Live research. Feedback and learning steps.

Alright all, time to practice some live research (via computer only) FOR MY FIRST INVESTMENT PROPERTY!.

All feedback and criticism is welcome and the purpose of this is to refine and identify a best practice approach to the way research is conducted.

1. Get pre-admin stuff sorted (pre-approval, budget, assets-liabilities = investing capital), identify strategy (I'm going to do a simple buy and hold strategy because it's all I kind of know and fits my circumstances as I am relatively young and have time on my side). Budget is critical so you know how much you can actually afford

2. Identify which state / suburbs within the budget (my budget is MAX 300k) and I'm currently looking in QLD in Brisbane given it has good yields, and the stage of it's cycle means there is still opportunity for buyers.
The way I identified suburbs was through: http://www.realestate.com.au/invest/house-in-brisbane+city,+qld+4000

Such a powerful tool as it utilises heatmaps and you can sort prices accordingly (logic is also involved, that the further you go out it's also cheaper)

3. Check growth, and stage of cycle (from my understanding the stage of a property clock is generally determined by it's growth trend so you can download your chosen suburb from http://www.residex.com.au/free-report)
the realestate invest site I linked above also is a good tool.

4. If the cycle is going down of the suburb it might not be good to invest in right now (BUT DEFINITELY A GOOD SIGN THAT IT IS A BUYER'S MARKET and you will have the negotiating power so it's not too bad), if it's flat, not too bad, if it's going up, meh, might have a few opportunities if you've networked with agents well. Property clock stuff was tricky for me to understand and I'm starting to understand it now after 6 months after viewing countless videos/reading stuffs

5. Cool, you have a suburb now, write down the critical stuff about it. I have been looking at Kippa-Ring, Redcliffe, Beenleigh and Eagleby.

My reasons are because Kippa-Ring and redcliffe are beachy suburbs (which australians love and generally have the priciest houses across Australia) close to the city and are reasonably cheap ( I believe because it's hard to access by people given lack of transport). Also there's like hardly any land left. PRICES WILL ONLY RISE IF DEMAND EXCEEDS SUPPLY! THAT"S HOW PRICING WORKS IN BASIC ECONOMICS. This rarity factor in the peninsula, structures it well for future capital growth (and it's getting a train station so that will help immensely - like in 2016).

Eagleby and Beenleigh because they're affordable, and numbers are good (and stage of cycle seems to be very good). But what concerns me is the potential for new estates to pop up in future and thus result in oversupply - but overall, strong yields, and cheap price range with low vacancy).

6. Go to the LGA website and read their plans and things.
Google information about macros and micro things about the suburb, this means population growth, gdp, employment. http://www.logan.qld.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0008/83699/Sections-1-5.pdf this for Beenleigh has so much goddamn information. Read it!

Read about supply factors for property, including stock on market (I don't read this generally), days on market, vacancy (THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT BECAUSE IF A PLACE HAS HIGH VACANCY, means more competition with rental accommodation). Vacancy stuff can be found from here www.boomapp.com.au and http://www.sqmresearch.com.au/vacancy.php?t=1

Generally <2% very good , 3% I think is alright (dunno never invested, just going off what I've read from investing information).
Boomapp.com.au is good to get all this info and get a DSR score (which utilises a couple of demand and supply factors to make a ratio up to 48 although always cross verify your sources and check other websites for the same metrics because sometimes they differ.

7. Identify what sells the most in the suburb (this is preparing for you exit strategy, as there is no point of buying the Taj Mahal in a town which sells huts as that is a niche, or unless it's your strategy for some reason).
THe way to do this is hop onto www.domain.com.au, go to the sold section and type in your suburb and look at solds. NOW ON THE SIDE YOU CAN FILTER THROUGH SOME STUFF LIKE BEDROOMS BATHROOMS ETC. once you click on it you will see that the filters have a number next to the identifier of the metric, meaning If you click property type (the black arrow) - taking BEENLEIGH as exampl- you will see next to "House" it says in grey (158), and once you filter to house and then click on bedrooms, you will see "3 (102)" Identifying that 3 bedder houses sell the most in the suburb.

