charging the tenant for my time.

[ol mate]

Hi people

I recently had a vacate and whilst the place is relatively clean there were s few items requiring attention ie lights were missing, screens were missing/ damaged, rubbish in back yard etc which I rectified myself due to having dome tile repairs done (not tenant related).

My PM said to do up an invoice as if I were a contractor and charge them for my time..

Is this legal? I am not a contractor nor do I have an abn.

Cheers

 

[HD_ACE]

I would of got quotes, claimed this from the bond but done the work myself. Depending on how time consuming it really was.

cheers

 

[The Fence]

I would of got quotes, claimed this from the bond but done the work myself. Depending on how time consuming it really was.

cheers

We just did this recently. Worked out perfect.

Way to go IMO

 

[livewildcard]

Then we have all the threads on tradies not giving service when they are being called out for quoting on jobs with no intention of ever actually giving them the work.

 

[HD_ACE]

Then we have all the threads on tradies not giving service when they are being called out for quoting on jobs with no intention of ever actually giving them the work.

You should be able to get quotes or estimates over the phone if its a standard job with nothing out of the ordinary.

cheers

 

[Joe D]

In addition to claiming the costs of rectifying any of these issues also ensure that the time spent in rectifying the issue comes out of the bond. For example, if re-leasing is delayed a week because you need to effect these repairs, the additional week also comes out of the previous tenant's bond.

I ensure my tenant's are well aware of the above before handover of keys upon vacating.

 

[thatbum]

For example, if re-leasing is delayed a week because you need to effect these repairs, the additional week also comes out of the previous tenant's bond.

I don't think this would fly in court to be honest.

 

[Joe D]

I don't think this would fly in court to be honest.

It is all a matter of having adequate wording in your leases and being pro-active in the management of leases as they draw to an end.

PMs tend to take the line of least resistance, so tend to accept keys back from vacating tenants without pressing the tenant to implement the repairs prior to vacating. They always try to throw it back as the landlord's problem. If you allow this to happen you will come up short every time.

Fortunately, I self manage several of my Perth properties these days and I have actually found self managing much easier than managing a PM.

In the past I have had DOCEP agree with the principle behind this, although fortunately I have never had to test this in court.

In any event, it will only ever get to Court if a tenant takes you there for not allowing the release of all their bond in which case I say good luck to them as I will always be able to demonstrate actual costs incurred.

 

[Dazz]

I self manage several properties these days and I have actually found self managing much easier than managing a PM.

Nice one Joe D.

 

[mattysavager]

For example, if re-leasing is delayed a week because you need to effect these repairs, the additional week also comes out of the previous tenant's bond.

If the OP's IP is also in Queensland, the above would not fly. By law, the tenant must be given 'reasonable' time to fix up any issues. From my experience in court, this has ranged from 3 business days to 7 business days. If the tenant still does not rectify issues, then the owner/PM can arrange and claim.

You might get some money in court for this delay, but it has never been awarded to me. You cannot contract yourself out of allowances under the act, so it wouldn't matter whether or not the above was a term in the lease.

Also, to answer the OP's main question, I believe that you are able to issue 'invoices' (as opposed to a 'tax invoice') without an ABN - You would not charge GST, as you are not registered for GST, and then you would declare this on your income tax return when working out your profit/loss for that IP. (keep in mind, I'm no tax expert).

I'd invoice them at $50/hour - the idea is to recoup costs in time, not to make a profit. Should be $250 max, based on my experience and your description.

Matt

 

[Dazz]

You cannot contract yourself out of allowances under the act, so it wouldn't matter whether or not the above was a term in the lease.

This is the bit that drives me nuts.

Two reasonable, sane parties represented by consenting adults on both sides sign a document stipulating what their agreement is, then as soon as there is a dispute, whoops, one weasel handbag screams

"nope, that bit doesn't count.....I know we agreed it, but now we don't agree it, and this other bit of paper over here says we can ignore that bit of paper that we agreed on earlier."

 

[Ausprop]

without an abn the payer should withhold about half of the invoice

 

[ol mate]

Thanks for your input guys.

I have submitted an invoice, real estate will let me know if any problems.

It is surprising how quick these cost add up for the the tenant.

I really couldn't self manage as i am on the wrong side of the country 2 out of 3 weeks. Normally I would have the PM send in the maintenance guy but I am disposing them due to dismal service whilst the place is empty and tile repairs being done. I could have nit picked more but seeing as i was in there with a grinder cutting grout getting them to come clean the fans was kind of pointless.

