CBA to put fees on internet banking

Hi All

When your 75 year old mum complains you know it cannot be fair.

Inviting comments on this and what the CBA might scam.

On face value, not happy. :mad:
Or am I being niave :confused:

Regards, peter 147

Todays SMH.

[I]CBA slammed on net fees
By Jane Bardon
May 4, 2005 - 5:29PM

The Australian Consumer Association has slammed the Commonwealth Bank over its new fees for internet banking, which start on July 1.

The charge hits the bank's 1.9 million Netbank customers who do their banking online.

They will be able to transfer just three free payments to other accounts each month before they are slugged 50 for each additional payment.

They will be hit for direct debits for utilities bills, and even transfers to their own accounts, if they are not linked to their Netbank accounts.

Scheduled payments - where a customer nominates a future date for payment - will also be hit.

Spokesman Patrick Southam says it is bringing in the charges to recoup part of the cost of a $100 million, five-year upgrade of its Netbank site and online services, which were first launched in 1997.

"The site has had a dramatic overhaul, and has increased security features,'' he told theage.com.au. "And customers can use a range of new services, for example our international transfer service, at $22, which is less than you'd pay in the branch."

Customers 'weaned' then hit
Lisa Tait from the Australian Consumers Association said the fees were "cynical''.

She says customers were lured into signing up for free online banking, believing it would remain free.

"What they've done is they've weaned people onto internet banking because it has been free, and now that the habit has been established, they're hitting them with fees," she said.

"It is extremely cynical and we think the banks are using the excuse of the need for internet security as a ruse for upping their fees."

She says the Commonwealth and some of the other 'big four' Australian banks have persuaded customers to use online services because it costs less than providing in-branch services.

"Internet banking is cheaper for the banks than operating a network of branches and call centres. It is a low-cost alternative for the banks."

But Patrick Southam says the bank did not move towards offering internet banking to save money, but because of customer demand for online services.

He says: "Comparing the costs of in-branch, call centre and online networks isn't valid.

"We will always offer face-to-face banking, and we will always need call centres. And there will always be costs associated with infrastructure changes."

Ms Tait says consumers should be aware that not all of the banks charge for internet banking, and should shop around and vote with their feet.

"In our latest bank satisfaction survey, 'Choice, money and life' we found that consumers are really fed up with the big four banks.

"We've found in our research that consumers find it a real hassle to change accounts and they're worried about setting up their direct debits again, so we've set up a website, flickyourbank.com.au on which customers can compare fees and which helps to take the hassle out of it."

Which banks?

Westpac charges 25 once customers have used up their free transaction limit on its classic accounts, but says there are no extra online transaction fees for customers with its $5 a month flat-fee account.

The NAB charges its customers 20 to transfer funds, make a BPay payment or view their transaction history online.

The ANZ has no personal banking online transaction fees, but charges similar rates for services including international money transfers, which would already incur an in-branch fee.

Links:
www.choice.com.au
www.flickyourbank.com.au[/I]
 
An open statement to those of you who feel this is unfair:
If you don't like it, and it's a viable option, go to a different bank. It really is that simple. Case in point: my (at the time) girlfriend and I both were with CBA. One day, they sent us a letter saying that our accounts would be incurring a $5 per month charge. We promptly threw those letters into the bin and went out - the next day - and closed those accounts and opened new ones at Bendigo Bank. I've been with them ever since and couldn't recommend them highly enough.
The biggest issue here is that most people are simply just too lazy to actually do anything about their situation - it's far too easy for them to simply sit around and complain about how the banks are ripping them off. Well, hello! The banks are in business to make money, and that's what they are doing. Either do something about your own situation or cop it without whinging. Think the banks would slug people with so many fees if their customers walked everytime they got hit with ridiculous charges? Exactly.
 
Golly, this is almost as bad as when someone I know closed an ANZ unused account with nothing in it, and they sent out a letter saying that he owed them $2.00, (a "closing fee" or some made up thing like that). Heck, they would have saved $2.00 in not sending out that letter... ANZ kept hassling him, so he sent a fax saying that he wouldn't pay up, and that was the end of it.

