Cranky old *****

[Spades]

BTW my dog has a different relationship with Mr MTR, he is firm with the dogs. I'll keep working on it....

This is often the case with some owners MTR,where one partner is firm and the other is not...Be firm yourself,take a leaf from Mr.MTR...You will only confuse the pack order behaviour wise.Good luck

More info:http://www.unleashmagazine.com/health/training/item/232-establing-pecking-order-with-your-dog

Forget where but it was basically about dogs being a pack animal which is why they adapt so well to being with people.

Socialism is the key as they don't always adapt.Not only with humans but with other dogs as well

The gist of it was that a dog is never equal with anther dog (or person). They will seek to be dominant but will happily accept not being dominant. As long as it is unambiguous then they are happiest.

Correct

So they will dominate us over food, by sitting up high such as on furniture, by walking ahead of us instead of at our side when on the leash etc.

Correct

I think Rosie slotted herself in under the adults and but above the kids when she was very young. We fixed that by getting the girls to take the lead and be firm, the girls to feed her and feed her after we had eaten.

Patting a dog is actually counter productive. Ie a submissive dog will groom a more dominant dog but I drew the line at banning patting

Patting a dog is productive,when there behaved

But the key is to be firm. And consistent. A no in a low tone is perfect. A tone such as a mother dog might use to scold a puppy. Pointless talking to the dog. My gf will explain to Rosie that she doesn't like to share the couch with her, she will laugh and to Rosie it is a game. Whereas a low firm "get off" is what she needs and removes all confusion. Dogs are smart but they aren't people.Dogs are smarter than you give them credit,smarter than some humans i've met Sounds like an obvious statement but we all know folks who do the opposite and treat the animal like a child.

Exactly

This doesn't work with Lizzie's Dog.

Rosie being dominated by my young daughters .....

[/IMG]

Btw nice dog Simon...My dog was humped 5 times from a similiar breed and didn't bat an eyelid.

Ran into the same dog today...The other dog found a bone,my dog stole it ha ha without recourse.

 

[tobe]

I read something once ago about dogs that forever changed my relationship with them.

Forget where but it was basically about dogs being a pack animal which is why they adapt so well to being with people.

Cesar Millan.

And for food agression, you can try fighting with your dog, or poking them in the ribs, but you dont see many pack leaders do that in the wild.
At best they give a stern look, or maybe a growl. Why dont you try feeding from your hand, one piece of kibble at a time. The dog gets to understand they only eat at your whim, that you are the leader. After hand feeding for a while, feed half by hand, then put the rest in the bowl, and then take the bowl away, give it back, take some kibble out of the bowl, etc.

PS, dont try this with meaty bones or anything other than the usual dry food your dog eats. You cant trust any dog in front of a meaty bone.

 

[Spades]

Cesar Millan.

And for food agression, you can try fighting with your dog, or poking them in the ribs, but you dont see many pack leaders do that in the wild.

The Alpha will attack the Omega in the wild and as well as suburbia...Try entering a yard with 3 dogs,your best bet is stepping on the toes on the dog that comes from behind,Alpha will sort this dog out while you retreat
At best they give a stern look, or maybe a growl. Why dont you try feeding from your hand, one piece of kibble at a time. The dog gets to understand they only eat at your whim, that you are the leader. After hand feeding for a while, feed half by hand, then put the rest in the bowl, and then take the bowl away, give it back, take some kibble out of the bowl, etc.

Personally i don't agree in hand feeding accept treats when there behaved...Feeding time should be at the same time everyday ie:routine...They don't respond to commands,they don't eat-simple.

PS, dont try this with meaty bones or anything other than the usual dry food your dog eats. You cant trust any dog in front of a meaty bone.

Trust Dominance will overcome a meaty bone and if they want to hark up,no bones until they behave accordingly.

 

[lizzie]

This doesn't work with Lizzie's Dog.

Lizzie's dog is deaf ... but he does know "the glare" from his pack leaders

 

[tobe]

lets agree to disagree. All the material Ive read refers to studies of wolk packs and the pack leader doesnt do any 'manual' work like biting, or even barking that much.
Its all taken care of my the alpha dogs a couple of levels down from the leader trying to prove themselves. Logically, if the pack leader gets into every scrap going, its going to wear them out for when there is a serious challenge. Thats why they reserve their energy and use their body language, a glare or a low growl instead. Its also more frightening for the dog to image what its like to be bitten, than to actually be bitten and realise its not that bad an injury....

 

[twodogs]

She must be turning seven next month.

Email me a picture if you have one handy

Couple of fairly recent photos follow, she has her winter coat right now and somewhat more fluffy this in these. Lizzy inherited her mother's good looks, but not her brains. Cuty and fluffy but a bit dumb. Love her to bits.

 

[WattleIdo]

Hey twodogs, she's a real cutie x

All the material Ive read refers to studies of wolk packs and the pack leader doesnt do any 'manual' work like biting, or even barking that much.
Its all taken care of my the alpha dogs a couple of levels down from the leader trying to prove themselves. Logically, if the pack leader gets into every scrap going, its going to wear them out for when there is a serious challenge. Thats why they reserve their energy and use their body language, a glare or a low growl instead. Its also more frightening for the dog to image what its like to be bitten, than to actually be bitten and realise its not that bad an injury....

OK this is interesting and makes sense.

I've read or heard recently that the theories of aggression don't really hold water. In other words, dogs aren't as much like wolves as we have been thinking AND often it's the friendliest dog who ends up being topdog. This kinda makes sense too. Plus, I don't think the pack is a full-on hierarchy.