Helping friend with unsupportive husband

[moyjos]

Just got off the phone after LOOONG tearful discussion with a very good girlfriend.

She is a stay at home mum of 3 kids (she and hubby are both early 40's)
They have a nice PPOR (value mid 500's) with a bit of equity (about 200K)

She REALLY wants to invest and has been saving hard for a deposit. Cut a long story short. Hubby found out about her savings amount. He knew she was putting $$ into an ING account but thought it was just a "christmas account" type thing. She has managed to save nearly $40,000.

Well to say he hit the roof is an understatement. Although he has said yes to the idea of investing in the past he cannot see her saving as a good thing.

On an on about stealing "his" $$ and depriving him of "his" belongings etc etc.

How can she guide him ( if possible - we know you can lead a horse to water etc) OR how can she do it herself with no income??

(She is pretty sure the $40K is going to turn up in a new boat fairy soon


The poor woman is devastated and ready to leave. (which would be sad because even she says they have an OK marriage - just different dreams of the future)

 

[MissMuffitt]

Poor woman... She managed to save all that money and he didn't even know about it. So he never missed it...
If that was me and he used the money that I had saved to now buy a boat... I would probably consider leaving too.

Hope they can work it out in the end... Your a good friend for listening to her in this time.

 

[The Y-man]

Very tough one - go halves maybe?

The Y-man

 

[Dazz]

An uphill battle

An unwilling life partner who just isn't interested in investing at all is by far and away the largest obstacle for an investor to overcome.


Has anyone ever been successful in sprinting down the road of wealth with either a huge ball and chain clasped to your ankle, or worse still, someone with a rope tied to your waist who is pulling just as hard...or harder, in the exact opposite direction ??


The game we play as investors, unfortunately, goes to the very centre of married life. We don't do footy or cricket or netball. Our sport, it's training sessions, it's big match days and it's trophies attained, affects every aspect of married life.

 

[The Y-man]

She is a stay at home mum of 3 kids (she and hubby are both early 40's)
They have a nice PPOR (value mid 500's) with a bit of equity (about 200K)

She REALLY wants to invest and has been saving hard for a deposit. Cut a long story short. Hubby found out about her savings amount. He knew she was putting $$ into an ING account but thought it was just a "christmas account" type thing. She has managed to save nearly $40,000.

Hang on, I just reread this - do they still owe money on their home? Might be easier on hubby and her if they put the $40k towards the home loan?

Cheers,

The Y-man

 

[buzzlightyear]

Arguments about money are not about money or investing. There will countless be other issues that are driving his 'neanderthal' reaction about 'his' money.

Proceed with caution.

 

[moyjos]

Hang on, I just reread this - do they still owe money on their home? Might be easier on hubby and her if they put the $40k towards the home loan?

Cheers,

The Y-man

Yes they do still owe roughly 300K on their PPOR..

They are not under ANY pressure to pay the mortgage. He earns very good wages,

She just wants to get ahead a bit so he doesn't have to keep working 60-70 hrs a week etc etc (similar to most of us here)

Putting the 40K into the PPOR really wont make much difference to their lives at all.

She managed to save all that money and he didn't even know about it. So he never missed it...

Exactly again shows her budgeting skills and his income level.
She was planning on 1 or 2 cf- properties. She knew "she"could easily afford 300-350/w holding costs.

Poor thing she was soooooo close... her "magic" number was $50K then she thought she would be able to do it and he would go along.

 

[battler]

It doesn't matter how thin you make the pancake, it still has two sides, it would be better if we new his side from him as well.

He may have agreed to invest after the PPoR was paid off and feel cheated at this time, Who knows?

 

[Simon]

Arguments about money are not about money or investing. There will countless be other issues that are driving his 'neanderthal' reaction about 'his' money.

Proceed with caution.

Maybe she is just further down the journey than he is.

With time he may accept the idea. I recall my wife went spare when I bought my first home. She acted like I was off to the Casino...

 

[moyjos]

It doesn't matter how thin you make the pancake, it still has two sides, it would be better if we new his side from him as well.

He may have agreed to invest after the PPoR was paid off and feel cheated at this time, Who knows?

Fair and correct call

He has agreed to investing. He knows that the PPOR does not need to paid off. It is more a generic "when thë time is right" thing. She is not sure when that "time" is

 

[moyjos]

Maybe she is just further down the journey than he is.

