Comment on Qld country towns

Well,

We are here on holidays in Collinsville and surrounds, so naturally I took the liberty of having a sticky in the two real estate office windows over the past few days, along with having a drive by Scottville, Bowen and Proserpine.

Collinsville appears to be a one horse town, with the coal mine going gangbusters and the coal trains whizzing out to the coast.

I've been fortunate enough to have a brother-in-law in the coal industry and he was able to get me a guided tour of the working mine, with two big draglines removing the overburden (up to 50m) to expose the coal seams to be removed by the trucks and diggers (up to 2m thick).

Trains going by are horrendously loud...big loud diesel thumpers with 4 locomotives up the front and 78 coal trucks following behind. Each truck holds about 80 mT apparently.

Thats 6,500 mT of coal leaving the town every 2 hours. Coal is apparently worth $ 120 / mT, so each train has about 0.75M worth of coal on it. 12 trains a day.

9 M / day.....not a bad business.

Dunno what the cost of production is to get it out, but obviously it would be high, but not that high. Xstrata owns the mine but the whole show is run by Theiss mining contractors.


On the RE front, most of the high set houses are for sale for about 280K up to 360K. There are some lovely homes, with good folk tending to their garden. The empty ones look hideous....and there are quite a few for lease.

The BIL tells me that 6 years ago the houses were worth between 25 and 35K for a good one. They've seen a 10x growth in that time. Rents are about $ 250 p.w. for average stuff or more for good stuff. Very neg.

The SIL wants to sell up while the prices are high, before the coal industry goes belly up and the town reverts back to a backwater (maybe it is now ??)

Scottville was a real eye opener. Tiny little town, but because it's close to the mine site they are commanding high prices also.

Services are minimal, but the mine is building heaps of single man accom. which takes the sting out of the local leasing market.

Everything is centred around working men and their 4WD's, pig dogs and their beer. Fishing and boats are big here also, with lots of creek and crabbing activities. All good healthy activities to get you away from the TV. Internet and computer literacy is way way down. Most in the town cannot drive a computer.

The big thing is to own your house, own your 4WD, the boat and the caravan, have enough for your dogs and beer.....and that's it. Life and finances doesn't extend beyond that.

Fuel prices dominate, and thankfully for my industry, they consume heaps of it, thinking nothing of driving 2 hours to go for a swim, and then driving 2 hours back again. Doesn't seem right to me, but hey, that's what you need to do.

I cannot understand why people feel the need to talk as if they have no education at all, and there is a competition amongst men to sound less educated than the next man, clipping words off and basically not giving a stuff about anything. Doesn't matter what the subject, everyone's final comment on the subject is "yeah, I don't care about that".

Anyway, enjoying my time out here but feel very much a fish out of water.
 
Doesn't matter what the subject, everyone's final comment on the subject is "yeah, I don't care about that".

Maybe that's a good attitude - totally stress free? They don't need 10 IP's if they have everything they want.

Enjoy sunny Qld.

Cheers,

Bazza
 
Sounds like you have been hanging out at the Mac camp or one of the pubs with bored miners. Do not be fooled with with how they act there are some very smart people behind those front.
Working in such areas is not very demanding of the brain , 12hr shifts doing the exact same thing day in day out. But for 100k a year driving a dumper is inviting with 4 on 4 off roster.

Your info sounds a little off on the progress of Collinsville or you have never bothered to visit that area 5yrs ago.
There has been major improvements and some huge upgrades to ergon substations as the power demand has increased due to expanding.

I'm guessing you are a city boy as who the hell would go on a holiday to Collinsville ..lol
 
Very much so Bazza.....but I gather that was the attitude 30 years ago of all the pensioners I meet nowadays, everything is apples when you are working up to 65....but when you stop working, or emergencies....what then ??


Muffinman - agreed on some points, you can tell there are some very smart cookies out here with a "I don't give a stuff" attitude. I've come across it many times before in the mining and construction industries.....it's literally a defence mechanism so no-one can hurt you. I know how the game is played. Sad and destructive really, but there you have it.

