Perceptions...

[BayView]

One of our customers brought in a car today for a service...they acquired it a little while ago, we've never had it in before....Kia Cerato.

They brought in an invoice from a Dealer for previous work done on it - service, and rear brake pads replaced with disc machining.

Service cost: $236.37

Brakes cost - $303.00 included pads, disc machining and labour

They thought this was too expensive.

I didn't think so.

What do you guys reckon?

 

[lizzie]

Depends what went on in the service.

Had mine done at 120,000km last week and cost me a shade over $1,000 - but included:

Service (change filters etc)
4 new tyres
new rear brake pads
new wiper blades

... so I thought it was pretty fair. Sorry I don't have the breakup of the bill - no good for tax purposes so didn't keep it

 

[battler]

What do you guys reckon?

I think they are simply wanting you to do a service for less than they paid previously.

Sorta letting you they know what it costs or they expect to pay.

(I am fully aware that all services are not the same,i.e additional work at times depending on Ks etc)

 

[BayView]

I think they are simply wanting you to do a service for less than they paid previously.

They have been with us for several years, so it's not like they are suddenly getting a massively more expensive bill from the other crowd than we would give them..probably about the same...we would have been a smidge cheaper on the brakes.

His assumption was that because this car does very few miles, then the services would require very few things to be done.

Which is sorta true, but even yer bog-basic do-nothing service/safety check is almost impossible to get down below $200 because there is always at least an hour of labour, plus oil, filter and a few consumables.

Got to the real issue eventually; - he went to rebook the car back at the other place, and it was due for the massive 90,000km service including all filters, plugs and timing belt....circa a grand, no doubt.

But, since the car has only done a couple of thousand K's since last service; how can it need all this work?

Sorta letting you they know what it costs or they expect to pay.

Yep; and while you're there; can you rebuild the car, guarantee it will be safe, make sure the service interval is stamped in the book, charge us next to nothing, and can you do it while I wait?

 

[skater]

Bayview, you are always going on about how little people expect to pay for a service, and how many don't upkeep their cars in a manner that they should, and I know that I'm guilty of that too, but let me put it in perspective, at least from the way my mind works, which I know isn't the same as others, but maybe it is, in this instance at least.

I don't like to buy new cars. I can't see the point of buying something that loses value the minute you drive it out of the yard. That being said, we did buy a new one in 1998 and it lasted until a few years ago & had over 300k on the clock.

What I look for is a late model car with little mileage for the age of the car. My last one cost around $5k with under 100k miles. I will usually drive it until it becomes uneconomical in terms of upkeep (or I get bored of it) & then look for the next one.

So....with an investment of only $5k, I don't want to pay $1k every time I go to the mechanic. I avoid going to the mechanic simply because I know it will be expensive, but I go if I feel that something isn't right. Inevitably, it will end up around $1k. Too many of those trips to the mechanic means the car is going off to the next person & I'm looking for the next (hopefully well kept) car for me to run into the ground.

 

[BayView]

Bayview, you are always going on about how little people expect to pay for a service, and how many don't upkeep their cars in a manner that they should, and I know that I'm guilty of that too, but let me put it in perspective, at least from the way my mind works, which I know isn't the same as others, but maybe it is, in this instance at least.

I don't like to buy new cars. I can't see the point of buying something that loses value the minute you drive it out of the yard. That being said, we did buy a new one in 1998 and it lasted until a few years ago & had over 300k on the clock.

What I look for is a late model car with little mileage for the age of the car. My last one cost around $5k with under 100k miles. I will usually drive it until it becomes uneconomical in terms of upkeep (or I get bored of it) & then look for the next one.

So....with an investment of only $5k, I don't want to pay $1k every time I go to the mechanic. I avoid going to the mechanic simply because I know it will be expensive, but I go if I feel that something isn't right. Inevitably, it will end up around $1k. Too many of those trips to the mechanic means the car is going off to the next person & I'm looking for the next (hopefully well kept) car for me to run into the ground.

No matter what the particular car is worth at that time, the repairs and the parts are the same cost.

