Marriage in Trouble

[ice]

I've been married for nearly 20 years, & have 2 teenagers.

I was reading the thread about Simon & his marriage break-up & in particular one post where he mentioned that he was actually much happier as it felt like a brooding teen had left home, & I came to realise that I could relate to that & that I was actually jealous. Now that the kids have their own lives, I find I am bored & we really have nothing to talk about. My partner has become quite argumentative over petty little things, will not drop a subject, must have the last word on everything & I find myself not wanting to spend any time together.

I believe that a marriage is forever & that if both parties are willing to put in the hard yards it will survive, so long as there are no little hidden nasties like abuse etc. I get the feeling that he no longer is trying & I find I am trying less & less. I really don't like the feelings that I am having or how to stop them.

 

[Noeyedear]

Hi Ice,
I know where you are coming from and I think most marriages at some stage people have the feelings you are having. At about the 15yr mark of our marriage I just didn't think we had any thing in common. Nothing to talk about it. Our life was consumed with giving our children a start in their life.

Dont ge me wrong I am not saying we didn't love/care for each other. But I really thought we may have run our course at one stage. From about the 15yr to 20yr in our marriage we went through the motions a little bit I think.

About 20yr mark we went on a Cruise which we had done twice before but this time it was without the kids. I had been reading a book at the time about a chinese ballet dancer who made his way through communist china. In that book was some sort of chinese fables. The gist of it was to put everything into your life. It made me think had I really been putting everything into our marriage.

It was amazing the change in our marriage once I had my priorities right i.e. wife number1 daylight 2nd. Since then I have to say we have found so much in common so much to talk about. I hope you can find that yourself but I don't know how you make that come about. Wish you all the best it is incredibly worth it if you can make it work.

 

[ethereal]

Hi Ice,

We went through a difficult patch a while back where my husband seemed to give up trying and we separated. There was not major event that took place, he just felt as though he had fallen out of love. The time leading up to the separation was very very difficult and miserable for me as the harder I tried, the worse things seemd to get.

When he left, I too felt a great sense of relief that developed into a feeling of being free to choose what I wanted out of life. I still loved him and wished the best for him, even if his happily ever after wasn't to be with me. His happiness was no longer my responsibility which was a huge weight off my shoulders.

I began to persue my own interests which had fallen by the wayside over the course of our marriage, getting into my sport, training, going for walks every day and visiting friends, renovating and gardening. I had a fantastic time and felt really happy.

I kept in contact with my husband, even helped him look for a house to by and initiated separation of assets, bank accounts etc. Thing is, he was even more unhappy without me and the more I picked myself up, the more I became like the woman he married. He felt he had made a mistake, but not before I felt had put it all behind me. After a second 'courtship' we got back together. It was the hardest thing I've ever done, but 7 years and 2 babies later, I can say it was the right decision for us.

The thing is, I think you can lose yourself trying to keep other people happy, especially with children in the picture. I have learned I can't be responsible for his happiness, but I am responsible for mine. I have to make time for the things I like and I encourage him to do the same. Even better is making time for the things we like to do together. We still iritate each other sometimes and in no way have it anywhere near right but we enjoy the journey together. Persuing our interests gives life meaning and makes us interesting.

Good luck with it.

Louise.

 

[Pushka]

Thing is, he was even more unhappy without me and the more I picked myself up, the more I became like the woman he married.

That is such an interesting observation. Must give that one some more thought!

 

[DavidMc]

I'd try Relationships Australia. Couldn't hurt?

 

[Perp]

ice, both noeyedear and ethereal have given you some excellent advice. I must agree that, as Dr Phil says (sorry!), "marriage is not about finding the right partner, it's about being the right partner". That does not for a moment mean that I'm saying that your marriage difficulties are your, or your partner's, fault.

What it does mean is that we have to be "fully ourselves"; usually, that's who our spouse fell in love with, and often, that's the person who gets lost in the routines of paying bills, raising kids, etc. (I've been guilty of this myself; fortunately not sufficiently to do lasting damage to my wonderful 14 year marriage.) But if you invest some time and energy in remembering who you really are and pursuing your passions, you'll probably find that your spouse does the same, and that each of you are more attracted to the other as a result. You'll also feel more interest in being a passionate partner, and you'll find that this energy feeds on itself and things will improve every day.

A good exercise that ethereal went through is to ask yourself "if I had nobody else to consider, what would I love to do today, tomorrow and next year?" It's a good mental exercise to identify what you're really passionate about. Then try and do as many of these things within your current lifestyle as is possible.