8. Check your solds - this is where it can get tricky for me, compare like with like, a weatherboard house might not be the same value as a brick house, and I think this is what takes the most time. Here identifying best streets and good parts of the suburb will require either going to the suburb or talking to agents (I'm bad at this as I procrastinate and don't really know what to ask). Identify highest house price sold in recent months (god knows what range and always compare like with like, maybe check up to 12 months). Identify the high point, low point and median (someone please help with this step). Is this just the lowest price paid for a house in the last couple of months and/or highest?

Also how do you value property from street to street?
Is it just kind of, if there's a comparable next to it and you bring your IP up to same standards, the bank would value it the same? Is that the general jist of it?

I will list some properties which I think are good deals using this approach in a bit
 
I will let the others deal with the stuff they know


Typically, for most scenarios I'd recommend NOT doing a pre approval since depending on your circumstances this may hurt your credit file if not used within a few days

If going to auction, or you are going for an unconditional purchase , or you have a credit issue or marginal lending capacity, then a pre approval may be useful

Ts

Rolf
 
Hey mate,

Great idea with the live research. Do you mind if I join you as I am in pretty much in the same situation.

I live in Sydney, looking for 2nd IP, have a budget of $420K, currently researching suburbs in Brisbane.

Check out my data so far. You can sort the data by columns.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...djiwgI0NkcygmPUWJaZA5YM/edit?usp=docslist_api

The data isn't completed yet, but basically I am looking for suburbs with:
- Good past population growth
- Low vacancy rate
- Low unemployment
- High owner-occupancy rate
- Low potential for new land supply closer to city
- Diverse employment generators (ie not just a mine or car factory)
- New infrastructure

So far I am also liking Kippa-Ring because it ticks all of the above boxes and new train station.

Once I have found some suburbs I will be travelling up to Brisbane early January. I can check out some suburbs for you if you would like.
 
Hi Sydney_Steve,

Thanks for sharing; it looks great!

I've tried to do something like that with data from realestate and yip etc. for median, rent, yield, annual cap growth etc but nowhere near as detailed as yours.

Are you thinking more house or unit?
 
Hi Sydney_Steve,

Thanks for sharing; it looks great!

I've tried to do something like that with data from realestate and yip etc. for median, rent, yield, annual cap growth etc but nowhere near as detailed as yours.

Are you thinking more house or unit?

Hi J,

Thanks :)

The data is based on houses where possible and on suburbs under the median house price for Brisbane.

I will keep collecting and maybe we can share our opinions on the data. Also if there is more data you would like I can add it.
 
Good start Achimy, Steve

Achimy, you ask about best practice. As I've learnt from other posts, the best practice is what works for you and you can repeat over (with a few tweaks to the edges).

I identify suburbs using my set of criteria through the back of magazines rather than going to an area where others are talking about or that you are familiar with. Going to the back of magazines will show up places you may not have even heard about but fit your criteria well (you can also expand your criteria as the magazines contain a number of criteria in the one table). When the magazines are released, the info is a few months old, but it will give you a good starting place.

I'm wondering what info you get from the Residex reports? You talk about investing at stages of the cycle. Can you expand further, I would be interested in your thoughts.

I like your comments about suburb demographics. I try to think about why someone would live in suburb x.

I've viewed the Boomtownapp. I'm not sure where they get their data from (I like to understand the background before blindly following). Remember that boomtownapp presents a snapshot in time rather than a trend.

You mention about cross referencing data. When I have cross referenced data, the data appears to differ by a little because each company has their own data sets and own ways of analysing it. I think the trick here is to be consistent with your data from month to month rather than constantly trying to find new data sets as you'll always come back with something different.

My 2c worth.
 
Any of you actualy own anything? Does your research actualy include going into a house?

The point of this is to get started and learn. As stated in the post, this is computer based, actually viewing the house is different, and I'd Argue enough threads around to learn that, but not enough to do computer based stuff. I also agree that everyone has their own way and I'm just posting this to get feedback and maybe learn from others and maybe help some newbs
 
Hey mate,

Great idea with the live research. Do you mind if I join you as I am in pretty much in the same situation.