Eventually even the $5k car will require a service worth $1k. That's just the way it is, and it's up to the owner to decide if they want to go down the path.

It is not a $1k "every time" I might add..

If they don't, the car is likely to fail; but be aware and don't cry about it when it happens.

However, your mindset is a fair degree better than the normal mindset.

You are one of the few who consciously spend the least possible, but are prepared for the fact that it'll come back to bite yer backside down the road.

You are realistic, and it's refreshing.

The more normal mindset is folks buy the car (second hand or new), and then want to spend no money on it, but want it to be perfect, and then cry when they find out they will actually have to do what is required if they want the car to still be usable in the future.

Don't get annoyed at me for bringing these examples up - this thread is about perceptions and exploring them, after all.

 

[skater]

No matter what the particular car is worth at that time, the repairs and the parts are the same cost.

Well, no, not really. I know what you mean, but a part for a year 2000 model holden will probably cost less than the same part for a 2000 luxury car. We've mainly had Toyota's and parts have been easy to source, but at one time had a Renault which was great until it needed parts.

Eventually even the $5k car will require a service worth $1k. That's just the way it is, and it's up to the owner to decide if they want to go down the path.

It is not a $1k "every time" I might add..

LOL! It usually is for me. But like I said, I don't go for regular services either.

If they don't, the car is likely to fail; but be aware and don't cry about it when it happens.

However, your mindset is a fair degree better than the normal mindset.

You are one of the few who consciously spend the least possible, but are prepared for the fact that it'll come back to bite yer backside down the road.

You are realistic, and it's refreshing.

The more normal mindset is folks buy the car (second hand or new), and then want to spend no money on it, but want it to be perfect, and then cry when they find out they will actually have to do what is required if they want the car to still be usable in the future.

Don't get annoyed at me for bringing these examples up - this thread is about perceptions and exploring them, after all.

LOL! I'm not annoyed, just explaining how I think.

 

[willister]

This point was raised in another thread, and it got me thinking about the costs of servicing cars and what peoples' perceptions are about what it should cost, and what they are actually paying.

So, if you guys wouldn't mind; could you list what is:
a) Your perception of what a car service should cost, and
b) What you are currently paying for your services.

I realise that there are a million different brands, models, minor services and major services etc, and the labour cost can vary from dealerships to backyarders etc.

General Service:

a) Capped at $170 as per some deals from Toyota, unfortunately, ours isn't.
b) Do it myself (well, partially).

"Standard" service:

1. Castrol Engine Oil $60 for 5L at Supa Cheap Auto.
2. Friend - pay him $50 to drain and change oil - I don't want to get dirty anymore these days with a newborn. $50.
3. Genuine Toyota Oil Filter $18.

Total $130.

If required (usually I do it every 50,000 ks)

4. Spark Plugs $50 for set of 4 off amazon. Got the tools so quite easy.
5. Cabin & Air Filter $80 - $40 each genuine.

 

[Strannik]

One of our customers brought in a car today for a service...they acquired it a little while ago, we've never had it in before....Kia Cerato.

They brought in an invoice from a Dealer for previous work done on it - service, and rear brake pads replaced with disc machining.

Service cost: $236.37

Brakes cost - $303.00 included pads, disc machining and labour

They thought this was too expensive.

I didn't think so.

What do you guys reckon?

the service part or the brakes part?

depends on what kind of a service one is getting.
if it's just to drain the oil, pour a new one plus maybe replace oil filter - i don't think it should cost more than a 100 bucks + consumables.

if your car is inspected at the same time, potential problems pointed out and you are given quotes to replace them along with explanation - then 230 sounds like a good deal.

brake price seems ok too...

 

[Aaron Sice]

This point was raised in another thread, and it got me thinking about the costs of servicing cars and what peoples' perceptions are about what it should cost, and what they are actually paying.

So, if you guys wouldn't mind; could you list what is:
a) Your perception of what a car service should cost, and
b) What you are currently paying for your services.

I realise that there are a million different brands, models, minor services and major services etc, and the labour cost can vary from dealerships to backyarders etc.

BV - I service everything myself, except to maintain a new car warranty.

