Verbal Tenancy gone sour arghh!!!!!

[Tom Alaka]

Ive had a (forrmer) friend at one of my properties for a long time. I never signed him up to a tennacy agreement or got a bond (yes I am an idiot), as we always had a good relationship and he was an excellent tenant. peace of mind having someone you knew there...

He moved out 6 months ago and still owed over me over a grand in rent. I wasnt worried at the time, as our relationship was good, he had always paid and said he would. Now 6 mnths later he wont pay, wont take phone calls, pretends not to be home when I come around etc etc.

I have sent a letter of demand and cced his current property manager on happenings. I will lodge a minor debt claim here in qld shortly supported by evidence of rent receipts, copies of his mail being sent to my IP addresss and an affidavit of another friend who saw him at this unit at various times.

Any advice you guys can give me re this one? What if this guy comes back and says he was not at the unit for the final months in question? It would be my word against his bascially. How else can I build my case?

 

[nomadic]

What if this guy comes back and says he was not at the unit for the final months in question? It would be my word against his bascially. How else can I build my case?

Perhaps you can help "prove" he was there by the date Energex did their final reading and when the phone was disconnected.

 

[kph]

IT would appear that without a formal rental agreement, you don't have a leg to stand on !!
You have nothing to prove he was ever a tenant of yours.......like you said its your word against his.

What does the current property manager advise ?

I think you summed it up in your second sentence, so chalk it up to (painful) experience and dont be an idiot again
kp

 

[Monopoly]

Oh Tom,

You have lost more than just money on this one (that is, on the assumption that your lost rental is never recouped). Even with a rental agreement in place, if a tenant does a "runner" back rent can be difficult to recover, and if you are fortunate enough to have landlord insurance, it may help ease the financial blow for a few weeks worth of loss.

Sadly, your greatest loss is no doubt the trust in your friendship, but then again, your biggest gain is the experience of knowing better (for) NEXT TIME.

All the best,

Jo

 

[wish-ga]

Any advice you guys can give me re this one?

For the sake of a good night's sleep I would chalk the $1,000 loss up to experience.

In the scheme of things $1,000 isn't all that much really (sorry). I would weight up how much upset and time and hassle and further cost it will be to try and recoup costs.

I have seen the toll ongoing argey bargy takes and have always vowed to move forward. Reap as you sow or karma will prevail.

On a more personal note I am sorry that a friend has felt the need to live in a way that hurts both of you. I feel sorry that you are treated that way but imagine the effort/vigilance he has to put into being on the lookout or avoiding all the people he has treated this way (leopard and its spots and all that...am sure you are not alone)

chin up and write yourself a little list of things you would do differently so you can see a concrete change...maybe it will help? just a suggestion.

All the best and sorry for your troubles.

 

[Aceyducey]

Water under the bridge.

Treat it as a learning experience.

You'll lose a lot more than a $1,000 in skipped rent over the years with tenants.

Cheers,

Aceyducey

 

[Simon]

I once heard a quote along these lines:

"My friend owes me $20 and now I never hear from him. Was $20 well spent."

I don't wish to make light of your misfortune but in the scheme of things $1000 is not worth losing sleep over, ill feelings between friends and prolonged attempts to recover it. I would be inclined to write off the amount and be extra wary of the friend. Only you know if the friendship is worth salvaging.

Verbal agreements aren't worth the paper they are written on. I have done it a few times and have been dissapointed in how some people respect their own word and integrity. However other times I have been more than happy. Would I do it again? Probably.

All the best to you mate.

 

[Monopoly]

"My friend owes me $20 and now I never hear from him. Was $20 well spent."

You'd hope so wouldn't you???

Verbal agreements aren't worth the paper they are written on.

Don't you mean the paper they're NOT written on???

Sorry Simon, couldn't resist!!

 

[silene101]

Friends and money are like oil and water, they don't mix; and they definately don't pay.
Lent my BEST friend $1000 2 years ago. Since then have received $200 back.
Thats $100 per year; at that rate it will be another 8 years before I'm paid in full! Geez I wished I'd charged INTEREST!


SILENE101

 

[skater]

Chalk it up to experience. Friends/family & money don't mix. Next time make sure you do everything by the book.

 

[Bear924]

I think if you 'lend' money to family/ friends you have to be prepared to change the word lend to gift.... especially if you care about the relationship.

