Any Advice you can give on NSW Tribunal?

[Magsie]

Hello

Was wondering if anyone out there has experience of a NSW Tribunal and what to expect.

Our Tenant (now squatter), has now not paid rent for 8 weeks, was given a 60 day Notice (for no reason) to vacate on 5/2/2008 (he was paying rent weekly and very late) then when he was 14 days over the last date of rent paid, the PM sent a 14 + 4 day Termination Notice.

"Tenant" tricked us by suggesting a "Mutually Satisfactory Resolution" with his paying the rent in full and leaving my a certain date, which we agreed to, and therefore delayed lodging an application with the CTTT. We have lodged an application and have a hearing for the 21st January. Our PM is useless and I am attending (PM has been unable to provide me with evidence that only they have... ignored requests etc....)

The "tenant" works for a law firm and knows every trick in the book (accusing our Termination notices to be back-dated, accusing us of trespass etc....). I have been told that with Tribunals it depends on "who you get" and also told that if we don't agree in Consolidation, we will be sent away until we do! Is that correct? I have had to take a day in Annual Leave to attend, and it buys the tenant even more free accommodation - that can't be true, surely?

What is the "worst" outcome I could expect from the Tribunal if having an unsympathetic Member?

Any advice on anyone who has been through this process will be greatfully received!

Thanks in advance.

 

[wylie]

Only advice I would give is to go to the PM's office and tell them you are not leaving without the "evidence" that you need (whatever that may be) and that they must have.

Then, I would get everything into a concise date order, so that the judge can see the exact dates when you (or PM) sent the appropriate notices and can see that (hopefully) the PM sent the correct notices with enough time allowed for posting etc.

My parents have taken tenants twice to tribunal and won each time. The last time, I attended with them, and whilst the judge heard both parties, at one stage he stopped everybody talking and asked for photos that we had. My mother wanted to tell him more, but the photos were enough for him to decide that the tenant was lying about the condition they left the house.

The other think that I believe went against the tenants, was that they were slightly disrespectful and dismissive of the judge and got a bit nasty in their mannerisms and comments. My parents and I kept calm and collected and didn't respond to the baiting by the tenants. (It was very hard to keep quiet.... and harder still for my mother to stop talking .)

The other hint would be to keep it as short and concise as possible. Stick to the facts, be calm and diplomatic and polite. You don't want to get the judge off side.

Good luck.

 

[Collector]

Don't get emotional at the hearing.

Gee i feal for you - whats doing with your PM - always been slack.

BTW - never lease you property to a Lawyer or similar

Is your PM going to the hearing?, what writen into your aggreement with the agent - terms etc - has he the authority to repesent you?


In regards to the tribunal hearing on the 21st - you will need copy of the tenant ledger, residential tenancy agreement, bond slip, termination notice, condition report, previous comunication with the tenant. - you agent should be doing all this - thats what you pay for.

With the tenant accussing you/your agent of back-dating, i would check the termination notice prior to the tribunal hearing, ensure that they have been issued correctly. - If not get you agent to do another termination notice (so long as you tenant is still 15 days or more in arrears) and the get him/her to hand deliever it directly to the tenant - have a witness there as well - start over from srcatch.



Inregards to the "Mutually Satisfactory Resolution" - was this in writing and signed by both parties?


Seems to me that you may have to start the termination process over again being as you and your agent (especially your agent) are lost with the current process. Issue a new termination notice directly to the tenant. Then once this matter is over - SACK YOUR AGENT

 

[Magsie]

Thanks

Thanks for your advice guys.

Definitely NOT going to use this Agent after all this. Don't really want Agent at Tribunal as communication skills are poor.

So you think that the Agent is incorrect, saying the Tribunal won't make a decision and will make us go away with another date until we can agree at consolidation?

 

[Alabex]

you will be sent to concillitation, but if you can't reach a resolution your case will usually be heard straight away. Only if they are really backed out and out of time that the date will be rescheduled.

You will need as much eveidence from the PM as possible. Copies of notices, confirmation of how they were issued e.g by hand, posted etc etc. full tenancy ledger etc. I think the idea of going into the prop mger office and staying there till you get all the info is probably a good idea.

I have been to HEAPS of tribunal cases in my time, so happy to help with any other questions if you would like to PM me.

 

[Frank_A]

Can anyone help?

I instructed my property manager to give the tenants 60 days notice to vacate the property and canceled the management agency agreement.