I've done oil, coolant, radiator flushes, transmission flushes, valve body modifications, carby disassemble/dip/reassemble, disc brakes, drum brakes, wheel bearings, hoses, belts, engine mounts, fabrication, head gaskets, custom manifold manufacture, custom sumps and pickups, diesel pumps and filters and coming up a custom turbo diesel install.

Even changed a head-gasket on the side of the road.

So my perception of what a car service should be - well, what is the service provided?

A simple fluids/filters/pressures/wipers etc - about an hour plus parts.

Any more complex than that, then I just expect an itemised account of what things cost and the total labour component.

Re the client with the Cerato - no one understands what machining a disc actually is. They don't understand lathe setup times, they don't understand the fact that good pads are often half the cost again.

However, "replacement discs @ $__ ea" suddenly makes sense.

 

[perthguy]

So, if you guys wouldn't mind; could you list what is:
a) Your perception of what a car service should cost, and
b) What you are currently paying for your services.

I have an older car out of warranty so I service it myself.

If I had a new car in warranty I would take it to my mechanic, not the dealer. Standard prices are: $159 minor, $179 standard, $219 major.

 

[BayView]

If I had a new car in warranty I would take it to my mechanic, not the dealer. Standard prices are: $159 minor, $179 standard, $219 major.

What sort of car?

Can you give me a breakdown of what a minor service and a major service consists of?

Major service at $219 seems astronomically low...that'd be just the labour at most places.

For example; Mazda 6 major service at 120km's:

http://www.fixedpricecarservice.com...H HatchBack Auto_Interval / 120,000km / 72mth

Here's what is done in that service, no doubt based on the service book schedule:

http://www.fixedpricecarservice.com.au/ServiceSchedule.aspx?ServiceID=1083125

We often use this site as a reference, and most times come in around the middle of the listed costs. So even at a really ridiculously cheap job, call it $500.

 

[BayView]

the service part or the brakes part?

He thought the brakes job was expensive, and the estimated cost of the next service (which was timing belt and others) compared to the previous service at $230 - he couldn't see why it should jump up so much, given it had done very few extra miles since last time (2,000km's).

depends on what kind of a service one is getting.
if it's just to drain the oil, pour a new one plus maybe replace oil filter - i don't think it should cost more than a 100 bucks + consumables.

Yep. We get folks asking for this only - oil and filter, and it is usually around the $100-130 mark, depending on how much and type of oil the car needs and the type of filter it needs...

But what also usually happens is the customer then asks; "While you've got the car, can you check the tyre pressures, check this, check that" and so on - it has just become a service and safety check...now you're talking 1.00 hour minimum...plus parts.

if your car is inspected at the same time, potential problems pointed out and you are given quotes to replace them along with explanation - then 230 sounds like a good deal.

And there is the difference.

A "service" to most people is all the above - the safety check and list all probs etc is what they are expecting as a given - from my observation.

 

[BayView]

Well, no, not really. I know what you mean, but a part for a year 2000 model holden will probably cost less than the same part for a 2000 luxury car. We've mainly had Toyota's and parts have been easy to source, but at one time had a Renault which was great until it needed parts.

I'm talking about a particular car.

For eg; say; a 2011 c'dore versus the 2005 version of the same thing.

The 2005 version is worth about $1k for arguments sake (probably is anyway - most are stuffed at that age ), the 2011 might be worth $10k, etc.

The cost of the rocker cover gasket job, the front brakes, sway bar bushes, clutch etc - are exactly the same for both cars (assuming the parts are the same and we are assuming that for this example).

One of the issues occurs is when the owner of the old car is confronted with the larger repair, and the value of the car is low.

We can't magically create a new price for the repair that is way lower to match the age/value of the car..but that's what folks think can happen/want....perception again.

 

[BayView]

Even changed a head-gasket on the side of the road.

Brilliant effort.

How did you manage that (head tensioner guage, other tools required etc) and how long did it take?

Was the head checked for fatigue/warping/cracks first?

 

[BayView]

"Standard" service:

1. Castrol Engine Oil $60 for 5L at Supa Cheap Auto.
2. Friend - pay him $50 to drain and change oil - I don't want to get dirty anymore these days with a newborn. $50.
3. Genuine Toyota Oil Filter $18.

