Thriving on Minimum Wage

kathryn d said:
jaycee,
I never even claim to be clever.
These are not all my ideas, as I stated. I took it from another source, and just expand it.

I do have trouble with people telling me NO. (you can ask Rob :) )
If we had taken NO for an answer when we started investing, I'd still be working at the factory.

Not believing my numbers is why I gave examples. In hindsight, I should have provided the last one, where people are willing to pay $250 for a room.

Even if you couldn't get $250 for a room, add 2 single beds to a room and rent them for $125 with a place to lock their belongings (locked trunk?)

I don't think there is a situation, where a solution could not be found.
I guess that is the optimist in me :)
Click to expand...

Yes kathryn, I believe millions around the world already do this thing every day without us telling them to.,

It was as we said, the literal examples the literal $$$ and the specific strategy that people are discussing, and you DID reply insisting that the numbers would work here &* in Canada remember ??? therefore we also responded again telling you we don not believe they would work as easily as you claimed..

No one said someone who is not on a high salary is stuck where they are forever and cannot do anything with their lives. As I said, there are so many examples of this all around us, besides "US" if we care to look.
 
Kathryn what you're saying can be done, although your acommodation numbers are not the norm in MANY areas, and most people would have many other essential costs that need to come out of the after tax income, such as transport costs, toiletries, new underwear/shoes/work clothing, dentist/doctors fees, groceries, etc. that you've failed to mention.

Then there are vacancies (brother had them because he learned that he had to get fussy about who he let in if he wanted a household that worked and the boarders liked - so empty room for a couple of weeks here and there)?

Not saying it's a bad idea at all but if it was such a money spinner many would be doing it. A cheap share house without the work would be probably work just as well if saving is the idea.

Also the ability to save is one thing, and what you earn another. Young children sometimes have better savings skills than adults. But after utilizing those skills you can still only save just under what you earn at best. The more you earn the more you can save.

I've found over the years that higher income earners generally entertain generating income/wealth creation, moreso than the person happy to remain on a very low income, and I think that this desire leads them to develop the skills or do the training/education to do so.

Interestingly (smoking has been banned at my workplace for about a year now but at last assessment ;)) there were about 5 smokers amongst the 60 or so workers earning 70K to 500K and about 5 amonsgt the 10 or so low paid ancillary staff.

What I'm seeing is wealth creation from a decent income, not low income, but then that could just be my demographics.
 
weg said:
Kathryn what you're saying can be done, although your acommodation numbers are not the norm in MANY areas, and most people would have many other essential costs that need to come out of the after tax income, such as transport costs, toiletries, new underwear/shoes/work clothing, dentist/doctors fees, groceries, etc. that you've failed to mention.

Then there are vacancies (brother had them because he learned that he had to get fussy about who he let in if he wanted a household that worked and the boarders liked - so empty room for a couple of weeks here and there)?

Not saying it's a bad idea at all but if it was such a money spinner many would be doing it. A cheap share house without the work would be probably work just as well if saving is the idea.

Also the ability to save is one thing, and what you earn another. Young children sometimes have better savings skills than adults. But after utilizing those skills you can still only save just under what you earn at best. [B]The more you earn the more you can save.[/B]

I've found over the years that higher income earners generally entertains generating income/wealth creation, moreso than the person happy to remain on a very low income, and I think that this desire leads them to develop the skills or do the training/education to do so.

Interestingly (smoking has been banned at my workplace for about a year now but at last assessment ;)) there were about 5 smokers amongst the 60 or so workers earning 70K to 500K and about 5 amonsgt the 10 or so low paid ancillary staff.

What I'm seeing is wealth creation from a decent income, not low income, but then that could be my demographics.
Click to expand...

Come one now......
 
jaycee said:
Many FHB's buy as a couple not as a single as per your example, and/or save a deposit by doing extra work and saving extra, many whilst living at home with the blessing of mum & dad.
Click to expand...

actually i know with me and my mates out of the 4 of us that bought houses we all bought single
3 of us lived by ourselves 1 rented out a room for a while but is now by themselves

2 were renting beforehand
2 were living cheaply at parents

2 done overtime /extra work
 
wylie said:
Who mentioned a McMansion?

And someone offering to pay $250 for a room is a far cry from every other advert offering rooms from $120 to $170. You wouldn't find many people offering $100 more than rooms are being offered for. Nobody is saying you cannot scrimp and save and do it, but just that the figures quoted just don't add up.

