IP in Hoppers Crossing/Werribee (VIC)

[mysterious_guy]

Hi everyone
I am from Melbourne and searched for this forum as i am seriously looking for investment property. It's a great forum and there are some knowledgable and rich people on this forum.

I have got a property in Western suburb of Melbourne(St Albans).
I have about $150,000 equity and seriously thinking about investment property. I have done a bit of search but can't decide where to buy as i only want to spend around 300k on IP.

I have noticed that Hoppers Crossing and Werribee are one of the only few areas where we can still buy a decent property for less than 300k. I know these are considered rough areas but on the positive side the prices are still within range and i THINK there is potential to grow as most other areas have developed and HP/Werribee area isn't too far from the city. Some of the property prices are amazingly low for e.g there are quite a few properties around 250 k in Werribee.

What do you guys think????
Has anyone bought or considered buying in this area????
Sunshine West (another rough area) is also one my options as properties in St Albans have gone up by almost 15% in the last year or so.

Any suggestions??? (Sorry about the long post )

 

[MCS_80]

Hahaha. "Rough Area's"

I live in Werribee and love the area. Wyndham is the quickest growing shire in Victoria at the moment and has huge potential.

There are some area's you might want avoid, as the houses have been run down and are not the most pleasing looking, but over all, I say Werribee is the pick of the west in Victoria at the moment and I look forward to investing there myself in future also.

Cheers

Mick

 

[sash]

I own a property in Hoppers (bought for in 2006 $170K 3brm house in the Mossfield Estate) and one in Werribbe (3brm house bought in 2006 for 130K)

I don't think either of these suburbs are rough compared to Frankston or Sunshine.

The places I have are now worth 250K and 210k respectively.......I believe the older stuff has a lot of potential. It is only 23-26 klms from the city...similar stuff in the Southeast is well over 300k.

 

[mysterious_guy]

Hahaha. "Rough Area's"

I live in Werribee and love the area. Wyndham is the quickest growing shire in Victoria at the moment and has huge potential.

There are some area's you might want avoid, as the houses have been run down and are not the most pleasing looking, but over all, I say Werribee is the pick of the west in Victoria at the moment and I look forward to investing there myself in future also.

Cheers

Mick

I know, it's rich coming from someone who lives in St Albans but i have been WARNED by family friends living in HP and Werribee. They think it's not worth buying a property in Werribee.
I think the low prices won't stay low no matter how rough the area might be (Footscray is one example). I can't imagine we will be able to buy a 3brm house for 250k in Werribee in a year's time.
I would love to know which areas to totally avoid in this region.

Thanks for your information Mick

 

[mysterious_guy]

I own a property in Hoppers (bought for in 2006 $170K 3brm house in the Mossfield Estate) and one in Werribbe (3brm house bought in 2006 for 130K)

I don't think either of these suburbs are rough compared to Frankston or Sunshine.

The places I have are now worth 250K and 210k respectively.......I believe the older stuff has a lot of potential. It is only 23-26 klms from the city...similar stuff in the Southeast is well over 300k.

That's the key, there aren't too many places in Melbourne where we can buy a GOOD 3 brm house for less than 300k within 25 kms of city.

 

[Tuppence]

Gidday, we're searching in similar areas and with a similar budget (but for our first place ... a little slow off the mark). Have you considered Altona Meadows and Laverton? $300k might be a stretch but it's worth a look.

 

[MCS_80]

Things to consider when buying in Werribee, in my opinion.

Pro’s

-It takes exactly 25mins to get from Werribee to the city

-Werribee has its own “Beach”, although not as fabulous as some, it has potential

-The attractions of Werribee. Werribee Mansion, Werribee Gardens, Werribee Open Range Zoo.

-As stated above, Wyndham is one of the fastest growing in the Country.

-I believe it will be too “expensive” for the “riff raff” to live in Werribee In 7-10 years time.

- Werribee has its own Hospital.



Con’s

-Bad reputation ie Its where the “SH*T” farm is. (NOTE. It does not smell at all, if anything it’s the market gardens that smell when they fertilize them with blood “n” bone.

-Some areas are quite old and not as pleasing to the eye.

