etc.
You could say I'm happy
I don't think that this shows a reversal in prices just yet IN THIS AREA, FOR THIS TYPE OF PROPERTY.
If you haven't yet read Jan Somers book Story to Story, I think you should in regard to timing of the property market. If you were overextended on property at present, then it might be NEAR the time to take some profits. If you had 10 or 20 properties, and wished to reduce your loan size, it maybe time to take SOME profits. But if you only have 1 or 2 properties and can easily hold them(especially if they are houses with good land content in good location), then you are crazy to sell just because you have made a gain.( My opinion anyway).
bye
LB, I still think you need to look further than apartments.
Thanks, but the question was "can anyone show me some proof of a market correction in inner sydney appartments even "
congratulations on your recent sales.
It doesnt really show what the market has done in the last month or two though. Maybe had you sold in MAy you could have sold for more.
Who knows.
Thanks, but the question was "can anyone show me some proof of a market correction in inner sydney appartments even "
congratulations on your recent sales.
It doesnt really show what the market has done in the last month or two though. Maybe had you sold in MAy you could have sold for more.
Who knows.
Hi LB,
???? I'm not trying to answer anything about inner apartments, I'm still comenting on your general premise that property is going to go down and it is not a good time to buy. I have not sold anything, just bought.
bye
P.S. Your take on affordability(weeks to purchase) is only part of the equasion, looked at from the perspective of % of income to make interest payments, the picture is totally different. you pick your statistics, I'll pick mine
???? I'm not trying to answer anything about inner apartments, I'm still comenting on your general premise that property is going to go down and it is not a good time to buy. I have not sold anything, just bought.
bye
P.S. Your take on affordability(weeks to purchase) is only part of the equasion, looked at from the perspective of % of income to make interest payments, the picture is totally different. you pick your statistics, I'll pick mine
LB I'm on your side!!!
Well sort of . You don't have to answer questions like that from Jerry, just ignore them. It's too personal and none of anyone's business.
The theory of diversification is best summed up by 2 of the worlds best investors. Buffet says put all of your eggs in one basket and watct it like a hawk. Peter Lynch says to diversify is to diWORSEify results.
bye
Well sort of . You don't have to answer questions like that from Jerry, just ignore them. It's too personal and none of anyone's business.
The theory of diversification is best summed up by 2 of the worlds best investors. Buffet says put all of your eggs in one basket and watct it like a hawk. Peter Lynch says to diversify is to diWORSEify results.
bye
Hi LB,
I'm glad they are.
I still have concerns as to your negativety towards property at present, especially selected property(free standing houses on land in particular), when demand is great(population growing), rents are rising(in the areas that I look at), cap growth is "flying".
I keep coming back to the 2 possible risks,
1/ The risk of your scenario NOW ie significant drop in property prices, or
2/ Missing out on a significant boom in prices.
I agree that the risk in inner apartments is probably 1/, BUT other property it is most likely 2/.
MY preferred scenario is that there is a stabilisation in prices for the next few years, as inflation catches up with price movements(this is what has happened in the past, in this country, most of the time). In this case selling now would not be a good option because of taxes/costs and the next boom always starts unexpectedly. I will acknowledge that you don't always get what you want( to quote Mick Jagger).
bye
I'm glad they are.
I still have concerns as to your negativety towards property at present, especially selected property(free standing houses on land in particular), when demand is great(population growing), rents are rising(in the areas that I look at), cap growth is "flying".
I keep coming back to the 2 possible risks,
1/ The risk of your scenario NOW ie significant drop in property prices, or
2/ Missing out on a significant boom in prices.
I agree that the risk in inner apartments is probably 1/, BUT other property it is most likely 2/.
MY preferred scenario is that there is a stabilisation in prices for the next few years, as inflation catches up with price movements(this is what has happened in the past, in this country, most of the time). In this case selling now would not be a good option because of taxes/costs and the next boom always starts unexpectedly. I will acknowledge that you don't always get what you want( to quote Mick Jagger).
bye
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