We did it on low incomes, and until this year, we had only one income for 20 years. I'm a glass half full person, but just believe these particular numbers don't work.
Click to expand...

http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/north-melbourne/short-term/6-months-/1000434814
There are lots of people willing to pay extra for short term.
This couple is willing to pay $300-$340 week for 6 months.

I'm not saying everyone will do this.
Some may take the safe route, and rent somewhere that is just cheap and save.
For the ones willing to take on a bit of risk, they can increase their savings more quickly.

Getting a higher wage job is the optimal choice.Not everyone has the desire to get higher ediucation.

Macca,
It is good to hear some positive posts.
At least you are also giving "guests" who may be reading on SS, choices of how to market their rooms, should they decide to take in boarders.

It would be the people in their 20's who would be most likely to try this.
Or someone who needs to start over, because of relationship breakdown.
 
I agree with your concept kathryn but finding a property that is attractive for boarders and that is affordable for someone on a low wage would be very, very difficult. Certainly not a house or anything with more than 1-2 bedrooms at most.
 
Aaron_C said:
I agree with your concept kathryn but finding a property that is attractive for boarders and that is affordable for someone on a low wage would be very, very difficult. Certainly not a house or anything with more than 1-2 bedrooms at most.
Click to expand...

Thank you.
No one said it would be easy (otherwise everyone would be doing it)
It is just possible.
People coming from overseas (like we did) just wanted to have somewhere to go. Not everyone is picky. It just had to be clean.

Everyone says there are no cheap properties available and CF+ (but look at Nathan)

It probably wouldn't work with a property manager..but with a mum and pop LL, like us, it would.

We always tell our tenants..rent out rooms if you want to.

Look at our lifestyle...many here wouldn't do it.
To them, we are too frugal (and depriving ourselves)
 
kathryn d said:
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/north-melbourne/short-term/6-months-/1000434814
There are lots of people willing to pay extra for short term.
This couple is willing to pay $300-$340 week for 6 months.

You think someone is interested in continual turnover and having it vacant while they wait for the next short term tenant? I just don't think it is workable. I'm all for being creative, but someone willing to pay for short term stuff will probably want to be fed, and they are hardly thick on the ground. Who wants to cook for their tenants? Nobody I know does. But many people, including us, have done other creative things to get ahead.

I'm not knocking being creative, but finding a landlord who is prepared to accept a lease in the name of someone without the means of paying it without relying on three or four others paying top dollar for a room when they can get a room for $150 just doesn't make sense.
Click to expand...

I believe my posts are positive. I have shown how our son has bought his first place by renting a room. He did look at a place that went for over $400K with three bedrooms and a room downstairs that he would have taken. However, the risk of even having ONE room empty was too great. He needed every room rent every week to make the higher price work.

You think people are knocking you but it is only that I searched Gumtree for months looking at how much rooms went for, and the people renting out rooms are pricing them mostly room only, most with a bed and a desk, and the pricier ones (about $170 maximum) usually have a bathroom as well.

So, great advice, but not with those figures.
 
kathryn d said:
Thank you.
No one said it would be easy (otherwise everyone would be doing it)
It is just possible.
People coming from overseas (like we did) just wanted to have somewhere to go. Not everyone is picky. It just had to be clean.

Everyone says there are no cheap properties available and CF+ (but look at Nathan)

It probably wouldn't work with a property manager..but with a mum and pop LL, like us, it would.

We always tell our tenants..rent out rooms if you want to.

Look at our lifestyle...many here wouldn't do it.
To them, we are too frugal (and depriving ourselves)
Click to expand...

^^^ Exactly.... this also debunks the "thriving" statement in the opening post to be more like "surviving".....

Trying to make do on minimum wage is just as hard as putting that effort towards making a decent income.... I know what position I prefer to be in! ;)
 
dan c said:
Why bother?

Seems like a lot of trouble to go to, to make $60 grand a year. Not to mention the illegality and the tax avoidance.
Click to expand...

i was just getting started, the next phase is the investment phase, how to keep making money, not pay taxes, invest some of the money in australia, yet still qualify for all the social service entitlements.

but this is a public forum.

Maybe i should consider a new business avenue:
let me think:
blackmarket investment solutions for the low income earner.

or how about:
how i went to millionaire without every paying a cent in taxes

or maybe
how to use OPM as well as OPT (other peoples taxes) to create a future financial nest egg.
 
or maybe a book about life experiences of my interactions with people thriving on less than minimum wage.

a couple of more personal (not me, just personal knowledge) experiences comes to mind.

The enterprising family that used their ex-government-housing community 3 bedroom apartment to set up a chicken farm. (ex only in terms that officially it was still rented to them, unofficially because they already owned their own home, just not in their name)

or maybe

The how does one become a millionaire at the age of 18, and still maintain a clean criminal record after 18 by selling dope on the street.
 