I live in Sydney, looking for 2nd IP, have a budget of $420K, currently researching suburbs in Brisbane.

Check out my data so far. You can sort the data by columns.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...djiwgI0NkcygmPUWJaZA5YM/edit?usp=docslist_api

The data isn't completed yet, but basically I am looking for suburbs with:
- Good past population growth
- Low vacancy rate
- Low unemployment
- High owner-occupancy rate
- Low potential for new land supply closer to city
- Diverse employment generators (ie not just a mine or car factory)
- New infrastructure

So far I am also liking Kippa-Ring because it ticks all of the above boxes and new train station.

Once I have found some suburbs I will be travelling up to Brisbane early January. I can check out some suburbs for you if you would like.

The more the merrier, I'm looking for my first.

This is awesome ! Also are u going to the sydney meet? Hopefully we can discuss in person. I'll start discussing prices with u this week as I want to value houses so can get an idea of a good deal. I've got a good map on Googlemap engine which I think I can share if it has share functionality ( not at home ) but will keep u posted
 
The point of this is to get started and learn. As stated in the post, this is computer based, actually viewing the house is different, and I'd Argue enough threads around to learn that, but not enough to do computer based stuff. I also agree that everyone has their own way and I'm just posting this to get feedback and maybe learn from others and maybe help some newbs

Good on you Achimy. No need to pointless posts. Keep talking and thinking. Do plenty of reading through SS. There will be a lot who won't answer you directly but will talk about their own strategies in various threads that you could adapt to your own situation.
 
Any of you actualy own anything? Does your research actualy include going into a house?

I own one IP and a PPOR. We are doing this research to find the suburb, THEN look at individual houses.

10 out of 10 for the most useless comment so far, if you haven't got anything constructive to contribute don't enter the conversation.
 
The more the merrier, I'm looking for my first.

This is awesome ! Also are u going to the sydney meet? Hopefully we can discuss in person. I'll start discussing prices with u this week as I want to value houses so can get an idea of a good deal. I've got a good map on Googlemap engine which I think I can share if it has share functionality ( not at home ) but will keep u posted

When is the Sydney meet? I would be keen to go.
 
7. Identify what sells the most in the suburb (this is preparing for you exit strategy, as there is no point of buying the Taj Mahal in a town which sells huts as that is a niche, or unless it's your strategy for some reason).
THe way to do this is hop onto www.domain.com.au, go to the sold section and type in your suburb and look at solds. NOW ON THE SIDE YOU CAN FILTER THROUGH SOME STUFF LIKE BEDROOMS BATHROOMS ETC. once you click on it you will see that the filters have a number next to the identifier of the metric, meaning If you click property type (the black arrow) - taking BEENLEIGH as exampl- you will see next to "House" it says in grey (158), and once you filter to house and then click on bedrooms, you will see "3 (102)" Identifying that 3 bedder houses sell the most in the suburb.

Dont rely solely on this data as it can be misleading. In the suburb i am building in there are large parcels of land (900sqm min) and low density zoning so everyone is building large 4x2s (to fill up the block or make best use of it) and they dominate the sold section. The market only requires 1 or 2 bedroom houses and the local council has released a report urging developers to build smaller houses due to the high percentage of single and 2 person households. i.e the demographic (demand) does not match the supply.
 
Dont rely solely on this data as it can be misleading. In the suburb i am building in there are large parcels of land (900sqm min) and low density zoning so everyone is building large 4x2s (to fill up the block or make best use of it) and they dominate the sold section. The market only requires 1 or 2 bedroom houses and the local council has released a report urging developers to build smaller houses due to the high percentage of single and 2 person households. i.e the demographic (demand) does not match the supply.

Okay, great, thanks for the constructive (huehue, punny) feedback. I think for more built up areas, it's not too bad or unreliable. But what I should've probably added if I wasn't lazy is that local agents would generally be more helpful in providing the info. And I guess it's the best kind of info we cant get via computer reaearch.
 