With time he may accept the idea. I recall my wife went spare when I bought my first home. She acted like I was off to the Casino...

Yes I think you are spot on Simon.

You say YOU bought your first home... Any ideas how she can do it on her own with no income??

 

[Simon]

Yes I think you are spot on Simon.

You say YOU bought your first home... Any ideas how she can do it on her own with no income??

He was probably caught unawares and just reacted badly. I know women don't like secrets being kept from them and I guess men can be the same.

To clarify my situation I was engaged at the time and employed and kliving in a regional town as a young Lieutenant. I bought an old dump and we moved in and cleaned it up.

When I was actually looking and buying she was terrified I was going to lose my whole deposit.

Same was played out a few years later when I bought into the Woolworths float.

Seems her upbringing was to treat money as something you have to sweat for and that everyone is trying to take from you. Eight years ago I remember making a day trade and clearing $4000 in three hours. She treated me like I had stolen it - in her eyes someone had to have lost that money.

Looking back I can see that I missed a lot of opportunities because of her mindset.

Is hard for your friend to go alone. If a couple are going to invest then he really needs to at least allow her to do it happily even if he doesn't wish to get involved.

I would suggest that she try to catch him up to where she is. Maybe get him to read some motivational books or talk to someone like yourself who may get him fired up as to the opportunity out there.

If it is his money she needs to be spending then it really has to be with his blessing. We might think investing is the right path but it really is his choice.

 

[The Y-man]

shows her budgeting skills and his income level.
She was planning on 1 or 2 cf- properties. She knew "she"could easily afford 300-350/w holding costs.

Poor thing she was soooooo close... her "magic" number was $50K then she thought she would be able to do it and he would go along.

Where there's such a gap in objectives where she has to keep savings a secret, maybe the better way is to say $x for common family needs, $y for him to spend as he pleases, and $z for her. That way, if she puts enough aside from her "allowance" to buy an IP, great (he can help by providing the serviceability). He can also go an buy a boat or whatever with his savings.

The Y-man

 

[65fbk]

Maybe she should try to convince him to pay the $40k off the PPOR loan.. Then she can get it back by borrowing against the equity to buy an IP and he may not feel like "his" money has been spent on an investment, as it was paid off the PPOR.. Just an idea that may seem more palatable to him, but gets her the same outcome.

She deserves a pat on the back and if allowed to go on her merry way investing, I'm sure he will be grateful in the future. If they are "in their early 40's" and he earns "very good wages", but they only have $200k in their own home, I can see why she is motivated to do something other than buying a boat!

This bit:

He knows that the PPOR does not need to paid off. It is more a generic "when thë time is right" thing. She is not sure when that "time" is

makes NO sense at all and clearly says it will be paid off in 25ys.

 

[Simon]

Wonder what his mates are saying to him?

"Can't trust the wife? She has a secret account? What else is she hiding away from you?"

"Wont let you buy a boat? You earn the money and she hides it?"

Come on folks - there are always two sides to every story and we have heard one.

I can't believe we are calling this guy names and thinking he is in the wrong because his goals are different to the forumites ones.

 

[moyjos]

Wonder what his mates are saying to him?

"Can't trust the wife? She has a secret account? What else is she hiding away from you?"

"Wont let you buy a boat? You earn the money and she hides it?"

Come on folks - there are always two sides to every story and we have heard one.

I can't believe we are calling this guy names and thinking he is in the wrong because his goals are different to the forumites ones.

Yes PLEASE let's try and keep it positive.

Deep down my friend is trully just after a way to bring him üp to speed.

I don't really think she will leave him over this - she is tired and emotional right now.

 

[wobbycarly]

Arguments about money are not about money or investing. There will countless be other issues that are driving his 'neanderthal' reaction about 'his' money.

Proceed with caution.

I think this is the most important "issue" in the whole thing. And, moyjos, do you really want to "get involved"? I know I've been down a similar path, trying to convince 1 of a couple how they could get ahead, but from their POV, it HAS to be a partnership agreement, either as per Y-man, or they both get going together.

 

[Kath Russell]

This is how investing works in my house :

"Darling, once we sort out our current tenant issues & the bank's ready to give us more money, I'd like to buy another investment property".