4 days on, 4 days off...very appealling indeed. No thinking involved. No responsibility. no initiative. No inclination to better oneself. Absolutely refuse to be promoted. Us and them. Bosses are mongrels. Up the workers. So far Labor and Union orientated it's almost communist !!
 
Dazzling the 100k+ a year is not my life style...lol or yours by the sounds..
But at times it would be so good to have no responsibilities or care and still being paid good dollars..
 
Well,

Everything is centred around working men and their 4WD's, pig dogs and their beer. Fishing and boats are big here also, with lots of creek and crabbing activities. All good healthy activities to get you away from the TV. Internet and computer literacy is way way down. Most in the town cannot drive a computer.

The big thing is to own your house, own your 4WD, the boat and the caravan, have enough for your dogs and beer.....and that's it. Life and finances doesn't extend beyond that.

I cannot understand why people feel the need to talk as if they have no education at all, and there is a competition amongst men to sound less educated than the next man, clipping words off and basically not giving a stuff about anything. Doesn't matter what the subject, everyone's final comment on the subject is "yeah, I don't care about that".

Anyway, enjoying my time out here but feel very much a fish out of water.

LOL Thanks for sharing Dazzling.

I am in Mackay, just down the road. What you have described fits the picture here too, only the town is obviously much larger and the houses better looking. Miners and Tradies making so much cash, if you're not in the industry you just get left behind. Ah well, everyone deserves their day in the sun. It puzzles me to see so few people looking to the future while they have the capacity to invest some of those dollars.

We are not working in the industry as such but the mining boom had given our property investing a real kick start over the past 6 years and has thrown up some great opportunities for now and in the future. May the mining boom roll on for a good few years yet. :D

I don't think I would plan a holiday in Collinsville but I once had to spend a night in the 100 year old pub at Tairo when my car broke down on the way to Brisbane. It was a very memorable experience indeed.:eek: Enjoy your exploring.

Louise
 
Daz your description of Collinsville is spot on.

We lived in Collinsville for 4 years due to work commitments. Bought a house for $35,000...........sold it in 2004 for $68,000 just before prices went crazy.

I worked at the local high school and the teens used to boast that they don't need an education, as they will be earning 3 times the wage of teachers when they get a job in the mines. Some did end up working in the mines but just as many left town and did other things (thanks to their education).

Enjoy the rest of your stay........overall it is an interesting place with a fairly strong local community.

BTW the beaches in Bowen are worth visiting. Horseshoe Bay and Rose Bay are both secluded and scenic.

Cheers,
AnneDe
 
4 days on, 4 days off...very appealling indeed. No thinking involved. No responsibility. no initiative. No inclination to better oneself. Absolutely refuse to be promoted. Us and them. Bosses are mongrels. Up the workers. So far Labor and Union orientated it's almost communist !!

This is one big problem with Australian culture. Very lucky country in terms of natural resources - sadly, however, a big body of people who are not so big on the value add.

Mine automation will cut these type of jobs in the future to some degree. Mining co's should get migrants in to do the no brainer jobs for 1/2 the money in the meantime.
 
spot on Trogdor. it often seems 'clever country' etc doesn't fit in with the image aussies have of themselves, we are just lil aussie battlers in blue singlets. Now and then I am surprised to read something really innovative or clever and goves me hope that we can find the confidence to use our abilities
 
hi dazzling
give me the run down on mackay
do you see it as a market that will be growing in bounds
water views 1.6mil 2br units high end stuff
I have heard that it and gladston are moving and will move as more coal is dug out
whats your views and anyone else for that matter.
I know very little about the area but have to get up to steam on it very quickly hense I saw this post.
looking at these two areas in particular and both high end developments.
there is alot of high income people up there and they buy high end product.
will this continue.
awaiting your ideas
oh and
auspro I do try to have a couple of innovative ideas
have one comming up that will send you and may even send it with a photo of me in a blue singlet but I don't one yet
I have a hard hat will that do.
I have met alot of very sharp pencils and there are some very interesting projects around
The problem has been that because funding was easy to get( via easy lending and lots of cash around) alot of people thought that they are all merchant bankers and some people thought that they were commercial brokers.
As money has dryied up so have these people stopped getting these incomes and alot have left the market (hopefully a few more will follow them) and the others me included have been dragged back into the commercial market and re looking at alot of these projects and re jigging the numbers these are not just real estate but more project funding.
we have alot of chinese, korean and indians in the markets at the moment and they all have
very large pockets and alot have lots of money in them and these markets are where they are looking.
hence the reason for asking
 