Mark,
I agree with your post. Although it is unfair on the consumer, in my opinion, we as consumers have the right to change banks if we see fit. To me, closing an account with an "unfair" bank is our way of saying "go shove it". :)
 
I understand that we have a choice but the way the banks have been attracting everybody to net banking saying its free and now they start imposing fees once we have our banking all setup....i dont think its fair...and well they will lose in the end.

i dont know if any other bank is following this path???
 
djones said:
I understand that we have a choice but the way the banks have been attracting everybody to net banking saying its free and now they start imposing fees once we have our banking all setup....i dont think its fair...and well they will lose in the end.

i dont know if any other bank is following this path???
Is the Pope Catholic!
 
plumtree said:
Is the Pope Catholic!

Exactly.

I agree with and appreciate Marks comment. Bendigo may be worth considering but In my experience they all do the same sooner or later. Where to you go?

As well as a business person I have multiple accounts, insurance, family trust, 3 visa, etc. so moving over is not worth it unless the deal is guaranteed.

I started with NAB, moved to Advance ( loved them) but St George swalled them and went stupid ( demanded house insurance on 95 year old terrace but would not offer it unless we got a full boundary survey at $2K) got insurance elsewhere.

Then moved to Mortage Originator who shall remain unnamed. They :eek: could not organise a chook raffle and despite great product continually stuffed up payments and such. When I finally told them I was moving on I found legally I had no support from Banking ombudsman and they got nasty. Tried toovercharge payout figures 3 x $5k

So I took the commercial decision and went with the biggest bank CBA approach and pay the $300 for premium banking service (great but staff change a lot). Being in this service I probably will not pay any fee but still, not happy.

Will look at Bendigo or consider a coffe with Rolf.

FYI Peter 147
 
Peter 147 said:
I agree with and appreciate Marks comment. Bendigo may be worth considering but In my experience they all do the same sooner or later. Where to you go?
Not for a second would I suggest that the banks have round-table talks on fees. That would be illegal. But they don't compete on fees either. Seems they allow one to break new ground and then follow after a suitable time of tut-tutting.

I feel it would be futile to change banks everytime they put up fees. Bendigo is not an option for me as I must stick with one of the big 4 and for reasons I'll let you ponder "how close to the front door can I park?" is very important to me ergo I would not choose a bank or branch inside a shopping centre.

I'm with you Peter, It's a rip-off.

Thommo
 
There are many anomalies with the banking system. If you have sufficient funds with the bank just asking them to waive bank account fees is sometimes sufficient. Certain banks have policies with respect to waiving account keeping fees and I have requested that these fees be removed for all my accounts and have been successful. Mind you unless you have over $100K on deposit the answer will probably be no.

It is truly unfair on the pensioners, low income earners and those who dont know that asking will sometimes get a positive response. I think the banks attitude is that if they can onlend your money at 7% and pay you 5% then they are more than willing to waive the fees. If however you have small deposits with them or low levels of loans they consider you another number.

First point try asking for an account keeping fee waiver. Im with Westpac and dont pay any account keeping fees. As the saying goes "ask and you shall receive, seek and you shall find". Except if your a pensioner then the response seems to be "ask and you will be told to get stuffed"
 
It is the thin edge of the wedge but these CBA fees are workable and not expensive. While I do not operate a trading business I do not think I will be paying any fees.

We have experienced outstanding service and products from the HSBC in England and I should really give them a try in Oz. We have been using CBA for a considerable time and really have no complaints so I guess we will stay.

Any experience with the HSBC in Australia that you would like to comment about.
 
Thommo said:
Not for a second would I suggest that the banks have round-table talks on fees. That would be illegal. But they don't compete on fees either. Seems they allow one to break new ground and then follow after a suitable time of tut-tutting.

I feel it would be futile to change banks everytime they put up fees. Bendigo is not an option for me as I must stick with one of the big 4 and for reasons I'll let you ponder "how close to the front door can I park?" is very important to me ergo I would not choose a bank or branch inside a shopping centre.

I'm with you Peter, It's a rip-off.

Thommo


I guess there is another option
:confused: :confused: :confused:
If you can't beat them join them :rolleyes:
Have some shares in your bank :D
 
Well I pay my rent via third party transactions. If they're going to be charging me for them, sayanara CBA.

Thanks for the links, might look into Bendigo.

Edit: NAB Smart Direct at $3/month looks pretty good to me. Anyone used NAB's online banking before? How does it compare with CBA WBC and St George?
 
I have been using HSBC online Savings account for a few years. The service is very good and no nasty internet transaction fees. So far so good.

