Buying in Hong Kong

In my opinion, the market's a bit hot for my liking. As a poster said above, he's positively geared at 1.2% financing, but you can't get that financing any more.

Most financing deals are in the mid to high 2s now and yields have come down to very low 3s. Downpayment requirements are too high. 60% deposit for locals investing, 50% if you're not living there. 40% if you invest in over AUD$200k properties. There's no interest only loans.

In other words, it's a significant cash drain. You need to put in significant capital, there's tough restrictions on selling (via very high selling stamp duty), there's no cash coming in to your bank before you sell (because you can't do interest only loan). If you buy a AUD$500k apartment, you need to put down around AUD$300k downpayment to be cashflow neutral (post interest and compulsory repayments). If the apartment went up 20%, you gain $100k, which is a 30% return on your $300k. ROE of 30%.

If you put down 20% downpayment in Australia and are cashflow neutral, a 20% appreciation (which looks like its around the corner) means you've doubled your equity. ROE of 100%.

As usual, it's just a numbers game, and provided you take a certain view on currency (ie that it will stay flat in the foreseeable 24 months), the smart money is probably coming back. If you're not local, don't even bother to buy as you pay extra 15% stamp duty.

HK is worth revisiting when these silly stamp duties are scrapped. But most importantly, it's probably only worth revisiting when the banks relax lending standards (ie can gear at 90%). Another way to look at it is with A$300k, I can buy a relatively medicore A$500k apartment in HK (middle class) and that's it. When it booms (well it already has boomed a lot, but if it boomed more), I'll make a bit of money off a A$500k apartment. With the same money in Australia, I can buy a A$1.5m-A$2.0m house, and when it booms I can make more money. Both probably are neutral cashflow although the latter is more likely to be positive.
 
Mmm...the Apex Horizon hotel is actually a serviced apartment. The so-called rooms are 2 and 3-bedder suites, so it's tad more comfortable than sleeping in a car space. See link below for floorplans of the suites.

http://www.horizonhotels.com.hk/index_en.html

Looks like 80% of buyers are still going ahead with the deal even though the clauses don't look welcoming... the 2018 clause in particular could be very significant.

http://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/article/1158613/hotel-developments-buyers-undeterred-one-sided-deals?

It is the first time in Hong Kong that a developer has sold hotel suites, classified as commercial property, individually, allowing buyers to escape stamp duty. Some agents are also reported to have told buyers they can get around the law and live in the units themselves, while the hotel will return the rent they pay to comply with licence requirements.

===

The controversial sales have led to one law firm, one of three suggested to buyers by Cheung Kong, to issue a disclaimer stating that the firm will not be held liable should the buyer suffer any losses from the transaction.

HK is worth revisiting when these silly stamp duties are scrapped. But most importantly, it's probably only worth revisiting when the banks relax lending standards (ie can gear at 90%).

The HK market is too hot now so I'm sitting on the sidelines until govt interventions are wound back. I just hope the x-rate maintains ~HK$8 until then. Property junkies may be heading for Malaysia as HK measures shut down the fun of investing here.
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/eye-on-malaysia-as-hk-singapore-curb-property-investments

KUALA LUMPUR, Feb 19 — Iskandar Malaysia, Kota Kinabalu, Kuala Lumpur and Penang are set to become hotspots for foreign property investors as the Hong Kong and Singapore governments “cool” their respective overheated property industries.

Malaysia has become a preferred country for foreign property investors and is now the main focus after Hong Kong and Singapore imposed 15 per cent levies to slow down foreign investments that had overheated their property markets.

These “cooling” measures have shifted some of the surging demand for residential and other properties to Malaysia, including a Malaysian-Singapore joint-venture iconic wellness project to be launched in Iskandar Malaysia later today.
 
to give u an idea how crazy it is here last one i bought was 2011 in august around 1.5 years ago, I paid $400k AUD for a 410 square foot (yes square foot no meters) apartment, recent transaction prices are $640k AUD.

I've recently been looking at 350 sq ft apartments on Peng Chau selling for over $4,000 a sq ft. As you know that's gross so real internal size is probably closer to 280 sq ft (26 sq metres). I don't know if you're on the geo expats forum but have a look at this thread about small apartments:

http://hongkong.geoexpat.com/forum/155/thread256842.html

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If you're worried about currency, park your money in HK$ or US$ first and hold a yielding asset (eg a blue chip stock, hybrids, bonds etc). I wouldn't buy property just for the currency, as I could just do the second without doing the first.

The fundamentals of the property have to work, and while I can't really judge where the prices will go (ie I very much doubt HK will tank like most naysayers are hoping), the question is more how much more upside is left. At most the market will tank 10-15% in my very humble opinion as a lot of cash sitting on the sidelines will rush back in to the market, as long as China keeps getting richer and bankers/lawyers/doctors in HK continue to get paid HK$2m+ and keep their jobs.

That said, if you have no where to park your money any way, HK property is not too bad if you don't believe it'll tank. Just that I think there are better opportunities out there and in particular in Australia, given the high capital requirements in HK.
 
Hi Geoff
Sorry to say you are not correct
Not sure why grossrealisation has been closed but that's fine
What I have said before and will say again is it depends on the structure you use
You can invest in hk or For that matters he USA as long as your structure is correct
Yep not been here for a while but the question seem to be the same
It's great to try to work out how to invest
It's alot better to invest
Hope you all do well not sure how to get grossrealisation back working or will use grossreall
From my posts you know who I am
 
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