I have three correction now two IPs in Mackay and I'm getting out.
Mackay is one of several cities around Australia where prices have gone too high and has been reflected in the almost zero growth in prices during 2007 - annual growth of up to 30 per cent had been recorded in the previous five years.
Recent flooding and consecutive interest rate rises are could be the part of the drop in growth.

For me it's now , Dysart ,Bowen and Proserpine.
Bowen holds Abbot point expansion and Proserpine has Cannonvale,Airlie beach push out with Shale oil more then possible.
Dysart with three new mines, with Vermont just starting up.
Bowen Basin Mining Towns investment views
 
I've just bought again in mackay. Prices are leveled off and some desperate people are dropping their price. But there is a lot of over priced properties around anyway and prices need to drop.

The floods haven't afected sales at all except in a few areas which were worst affected, parts of Glenella, Valetta, Egewater ... Underwater as my H calls it.

I could be wrong but I don't see prices going backwards in Mackay, they may stay stagnant for awhile but with tight rental market, big money around, and shortage of trademan for new builds, I think they'll go up before down, even if it takes awhile.

There are heaps of new developments happening in the area. The new lagoon is under way along the river, as is the convention center. A new hospital just been promised and a new development across from it, 3 story with accomodation and shops.

At least 5 high rise either under construction or starting soon in the city area. The first, Rivage is just completed and coming on the market now. The Pier is right over the river and units start at 1 million +

Northern beaches and beachs close to town are seeing the same with highrise units.

Myers just announced opening at Caneland Shopping Town.
The new Mayor is a business man who likes progress.

That's off the top of my head but I am no expert, just a local who tries to navigate the traffic jams that are becomin all to common!!
 
Mackay and Gladstone are similar from a point of view of lots of mining $$ but enough diversity (Gladstone- heavy industry/ Mky- Sugar, Tourism,etc) to hold prices during the low points of the cycle

High end of Mky is interesting- for a 2 bedroom unit >$1M I'd tend towards the stock overlooking the marina over the stock in the city. There is a mile of land along the river in the city with potential for apartments whereas the prime area around the marina is fairly developed

Other high end area of interest is big blocks on the beach at northern beaches (bucasia, shoal pt etc). Colleague just picked up older brick house on big block at shoal point for just over $1M- right on beach, great views. Not much new stock here though so no dep'n and lowish rents so take a bath on the cash flow. Interesting to see their value in 10 years though and probably have to be a better bet than the same $$ put into city units
 
Novar I hope you are right, yes prices are to high but many paid to much in the first place and I cannot see them dropping in a hurry.

There are many areas that are now classed as flood prone and will aways be remembered as this when people consider purchasing. Sales in these areas have dropped , and it is a big area some classed as prime locations.
Yes the Lagoon is underway after how many years of waiting, I know Rob from Woolams who is the project manager said it was on and off for years and thought it would never get off the ground.
.
A new hospital just been promised and a new development across from it, 3 story with accomodation and shops.
This has been promised endless times as well as a Sports stadium.

I have been around the Mackay area for 18+ yrs now and lots of hollow promises , but just maybe with Col Mengs team in power we will see some progress. But you need ( money) to make this happen.

The city heart is struggling with poor parking and poor shopping conditions.
Plus the increased violence and damage to shops is not encouraging tenants.
It's been a few months now but when we last looked for a shop to rent there was plenty empty in the city heart.
Canelands has killed it for the little guys who cannot afford the big rents .
As for Myers moving into Canelands I remember that claim 8yrs ago now.
I've given up what they claim to build on the show ground now..lol

As for Dolphin heads northen beaches area the traffick is a night mare and I had major trouble selling a house I built there due to this.