- add smiling, supportive husband here -

"Can I please have a bigger boat"

No worries. $40K boat = where do you want me to sign. This was our exact scenario September, 2009. Works for me...........

Arguments about money are not about money or investing. There will countless be other issues that are driving his 'neanderthal' reaction about 'his' money.

I have to agree with this. He was probably shocked at the thought there was cash sitting around when it could have been used on 'stuff' he would have preferred it be spent on. Although you're a close friend, I don't believe ANYONE could possibly know another couple's complete relationship & why he'd react the way he did.

My husband & I are very happily married, best mates and nothing is sacred. We openly discuss everything, whether we want to hear it or not. We've been through enough friend's & families dramas to not let things affect our happiness. Life's too short. We have been together for nearly 20 years & couldn't possibly know each other any better. We've grown together. We still grow together. We are also very different. We both want each other to be happy independantly aswell as our family's happiness. He's not too interested in investing as such, but is very supportive of me continually educating myself for our financial future. He's fine with my subtle direction & instructions on what I'd like him to do to contribute to that planned future (ie get to work so we can fund more IP's!).

When asked if it upsets me he's not 'into' investing as much as me, we describe it as no different to me not being 'into' watching a 5 day cricket test, but I understand his dedication & enjoyment out of it and understand that it makes him happy.

I'd give him the $40K to buy his boat, aslong as he agrees to her ripping out all the equity in the house to go & buy her 2 IP's. Good luck to her, and their future. You're a good, caring friend. I know where you're coming from.

** I wonder what his reaction would have been if she'd managed to save all that money & actually bought him a boat with it instead of thinking of their family's future?!

 

[moyjos]

This is how investing works in my house :

"Darling, once we sort out our current tenant issues & the bank's ready to give us more money, I'd like to buy another investment property".

- add smiling, supportive husband here -

"Can I please have a bigger boat"

No worries. $40K boat = where do you want me to sign. This was our exact scenario September, 2009. Works for me...........


I have to agree with this. He was probably shocked at the thought there was cash sitting around when it could have been used on 'stuff' he would have preferred it be spent on. Although you're a close friend, I don't believe ANYONE could possibly know another couple's complete relationship & why he'd react the way he did.

My husband & I are very happily married, best mates and nothing is sacred. We openly discuss everything, whether we want to hear it or not. We've been through enough friend's & families dramas to not let things affect our happiness. Life's too short. We have been together for nearly 20 years & couldn't possibly know each other any better. We've grown together. We still grow together. We are also very different. We both want each other to be happy independantly aswell as our family's happiness. He's not too interested in investing as such, but is very supportive of me continually educating myself for our financial future. He's fine with my subtle direction & instructions on what I'd like him to do to contribute to that planned future (ie get to work so we can fund more IP's!).

When asked if it upsets me he's not 'into' investing as much as me, we describe it as no different to me not being 'into' watching a 5 day cricket test, but I understand his dedication & enjoyment out of it and understand that it makes him happy.

I'd give him the $40K to buy his boat, aslong as he agrees to her ripping out all the equity in the house to go & buy her 2 IP's. Good luck to her, and their future. You're a good, caring friend. I know where you're coming from.

** I wonder what his reaction would have been if she'd managed to save all that money & actually bought him a boat with it instead of thinking of their family's future?!

Thanks Kath. Your post will be very helpful.
I am passsing this thread on to my friend to read through. i am sure she will be cool and it will all work out.

I am not going to get too involved (says she convincingly to herself ) but I can be there to be a shoulder to cry on for a bit.

 

[virgo]

Wife's money

Hiya

Been down that path before with a husband who is not very interested in IP investing just in paying off the PPOR.

Ask your friend not to fret; think cleverly out of the square; it all boils down to clever negotiation techniques. Sit down with your friend; coolly and calmly work thru some strategies for a WIN WIN situation. Eg. you can have a deposit for a boat PROVIDEd ...........

From my personal experience. my hubby who is a very "technical and numbers man", i signed up a $99 Navra seminar a few years ago; told him i'll

look after the kids, and drove him off to the train station. He could not say no as i've already paid (plus he had a day off the kids.)

He got to mingle with other "men" , his eyes were opened and it was plain sailing from that day on...

Hope this helps; and above all, nothing is more important than the marriage (me thinks!)

Cheers