-Government housing is still a big part of Werribee, these houses don’t do much for the aesthetics of Werribee.


As I mentioned, these “Pro’s” and “Con’s” are only my opinions from living and owning my own house in Werribee with my Fiancé for the past year or so. My Fiancé has lived in Werrribee her whole life and loves the place.

We actually hope no one discovers it as we love it so much and don’t want to see it turn into an “Investment Whore”. Our street has approx 120 houses in it and we calculated there are approx 5 owner occupiers and the rest are rentals. Our direct next door neighbour is in the very beginning stages of builing a house in his backyard also.

Cheers

Mick

 

[mysterious_guy]

Gidday, we're searching in similar areas and with a similar budget (but for our first place ... a little slow off the mark). Have you considered Altona Meadows and Laverton? $300k might be a stretch but it's worth a look.

You are right, there are some properties in Laverton and Altona Meadows for under $300k. These two areas are definitely closer to the city but properties you are likely to get there (for $300k) are not really in great shape.
If you search in HP and Werribee though, you get very decent houses for $300k. Some of them have 4 bedrooms (very important for rental returns) and others have huge land block (opportunity for further development). I have seen some good houses in $250k - $275k range and that's why i am more interested in these two areas in particular. Development in Point Cook, Trugnina, Tarneit will add value to properties in HP/Werribee as well.

Good analysis there again Mick

 

[Invest]

You may want to consider Hillside, Sydenham and Taylors Hill areas also. You can just sneak with $290-350 K budget for a house if you look hard enough. The area itself is much better than Sunshine, St Albans, Werribee or Hoppers Crossing.

Most of the houses in Sydenham are 10-15 yo, many young families live there, close to Watergardens shopping Center, many schools and kindergardens, trains and buses. They are proposing building Myer also.

The only downside IMO is that the train line is not the best but then again Connex sucks whereever you travel from and the area is a little bit too flat for my liking, I like hills.
But there is no stench unlike in Altona, Werebee and Hoppers Crossing, not oil refinaries and other dangerous industrial plants.

And if you are in a hurry, its only 20-25 mins on a freeway to the city (with Citylink).

 

[Deltaberry]

I know, it's rich coming from someone who lives in St Albans but i have been WARNED by family friends living in HP and Werribee. They think it's not worth buying a property in Werribee.
I think the low prices won't stay low no matter how rough the area might be (Footscray is one example). I can't imagine we will be able to buy a 3brm house for 250k in Werribee in a year's time.
I would love to know which areas to totally avoid in this region.

Thanks for your information Mick

Prices in HC probably won't stay low, but neither do the prices of cabbages.

By "rough" the issue is having "rough" people live in your house and wrecking it.

 

[mysterious_guy]

Prices in HC probably won't stay low, but neither do the prices of cabbages.
By "rough" the issue is having "rough" people live in your house and wrecking it.

I agree but that's not the point. It's not about prices staying low. It's more about which area has potential to grow a lot more.
For e.g A Nice house in Outer part of South East worth around $400k is likely to grow at around 10% at most over the next 2 years(as prices are already too high) but you can currently get a similar house in HP/Werribee for around $250k and it's more likely to grow a the rate of 20 - 25 % as it's much closer to the city and a LOT of development happening.


At the end of the day, it's only my opinion. I am no expert and have no experience at all in buying or selling properties.

 

[feihong]

I agree but that's not the point. It's not about prices staying low. It's more about which area has potential to grow a lot more.
For e.g A Nice house in Outer part of South East worth around $400k is likely to grow at around 10% at most over the next 2 years(as prices are already too high) but you can currently get a similar house in HP/Werribee for around $250k and it's more likely to grow a the rate of 20 - 25 % as it's much closer to the city and a LOT of development happening.


At the end of the day, it's only my opinion. I am no expert and have no experience at all in buying or selling properties.

There's indeed a massive dislocation in pricing between Outer West/North and Outer East/SE. The way the price jumped in inner north and west suggests that there's a very high probability that outer north/west will have to play catch up pretty hard, especially if the yield's attractive and still affordable to owner occupants (assuming Melbourne's population keep exploding).

 

[Deltaberry]

it's much closer to the city and a LOT of development happening.