Indifference said:
^^^ Exactly.... this also debunks the "thriving" statement in the opening post to be more like "surviving".....

Trying to make do on minimum wage is just as hard as putting that effort towards making a decent income.... I know what position I prefer to be in! ;)
Click to expand...

Thriving on Minimum Wage, was a title I came across while reading a bunch of stories on the internet yesterday.
I thought it worked well, for the thread I wanted to start.:p

In members in general:

Sorry so many people think it can't work.
I know it can.
I also know it is not the only way.It is one of many.
They can housesit for free.
Rent cheap rooms from other people who like to subsidize other people's rent.
Find a job which includes meals and accommodation (roadhouse, nanny,)

I never condone doing anything illegal.

Thriving is a state of mind.Seeing a light at the end of the tunnel, as opposed to thinking you will live like this forever.
Having a partner would make it easier.In time that would probably happen.

As for cooking for my tenants?
When I was a kid, we had boarders for a summer, and my mother cooked for them.
You would be cooking for yourself anyways, adding a few veggies, takes no time.

I know everyone commenting here makes too much money to bother with theses ideas.They were not directed at you. They are directed at the people working minimum wage, who need some encouragment.
I was hoping you would actually offer some more positive ideas.

Wylie,
I would be interested to hear what you did to get ahead.
 
kathryn d said:
I know everyone commenting here makes too much money to bother with theses ideas.They were not directed at you. They are directed at the people working minimum wage, who need some encouragment.
I was hoping you would actually offer some more positive ideas.
Click to expand...

Hi Kathryn

In case my comment was seen in this light I wanted to clarify I am very serious. In my opinion, for someone on the minimum wage, it is very likely to be far easier for them to get a higher paid job than do any of the other things that have been suggested in this thread. Things may be different in Canada - I don't know...

There are an incredible number of ways of doing this in Australia (which would nearly all have to relate to the passions of individual people so they are hardly worth elaborating here). Suffice it to say that some options can include training, moving to where the work is, taking on multiple jobs, online work, etc etc etc.

I firmly believe that the minimum wage can be readily avoided by anyone with a bit of fire in their belly and a desire to move beyond it. And increasing their income is very likely to be the best option if someone is starting at this point.

I also believe there is nothing romantic about investing on a minimum wage. Some people seem to put higher value on a person's achievements the lower their income. That's the tail wagging the dog - to my mind efforts expended to get a higher income are likely to be far more financially important at the end of the day - particularly for the young. Become a good saver and investor by all means - but don't put the cart before the horse in doing so if you want real results...
 
HiEquity said:
Hi Kathryn

In case my comment was seen in this light I wanted to clarify I am very serious. In my opinion, for someone on the minimum wage, it is very likely to be far easier for them to get a higher paid job than do any of the other things that have been suggested in this thread. Things may be different in Canada - I don't know...
Click to expand...

I agree it may be easier to get a high paying job.
For my sake of argument, I am taking it at face value, and using minimum wage as the pay.
Why?
Because everyone needs to make minimum wage. This is to give those people, who maybe don't have, (or don't think they have) the smarts to get a better paying job.

In my part of Canada, if I suggested this as a way to buy property, I would have the same resistance.

People in Australia, have the same opportunities.
If they want it bad enough, they can do it, even on minimum wage.

If they don't want to take the risk..rent a room at $120 week and bank the rest.
 
kathryn d said:
Weg,
If I believed that, there wouldn't be ads like this
http://www.gumtree.com.au/s-ad/heidelberg/other-shared-accommodation/looking-for-home/1000111138
Single man offering to pay $250 week for a room
Click to expand...

Kathryn, the point people are trying to make, is that you aren't going to get people willing to pay $250 for a room they know they can get elsewhere for $150. You *might* find someone who will pay $160 or $170 for a room that is worth $150, but $250? It's just not going to happen. I had boarders when I first bought my place, I offered the room PLUS use of the lock up garage (as I don't own a car) for $X per week, when I could fairly have gotten $X + Y. Even then, people were umming and ahhing. Rentals and share accomodation are a buyers market and always have been. It might take a little while sometimes to find a place, but that is usually due to how fussy people are. I'm talking from having well over 10 years experience in renting/share housing.

In the days of internet, people are very well aware of what they can expect to pay in rent for a room. That guy willing to pay $250 for a room is going to expect something where he would be reasonably expected to pay $250 per room if he was to rent a place himself. Try offering him something he can rent for $150 at $250 and see how far you get.
 
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