I don't have a business account or trust account with HSBC, so can't comment on the fees or service. One of our trust accounts is still with CBA. I think it's time to move it elsewhere.

We have our business account with Westpac. We are very happy with them.
 
I thought the pope wasn't Catholic actually - by the strictest definition :)

It's not free to set up and operate the infrastructure required to provide an online banking service.

Any bank charging nothing for the online service has to be recouping the costs in other ways - from fees on people NOT using online banking, through higher risk investments, etc.

If a bank charges higher fees on offline banking than online which demographic groups are most hurt? The uneducated, poor and old....Therefore there is an argument that charging for online banking is socially responsible - provided they cut fees on other banking!

That said, individuals will of course minimise the amount they spend...this opens the door to new online only banks with more creative ways of generating revenue. It could get VERY interesting :)

Cheers,

Aceyducey
 
Acey,

Aceyducey said:
It's not free to set up and operate the infrastructure required to provide an online banking service.

True, but as a former employee of WBC I am sure the true cost of an online transaction is about 1 cent.

Aceyducey said:
Any bank charging nothing for the online service has to be recouping the costs in other ways - from fees on people NOT using online banking, through higher risk investments, etc.

Acey, the interest rates on the Streamline account are about 0.1%, which they will use to lend out at ~8%. So I think they are making a good deal of money from our savings. If we make a few free internet transactions they're still coming out in front.

Aceyducey said:
If a bank charges higher fees on offline banking than online which demographic groups are most hurt? The uneducated, poor and old....Therefore there is an argument that charging for online banking is socially responsible - provided they cut fees on other banking!

Yes I am all for the abovementioned groups getting a fair deal, but don't believe this decision is motivated by the CBA's social consciousness. There is no correlating offline fee cuts here.

Aceyducey said:
That said, individuals will of course minimise the amount they spend...this opens the door to new online only banks with more creative ways of generating revenue. It could get VERY interesting

Not only online banks, but bricks and mortar banks with online only accounts. A case in point is NAB. They have their regular bank account, the Smart Access at $5 a month

http://www.national.com.au/Personal_Finance/0,,50538,00.html

and the internet-based Smart Direct at $3 a month

http://www.national.com.au/Personal_Finance/0,,50536,00.html

Yes there are interesting times ahead, particularly when you consider the future effects of broadband based mobile phones.
 
Hi,

So the Banks are commercial operations who are going to charge a fee (albeit high) for service. That's life in a "free" society and as property investors you are running your business of investing and you have choices.

All things commercial are negotiable and these fees are negotiable too. 25 years ago 50 cents a transaction (adjusted for inflation) would have hurt my cashflow and I would have voted with my feet. Today these fees and many others do not apply.

Get on with it (or over it), change institions, negotiate them away or build your wealth to the point where the banks will waive these fees if they want to keep your business.

regards, MC
 
djones said:
I understand that we have a choice but the way the banks have been attracting everybody to net banking saying its free and now they start imposing fees once we have our banking all setup....i dont think its fair...and well they will lose in the end.
From ABC Online -
For the six-months to March, Westpac's profit after tax has come in at almost $1.23 billions.
That is up nearly 17 per cent on the previous corresponding period.


djones - maybe the big banks will lose in the end, but with results like these it doesn't look like any time soon.
Cheers
 
Michael Croft said:
Get on with it (or over it), change institions, negotiate them away or build your wealth to the point where the banks will waive these fees if they want to keep your business.
Spot on! This wealth threshold isn’t that high after which banks prepare to waive most of the fees.

I am happy to pay around $300 a year to ANZ to have my all other fees waived, plus bank pays me back at least $200 annually based purely on our credit card usage!
M.
 
Thommo said:
Could you expand on this a little?
Whenever I use my CBA credit card I get 'reward points'. This translates to a free $100 DJs gift voucher every $14000 I spend. The way I look at it is I get 0.7% discount on everything I spend by using a CC. I spend around $70K pa, so I easily get back the $300 it costs me.

I am happy to pay around $300 a year to ANZ to have my all other fees waived, plus bank pays me back at least $200 annually based purely on our credit card usage!
I pay $300pa to CBA, they give me (& my trust, but not my company) fee free banking & free loan apps & interest rate discounts & free credit card. I'm happy.

KJ
 
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