2 views

a) Development attracts new people to the suburb, which allows the locality to undergo demographic shifts and potentially pave the way for revaluation/re-rating as new infrastructure and commercial developments are engaged.

b) Where new supply exceeds new demand, prices fall (this is simple economics)

The optimal amount of supply can essentially be modelled by a parabolic equation at a very simple level. Small-scale developments continue to add value because it revitalises the place, but there's a point where developments get too big too fast, giving buyers too much choices and keeping a lid on prices.

In contrast, inner city generally does not encounter problem (b) as development sites are limited so there's smaller risks of overflooding.

Just my opinion, though I am an expert, but I do not profess to be right because if I were, you'd see me in the news every day. Or maybe you already do. Haha

 

[Deltaberry]

There's indeed a massive dislocation in pricing between Outer West/North and Outer East/SE. The way the price jumped in inner north and west suggests that there's a very high probability that outer north/west will have to play catch up pretty hard, especially if the yield's attractive and still affordable to owner occupants (assuming Melbourne's population keep exploding).

Outer east is still very cheap and very affordable compared to inner city. The catch up will not happen any time soon.

 

[feihong]

Outer east is still very cheap and very affordable compared to inner city. The catch up will not happen any time soon.

Well, to give you an example, I don't think 380-400k+ for an existing 30yr+ old house with land in bayswater/boronia is exactly cheap.. Demographics in bayswater/boronia is pretty dominated by blue collars as well.

 

[cbrenner]

[Disclaimer - I grew up in Hoppers - lived there for 20 years, in the Mossfeil estate - and now live in Point Cook. I also bought an IP in Hoppers about four weeks ago.]

IMHO, prices in Hoppers/Werribee at the moment are going a bit crazy, but it's a good area to get into. My parents sold their place in Hoppers (the one I grew up in) 2.5 years ago for $196k. Nowadays, if it was up for sale at the same condition it was back then, it would go for about $270-280k. This gives you an idea of the capital gain - at least recently. (This is Mossfeil estate, btw.)

Some of my opinions:

1. Hoppers and Werribee aren't "rough" areas. Sunshine/St Albans/Footscray/Laverton are what I would consider "rough" areas. Hoppers and Werribee have their places to avoid like any suburbs, but generally speaking I wouldn't consider them "rough".

2. There are areas to avoid like any suburb. Avoid Birdsville, Woodville or anything around Werribee cemetery (you'll know it's in Birdsville if the street is named after a bird). Avoid areas out past Sayers Road. Too far from the freeway and services. Avoid Truganina and Point Cook or any area that has plenty of land available.

3. Good areas to get into in Hoppers - in my opinion - are Bellbridge, Mossfeil, and anything in the square between Morris Road, Derrimut Road, Heaths Road and Hogans Road. You should be able to get a good 3brm in quality condition in there for around $280-290k pretty easily.

4. Don't go too close to Hoppers station, especially not on main/service roads off Morris Road. Too busy, too commercial, too much pedestrian/drunken idiot traffic. I know it's only IP, but it doesn't hurt to be mindful of it.

5. Traffic around the Morris Rd / Heaths Rd intersection and the Princes Hwy railway crossing at Hoppers Crossing is chaotic around peak times. Bear this in mind.

6. Lots of Africans moving into Hoppers at the moment. Not my intention to be racist here - just stating a fact.

7. Areas to get in Werribee are to the south of the Princes Hwy/Synnot St. If you're going north of the railway line, the area is all ex-housing commission and still a bit rough. Once you get out beyond Shaws Road though, and into the area around Parramatta Road, it isn't too bad. Be careful if you're buying in that ex-housing commission area. Do your due diligence properly and if you do buy, make sure you get a good PM to screen renters.

8. Cotteril Street railway intersection in Werribee is a disaster. Anything around Ballan Road and up to the north west of Werribee there, Bulban Road, Wyndham Vale, Manor Lakes - anything around there nearly always has to pass through that Cotteril Street intersection, so this will affect rent. Council doesn't want to spend money on the intersection because it's too expensive/too hard to fix and the State government don't care because we're a safe Labor seat so it's not worth anything to them. They've been talking about fixing it for years but so far it's not any closer that I'm aware of.