Wally There is a mile of land along the river in the city with potential for apartments whereas the prime area around the marina is fairly developed

I think you will find that land is protected, for years there has been battles.

Best of luck
 
Novar I hope you are right, yes prices are to high but many paid to much in the first place and I cannot see them dropping in a hurry.

Exactly ..and many people can afford to hang on to them with the big $. Are prices much dearer here than anywhere else with growth potential?.. not talking bundaberg or hervey bay!

There are many areas that are now classed as flood prone and will aways be remembered as this when people consider purchasing. Sales in these areas have dropped , and it is a big area some classed as prime locations.
Yes the Lagoon is underway after how many years of waiting, I know Rob from Woolams who is the project manager said it was on and off for years and thought it would never get off the ground.

Sorry this is rubbish ...there are a few suburbs with a hang over like Valetta Edgewater, Greenfields, Brardman Dr , Canberra St, etc, some parts of south mky (always were).

MOST area's that experienced minor flooding have NEVER seen it before and locals know it. Very unlikely to happen again in these areas. We had 6 inches in our street and the elderly neighbours have never seen that in their 35 years here!

I would NEVER have bought in Valetta or Edgewater in the first place for this very reason. My H has not called Edgewater -Underwater all these years for no reason.... same Greenfields. I lived on the hill behind greenfields for 2 years, talk was we would have a birds eye view of what would happen in a major downpour ... anyone still there did in fact get to see it.

What about the other 95% of the town ?
.

This has been promised endless times as well as a Sports stadium.

I didn't mention the sports statium.
The hospital is a different kettle of fish and will go ahead. The is a consortium of interested people who intend to make this happen
.


I have been around the Mackay area for 18+ yrs now and lots of hollow promises , but just maybe with Col Mengs team in power we will see some progress. But you need ( money) to make this happen.

I've been here 49 years, minus 10 in the middle !!

The city heart is struggling with poor parking and poor shopping conditions.

I never have a problem with parking in the city heart and often wonder what the whiners are on about. My D works in Sydney St and gets a park in gordon St every day....2 blocks for all day parking!! can brisbane or Sydney boast that?

Plus the increased violence and damage to shops is not encouraging tenants.
Maybe/maybe not.

It's been a few months now but when we last looked for a shop to rent there was plenty empty in the city heart.
Canelands has killed it for the little guys who cannot afford the big rents .

They could always move to all those empty city heart shops. Cheaper Rent and I'm advised it's a far better option for shop owners who don't have to put up with people manouvering trolly's with kids through their shops ... like in a shoping centre.

As for Myers moving into Canelands I remember that claim 8yrs ago now.

I've given up what they claim to build on the show ground now..lol
As for Dolphin heads northen beaches area the traffick is a night mare and I had major trouble selling a house I built there due to this.
I think you will find that land is protected, for years there has been battles.

Man aren't you just negative nelly !

And yet you see Dysart as a viable option!! What's there exactly?

If anything moranbah is a better option but I wouldn't even buy there ATM
 
'Just keep swimming, just keep swimming....' (Dory - Finding Nemo)

We have done very well investing in Mackay and Gladstone, yet every move we have made has been met with criticism from those locals we care about (and those we don't). If we had given weight to all the negative opinion, we'd be struggling to pay the rent on an average house here instead of enjoying the level of financial freedom that we now have. Sometimes locals can't see the forest for the trees.

Louise
 
And yet you see Dysart as a viable option!! What's there exactly?

If anything moranbah is a better option but I wouldn't even buy there ATM

Is this a trick question?.. have you kept up to date with areas out of Mackay.


I'm not about to quote all your replies but every thing you disagree on has constantly been raised in council and public as being an on going problem in Mackay.
 
lol, mining towns are very different and a real eye opener. I spent 2 years in Mount Isa and that was more than enough for me! I couldn't wait to get out in the end.
 
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