I agree with joe D that PM take the path of least resistance, some of these girls are to young and too nice.

I will look into the matter further for future reference.

Cheers

 

[DaveM]

In NSW you can only claim for actual monetary losses, and not for your time if you elect to perform the work yourself.

 

[Dazz]

I agree with joe D that PM take the path of least resistance, some of these girls are to young and too nice.

...not at all. These 19 y.o. secretaries employed last month have now sat their 5 day course, past the 40 minute exam and are now fully qualified, fully certified professional property managers.

You can all now rest easy.

 

[cu@thetop]

PMs tend to take the line of least resistance, so tend to accept keys back from vacating tenants without pressing the tenant to implement the repairs prior to vacating. They always try to throw it back as the landlord's problem.

I always encourage (defaulting) tenants to leave with as little resistance as the alternative is that they trash the place or refuse to leave at all. The Tribunal will speedily evict them some 7-10 weeks later (the last one I did for a client took about 10 weeks because the tenant didn't show but sent a letter saying he was sick to the Registry so got himself an extra 2 weeks) but if you do the numbers it is better to repair it and quickly re-let then fight ongoing battles and pay legal fees.

Ultimately it is the landlord's problem if a property is damaged by a defaulting tenant or the rental has not been paid. It is a responsibility that comes with being a landlord. Just accept that although you may have a legal right against the tenant who has since moved interstate , enforcing that right may be uncommercial.

 

[bumskins]

This is the bit that drives me nuts.

Two reasonable, sane parties represented by consenting adults on both sides sign a document stipulating what their agreement is, then as soon as there is a dispute, whoops, one weasel handbag screams

"nope, that bit doesn't count.....I know we agreed it, but now we don't agree it, and this other bit of paper over here says we can ignore that bit of paper that we agreed on earlier."

I disagree,. If you want all the legal protection and enforcement of a contract then you should write it within the law. You cant have it both ways.

Another thing to consider when claiming damages, is the depreciated value of the item. You cant just charge the tennant the full replacement price for something.

 

[Dazz]

I disagree. If you want all the legal protection and enforcement of a contract then you should write it within the law. You cant have it both ways.

...assuming of course you've written it...

Of course, this argument goes back to the over-riding Act that governs the asset that you've bought. Anyone who has read the RTA governing housing knows it was an absolute joke and massively weighted towards the Tenant when they were written originally in the late 80's and early 90's.

With most of the states (NSW in 2010 I believe and WA in 2012) re-writing the Act to eliminate any morsel or scrap of advantage the Landlord had from the previous draconian legislation, such that the Tenant has been relieved of all responsibility now, there is nowhere to turn.

To my chagrin, I discovered too late (not enough research on my part) that the Retail Traders Act is almost as bad as the Residential Tenancy Act.

You can indeed have it both ways. Simply don't play in the sandpit. That involves not purchasing assets that fall into the sandpit in the first place.

Unfortunately, it is nigh on impossible to fully discover what pitfalls lie in the legislation awaiting you as an Owner until you are in the hotseat of responsibility and real life examples are thrust upon you.

 

[Dazz]

Ultimately it is the landlord's problem if a property is damaged by a defaulting tenant or the rental has not been paid. It is a responsibility that comes with being a landlord. Just accept that although you may have a legal right against the tenant who has since moved interstate, enforcing that right may be uncommercial.

Wise words CU. The conversations I have with lawyers regarding defaulting Tenants always end up with that paragraph.

Ultimately the Owner has to make a commercial decision whether to chase the defaulters or not. Obviously, this is where $ 100 per 6 minute time block for lawyers comes into play....and boy, don't the lawyers know it.

 

[Ed Barton]

Wise words CU. The conversations I have with lawyers regarding defaulting Tenants always end up with that paragraph.

Ultimately the Owner has to make a commercial decision whether to chase the defaulters or not. Obviously, this is where $ 100 per 6 minute time block for lawyers comes into play....and boy, don't the lawyers know it.

In a lot of cases it's worth getting your lawyer to write a 'legal' letter. Anything but small players will give you the one finger salute. Small players will shake and quiver and pay the requirement. In my experience it costs one unit of the lawyers time to write the letter and a couple of units of the secretary, who specialises in Ctrl a, Ctrl c, Ctrl v.