The tenants left 3 weeks ago (29th of October) and the pm has told me that all the rent (about 7 weeks outstanding) and water usage has been paid by the tenant. However, the agent has not paid me! I kept calling and they kept saying "we'll do it soon", but never did. They paid the rent at least a few days late every month during the term of the lease and never informed me when the tenants were more than 14 days overdue (which was almost every month).

I have applied to the CTTT to recover this money from the agent.
Can someone please advise what type of evidence I would need for the tribunal? The agent could lie and say the tenants moved out a lot earlier than the 29th. How could I prove they were lying - would Integral Energy send me a statement confirming the tenants were still there?

I'm owed about $3,200 in total rent and water usage and am worried I will never see this money!! Surely, they couldn't get away with this theft?

 

[rugrat]

I assume your pm was supposed to be paying the money direct into a bank acc. take in the records for this acc for the past however many months and high light any payments you did recieve and the dates.

why would they lie about when the tenants left?

I doubt a statement from the energy company would prove anything - some tenants don't even bother discontecting their power at all. But it is worth a shot. Do you have any other evidence?

 

[skater]

Can anyone help?

I instructed my property manager to give the tenants 60 days notice to vacate the property and canceled the management agency agreement.

The tenants left 3 weeks ago (29th of October) and the pm has told me that all the rent (about 7 weeks outstanding) and water usage has been paid by the tenant. However, the agent has not paid me! I kept calling and they kept saying "we'll do it soon", but never did. They paid the rent at least a few days late every month during the term of the lease and never informed me when the tenants were more than 14 days overdue (which was almost every month).

I have applied to the CTTT to recover this money from the agent.
Can someone please advise what type of evidence I would need for the tribunal? The agent could lie and say the tenants moved out a lot earlier than the 29th. How could I prove they were lying - would Integral Energy send me a statement confirming the tenants were still there?

I'm owed about $3,200 in total rent and water usage and am worried I will never see this money!! Surely, they couldn't get away with this theft?

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but this sounds suspiciously like an Agent that I had trouble with. It ended badly, as in the end, I was owed over $10k that I never got. It was really messy and there were quite a few properties involved. The Agency went into liquidation, along with my funds. I wasn't the only one hurt by it, and I know of one landlord that coped it much worse than I did.

Over time, various things have come to light, that were not visible at the time including no bonds lodged. I have a recently evicted tenant ATM (the last remaining one that started their tenancy with this agent) that owes me a heap of $$ and I have a terrible feeling that there won't be any bond to draw on. Much damage was done to the property too, and there was no entry inspection carried out either. All we have to go on is the condition of the property when the existing PM took it over.

There is a fund, and I can't remember the name of it, but the Real Estate Agents on the forum should be able to tell you, where you can lodge a complaint/claim form in order to get some kind of payments from Agents that misappropriate their Trust Funds. I can't remember why now, as it was some time ago, but it wasn't relevant in our case.

Good Luck.

 

[Frank_A]

I assume your pm was supposed to be paying the money direct into a bank acc. take in the records for this acc for the past however many months and high light any payments you did recieve and the dates.

THat's correct.

I doubt a statement from the energy company would prove anything - some tenants don't even bother discontecting their power at all. But it is worth a shot. Do you have any other evidence?

I rang Integral and they said they couldn't send me anything because of privacy laws...

There is a fund, and I can't remember the name of it, but the Real Estate Agents on the forum should be able to tell you, where you can lodge a complaint/claim form in order to get some kind of payments from Agents that misappropriate their Trust Funds. I can't remember why now, as it was some time ago, but it wasn't relevant in our case.

Can anyone advise? I have a suspicion that they're doing this, but no proof.

PM me if you want the name of the agency. It's in the Parramatta area of Sydney.

 

[BMW308]

I would speak to the owner of the business DIRECT. Maybe the property manager is playing games HOWEVER if not I would give the owner 72 hours to have your funds deposited into your account or inform them you will head to the Department of fair trading and lodge an official complaint against the company. Dont let it go...keep on it cause the hole he is digging sounds like it wil only get MUCH deeper !

Unfortunately you are not the first and certainly wont be the last !

 

[crest133]

NSW Dept of Fair Trading has strong powers to audit trust accounts, handles breaches of the REA's relevant Acts like the Stock & Station one, and handily enough issues or terminates REA licences. It's the place to go when you think a REA is breaching their code.
Cheers
crest133