 

[crest133]

Hi Tom
The glass really is half full, not half empty.
Looks like this person was mis-categorised as a friend.
A friend would not behave like that to you.
However, you have the opportunity through litigation to turn this person, who probably knows a lot more about you and your property than is comfortable right now, into an enthusiastic enemy.
Better not to go down that long road of misery.
Treat it as a reality-based course in an aspect of property management, with the emphasis on tenant selection and document preparation - probably the most vital areas of property management, and certainly the key to successful tenancies. In which case, it's a good deal for $1K, and very little study required, the knowledge is now is indelibly imprinted with feeling, and your property management policies in this area will not be inadequate ever again.
This person's glass will never be half full.
cheers
crest133

 

[blossomoz]

Family/friends & money

I'm soory you have lost both your money & a friend. I thin,k in the long run, it will have been a cheap learning curve. I'm sorry if there is a young person out there who wishes to use their parents' equity. Parents please don't do it; it can divide families & ruin family relationships. I speak from experience.

Sveral times we have been approached by friends to lend them money & we have just said no. These people accepted the 'no's' & there were no hard feelings.

When you hit a really bad time, you will find that your friends aren't really your friends & that people you didn't really think of as friends, actually are.
cheers
bloosomoz

 

[kissfan]

Hi Tom.

Thought I'd jump on the bandwagon and offer and offer my advice, even though you've already heard the same from the above replies.

I've seen families drift apart due to one member doing another a favour of either lending money &/or letting them use a property with cheap rent. The intention was right but unfortunately when things go wrong (as they do), relationships are lost, which is more painful than the monetary loss.

As the wise wish-ga has pointed out "karma will prevail". In other words, word will get around about your friend and he/she will be the loser, while (hopefully) you have moved on.

Hope it all works out for you.

Regards
Marty

 

[JoannaK]

Ive had a (forrmer) friend at one of my properties for a long time. I never signed him up to a tennacy agreement or got a bond (yes I am an idiot), as we always had a good relationship and he was an excellent tenant. peace of mind having someone you knew there...

He moved out 6 months ago and still owed over me over a grand in rent. I wasnt worried at the time, as our relationship was good, he had always paid and said he would. Now 6 mnths later he wont pay, wont take phone calls, pretends not to be home when I come around etc etc.

I have sent a letter of demand and cced his current property manager on happenings. I will lodge a minor debt claim here in qld shortly supported by evidence of rent receipts, copies of his mail being sent to my IP addresss and an affidavit of another friend who saw him at this unit at various times.

Any advice you guys can give me re this one? What if this guy comes back and says he was not at the unit for the final months in question? It would be my word against his bascially. How else can I build my case?

Agree with all the other comments about friends and business...however, even though the tenancy is a verbal one, there is still a legally enforceable contract here through offer and acceptance (a fundamental component of a legal contract), and the rent receipts help to evidence that contract. Your friend is still subject to the legislation that any other person who has signed a tenancy agreement would be subject to.

As crest133 has stated, this will provide you with fabulous experience in one of the most important aspects of property management; tenant selection and documentation management.

Good luck with it.

 

[nic]

Tom, one more thing you could try.

It's possible your friend did not intend to sting you for the money. You say he has always paid his debts before. Maybe in this case he has really fallen on hard times. Was hoping his situation would improve but it didn't. Maybe he was too overwhelmed, couldn't cope, felt ashamed, etc... But instead of fessing up to you, as a truly mature person would have done, he was just avoiding you. And the longer it goes on the harder it is for him to look you in the eye.

So instead of ringing and coming around, try to write him a letter. Tell him you don't think ill of him and understand his difficult situation. Tell him that although you would ideally like to get the money back, your friendship is more important to you. Tell him that if he talks to you, you are sure to be able to find a solution and save the friendship, even if it means you won't see your money, at least not for a very long time. Give him ALL the benefits of the doubt.

If he is basically a decent human being, that should have an effect on him where he might actually do anything to pay you back. Or at least he will stop hiding from you. In any case you will have a better chance of getting your money back.

If he is not, you can still sue him.

In the first case, you will save the friendship and get your money eventually. In the second, you will be not worse off than you are now. Plus, you will not have regrets about loosing the friendship, as you will know for sure it wasn't worth much.

Good luck
Nic

 

[Terryw]

For contracts involving land, including leases I beleive, they do not have to be in writing, but cannot be enforced unless they are in writing. Maybe you could query this at your local court?

Terryw

 

[crest133]

My understanding is that the Tribunal has the authority to examine information supplied to it, and if it sees fit, rule that a tenancy exists, even in the absence of paperwork. And then they can apply the Act accordingly.
Little wonder some of the members get delusions of grandeur.
cheers
crest133