Total $130.

We call that an oil and filter change. From my observation; this is not what folks think a service is.

Occasionally, folks ask for just that; but then at the last minute add 25 other things that they want us to look at - for the same price, of course.

I can guarantee you that if someone calls us to book in for a "service" and if nothing was discussed at all prior to the service about what we were actually doing to the car, and then at the end of the day we gave them back the car with a list of things done with only the above items on it, they would immediately say;

"How were the brakes? How were the tyres? Is the car safe? Is there anything wrong with it?" and so on.

And then they would be ****** off that nothing else was looked at, and tell 400 of their closest facebook friends.

(we have a written report of all those things on the invoice as a standard..% of brake pads, % of tyre tread, condition of battery, coolant, brake fluid and so on and so on).

 

[Fleur De Lis]

I wont tell you what the dealer was charging for services for the "lemon" I had.

Battery kept going flat and they advised the problem was I wasn't driving long distances. Can you believe it!!!.

Bought it brand new and just traded it in for a brand new Honda four years later (at a loss). Only had to pay $2000 for the swap over though. Should have done this sooner the Honda came with a five year free road side assistance etc.

Made the decision when the M dealer quoted over $100 for a wind screen wiper and I was worried road side assistance would put me on a "block caller" list for calling them out so often.

I don't even charge that much to read a contract...or do I.

Fleur

 

[Ed Barton]

We call that an oil and filter change. From my observation; this is not what folks think a service is.

Occasionally, folks ask for just that; but then at the last minute add 25 other things that they want us to look at - for the same price, of course.

I can guarantee you that if someone calls us to book in for a "service" and if nothing was discussed at all prior to the service about what we were actually doing to the car, and then at the end of the day we gave them back the car with a list of things done with only the above items on it, they would immediately say;

"How were the brakes? How were the tyres? Is the car safe? Is there anything wrong with it?" and so on.

And then they would be ****** off that nothing else was looked at, and tell 400 of their closest facebook friends.

(we have a written report of all those things on the invoice as a standard..% of brake pads, % of tyre tread, condition of battery, coolant, brake fluid and so on and so on).

I think of a service as that. Change the oil, filter etc and a report of anything else that needs doing or when something may need doing. eg - you're going to have to get it serviced on time next time because the brake pads will need replacing then. I'd expect to pay around $250 for that kind of service.

perceptions:

I think with servicing people whinge about price and don't value it because they can't see that anything has been done. If something's broken then they see value in fixing it - eg my car's overheating, you fix it I got something out of it.

I guess that's why some (all?) dealerships wash and clean the car as part of a service. The customer can see something's been done.

 

[random]

l drive 10 to 15yr yr old cars for 2-4yrs , spend nothing on them, they might get some oil now and then but that's it, sell em , usually for almost what l paid for them , buy another one.

l'd love to drive new cars but eh , 10 or 20 k down the minute you drive it out of the yard , insurances , servicing , interest . Add it all up and unless you can claim it that new cars costing you 1,000s and 1.000s.

But , not that l'm saying l've got it right and l do often wonder just how everyday people manage to be driving new ones all the time . Maybe it is a better way to go if you do it right, nice and comfortable , never get your hands dirty. l've never really been able to figure that one out.

 

[BayView]

l drive 10 to 15yr yr old cars for 2-4yrs , spend nothing on them, they might get some oil now and then but that's it, sell em , usually for almost what l paid for them , buy another one.

Brilliantly done!!

If only we could educate the younger folks to think this way - to get them financially set up early in adulthood.

But , not that l'm saying l've got it right

I reckon you have.

and l do often wonder just how everyday people manage to be driving new ones all the time .

It a Joneses thing

Maybe it is a better way to go if you do it right, nice and comfortable , never get your hands dirty. l've never really been able to figure that one out

We are all the same really; we all would like to drive a really cool, brand new car - that's why there are millions sold every day world wide.

You are more financially educated and know the things that must be done (in the absence of of a very large income) to get ahead financially more quickly.