9. Altona is great if you can get in there, but to get anything decent you're looking at $450+.

10. Laverton is overpriced. $300k as a bare minimum these days and the area is roughing up a bit. My wife and I looked there initially but gave it a miss due to price and general "roughness" reasons.

11. There is no "stench" in Werribee, Hoppers, Laverton or Altona. The only "stench" is in Werribee South in the market gardens district which is from fertiliser - and this isn't detectable from normal residential areas anyway. In Altona, occasionally you do get a strong seaweed smell in summer. Sewerage farm has nothing to do with it.

12. Hoppers and Werribee have direct connections to the city via freeway and rail. The frequency of express trains on the Werribee line is much greateer than that on the Sydenham line (this is for comparison to areas like Hillside, Taylors Lakes, etc.).

13. Freeway connection from Hillside/Taylors lakes is on the Calder, which then merges onto the Tulla (used to be a nightmare but from what I've heard is better now) and then the Tulla becomes the Citylink (i.e. tolls). From Hoppers/Werribee it's a straight trip in via the West Gate. No tolls. You decide.

14. Travel time from Hoppers to city is 1hr by train, 25 mins by car and about 1hr by car in peak.

15. Werribee Plaza has just been okayed for a massive redevelopment that will make it nearly as big as Highpoint Shopping Centre.

Anyway - hope that helps with your decision. Those are just my thoughts on the matter and some of the factors we took into account.

Cheers,

Christian

 

[Deltaberry]

Well, to give you an example, I don't think 380-400k+ for an existing 30yr+ old house with land in bayswater/boronia is exactly cheap.. Demographics in bayswater/boronia is pretty dominated by blue collars as well.

Houses are more like 300-360k in Bayswater. If that's not cheap I don't know what is. Not as cheap as HC I'll give you that , but then again I hear Wyndham is even cheaper. Anyway prices outer east are still cheap enough for most people to enter the market.

Nothing wrong with 30+ years houses. There're 100+ year old houses. In fact I live in one and it's perfectly fine and would not give it up for any of these new houses with flimsy fabricated panels that I can punch a hole through.

 

[Aazar]

come on just face it you west side people. It's not going to happen for a loooooong time. it takes generations, not a few years, to change from a dump like hoppers crossing into a nice area like Carlton.

 

[feihong]

Houses are more like 300-360k in Bayswater. If that's not cheap I don't know what is. Not as cheap as HC I'll give you that , but then again I hear Wyndham is even cheaper. Anyway prices outer east are still cheap enough for most people to enter the market.

Nothing wrong with 30+ years houses. There're 100+ year old houses. In fact I live in one and it's perfectly fine and would not give it up for any of these new houses with flimsy fabricated panels that I can punch a hole through.

I love 30+ yr old houses, don't get me wrong. In fact, I have never looked at buying brand new houses for either investment or to live in. 300-360K sounds pretty cheap for Bayswater.. I am mainly looking at properties with land that are within walking distance to train station and the new shopping facilities, and they are around 400k mark. Given that Wantirna's house is around 500K now for a standard BV 3 bedroom houses, 400K in Bayswater is still relatively reasonable compared to Ringwood, Wantirna, etc. But when you compare the overall area to the other side of the town, suddenly it looks dearer.

I have absolutely nothing against Outer East or Outer South East, since I have lived in Wantirna South, Berwick, and now back to Wantirna, and they are all very nice places to live in. There are also visible evidences that the areas are getting gentrified big time. But CG wise, cheaper areas tend to run harder once the uptrend starts (after a long stagnant period), as was the case for Outer East. More importantly, cheaper properties will put less pressure on one's cashflow, which is very important for buy and holders.

Just my 2c worth.

 

[Tuppence]

Er, I don't think anyone would suggest that Hoppers would ever become like Carlton. There are way too many differences for that.
It's just that Hoppers (and surrounding areas) are growing too and that there are plenty of people who like to live in these areas - regardless of the opinions of those who think the west has nothing to offer. In a city of 4 million (and growing if our beloved state government gets its way), there's room for all kinds - in the west and the east. Some even like to live in the north!