Good start Achimy, Steve

Achimy, you ask about best practice. As I've learnt from other posts, the best practice is what works for you and you can repeat over (with a few tweaks to the edges).

I identify suburbs using my set of criteria through the back of magazines rather than going to an area where others are talking about or that you are familiar with. Going to the back of magazines will show up places you may not have even heard about but fit your criteria well (you can also expand your criteria as the magazines contain a number of criteria in the one table). When the magazines are released, the info is a few months old, but it will give you a good starting place.

I'm wondering what info you get from the Residex reports? You talk about investing at stages of the cycle. Can you expand further, I would be interested in your thoughts.

I like your comments about suburb demographics. I try to think about why someone would live in suburb x.

I've viewed the Boomtownapp. I'm not sure where they get their data from (I like to understand the background before blindly following). Remember that boomtownapp presents a snapshot in time rather than a trend.

You mention about cross referencing data. When I have cross referenced data, the data appears to differ by a little because each company has their own data sets and own ways of analysing it. I think the trick here is to be consistent with your data from month to month rather than constantly trying to find new data sets as you'll always come back with something different.

My 2c worth.


So what I gain from the residex reports it kind of like the growth cycle of the suburb. Take like logan or something as an example and you see like it fell 2 years, it went up 6 years etc etc. If that's any indication of the future, it's likely to go up. Also check the lowest price it fell to or previous highest price, it is definitely possible the house prices can go back up to the highest peaks. Some suburbs don't go down, but track sideways for a while, and I think these can be considered buyer's markets and if you want to grab a good deal, it would be good. If rents have been trending up, it generally tends to mean more demand than supply (for rentals), so prices might soon follow if people are wanting to rent, then maybe owner occupiers can move in. It's just about getting that property cycle feel.

I do use the back of magazines, but there are so many available tools online that no suburb is hidden :D, but definitely easier to sift through if they give you a suggestion of where to invest. But magazines are also made by humans at the end of the day, and what's to stop you from conducting you're own better due diligence. Hope it kind of helps, let me know if you want further clarification.
 
Hey mate,

Great idea with the live research. Do you mind if I join you as I am in pretty much in the same situation.

I live in Sydney, looking for 2nd IP, have a budget of $420K, currently researching suburbs in Brisbane.

Check out my data so far. You can sort the data by columns.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...djiwgI0NkcygmPUWJaZA5YM/edit?usp=docslist_api

The data isn't completed yet, but basically I am looking for suburbs with:
- Good past population growth
- Low vacancy rate
- Low unemployment
- High owner-occupancy rate
- Low potential for new land supply closer to city
- Diverse employment generators (ie not just a mine or car factory)
- New infrastructure

So far I am also liking Kippa-Ring because it ticks all of the above boxes and new train station.

Once I have found some suburbs I will be travelling up to Brisbane early January. I can check out some suburbs for you if you would like.

Mate here's the map I promised https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=zaf5Wm8aVwdE.kjQAwnV9JUjA let me know, it's just some properties and stuff and top performing schools around Brisbane. School performance and reputation is a great indicator of wealth and a affluence of an area. Pm me email, I'll allow you to edit if you wish :)
 
Hi Achimy,

Thanks for sharing that link - where did u get your list of best schools from?

I do agree 1 of the considerations could be areas with good schools around. In Melb the asians are all trying to get into the school zones of Balwyn and Glen Waverley etc...

Do you think by the time you've done your research your budget could be above 300k which might give you more options?
 
Hi Achimy,

Thanks for sharing that link - where did u get your list of best schools from?

I do agree 1 of the considerations could be areas with good schools around. In Melb the asians are all trying to get into the school zones of Balwyn and Glen Waverley etc...

Do you think by the time you've done your research your budget could be above 300k which might give you more options?

I just got the list of schools via a google search and used some google map engine to plot them on. Pretty powerful as u can add diff layers and items . as my circumstances change, will definitely expand and refine my buying criteria. I'd prefer to buy blue chip real estate but too pricey and I cant afford to negatively gear
 
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