Also see if you can do some things that you used to enjoy together but may have fallen out of the habit of doing, such as going to movies, out to dinner, for picnics, for evening walks, or whatever it was that you used to really enjoy doing together.

Well done, ethereal and noeyedear, and I'm so glad that things worked out for you both.

 

[BayView]

A good marriage is hard work. The harder you work, the better it is.

You both have to sacrifice, compromise, put in effort to do things together, go away on trips; even if it is only camping in a tent for 2 days with a fire and some nice wine, cheese and bikkies and watch the sunsets (girls love that stuff). I actually like it too.

Once the trying stops, the end is not far away.

My wife and I have been married for 14 years this March, together 18 altogether. God! (just kidding).

We are still in love and both still try to think of things to do - together.

Today the wife said she was going to the gym for a workout. I didn't feel like it; it's cold, raining cats and dogs, but I thought: "bugger it; I'm going too".

We spent a really nice hour and a half together, then had some soup for lunch and she went to work. Nice.

Stuff like that.

Be spontaneous. organise surprises, or an impromptu dinner and a movie.

One other thing I also really believe is that you owe it to not just yourself, but to your partner; to stay in good physical shape so they still find you attractive. Most people start off being physically attracted to a degree.

If you let yourself go, and make no effort, or don't respect or love yourself, then your partner may lose interest in you; just as you have.

More hard work.

 

[ice]

Hi Ice,

We went through a difficult patch a while back where my husband seemed to give up trying and we separated. There was not major event that took place, he just felt as though he had fallen out of love. The time leading up to the separation was very very difficult and miserable for me as the harder I tried, the worse things seemd to get.

When he left, I too felt a great sense of relief that developed into a feeling of being free to choose what I wanted out of life. I still loved him and wished the best for him, even if his happily ever after wasn't to be with me. His happiness was no longer my responsibility which was a huge weight off my shoulders.

I think this is what I need. Just some time to myself, to get myself together. I do still love him, but it is not right & I find myself being belittled too frequently. I also get the feeling that he feels he could do better, by some of the backhanded comments he makes every so often. I really don't appreciate that. I feel that my self worth is at an all time low & I need a "pick me up".

Not sure how to suggest that I need some time away, as I really don't want a separation.

 

[ice]

I'd try Relationships Australia. Couldn't hurt?

Well, yeah, it could. If he has no idea that I am feeling this way, then the last thing I would want is to suggest a Councillor. Besides, I really don't want someone like that inside my head.

Don't mind talking about it here as I don't know anyone personally & he doesn't come here.

 

[The Y-man]

Not sure how to suggest that I need some time away....

Any relatives you urgently need to visit in another city or country?

Cheers,

The Y-man

 

[ice]

Any relatives you urgently need to visit in another city or country?

Cheers,

The Y-man

I wish! I have no family.

 

[ethereal]

Not sure how to suggest that I need some time away, as I really don't want a separation.

Something I had thought of doing, but haven't done on my own yet is to go on an organised tour, not an oldies thing, but something like that offered by Intrepid Tours where you go with a small group of other people to somewhere interesting. We did this together and really loved meeting and getting to know the other people in our group and surviving the adventure together. (ours was quite physically challenging, there was not a girl/woman who was not in tears at some stage or other! Not with intrepid though!) Only if travel interests you though.

There is also truth in the saying - absence makes the heart grow fonder. Perhaps you will find that you and your husband appreciate each other more after some time apart. And he may see that you more as an independent and capable person, not to be taken for granted.

Louise

 

[Francesca C]

Hey Everyone

I am in my late 20's. So not as experienced as most of you.

I believe a marriage has three lives. A life for him, a life for her and your life together... I do not think it is healthy to confuse them, nor is it healthy to forget about who you are and what you want as an individual.

You need quality time for yourself and together.

I think people forget and start taking each other for grantied and slowly the relationship breaks down after 15 plus years and you then forget why you were even together.

We really need to just learn to love and accept our partners!

Stephen R Covery discusses in the first chapter of his book a man that didnt love his wife anymore for all these different reasons.... his advice was

"Worry about what you do and how you respond and the way you treeat her, just love her"

If you give your partner all that you have and lead by example, it will be reciproacted.

 

[Peter_Tersteeg]

Well, yeah, it could. If he has no idea that I am feeling this way, then the last thing I would want is to suggest a Councillor. Besides, I really don't want someone like that inside my head.

Don't mind talking about it here as I don't know anyone personally & he doesn't come here.

I'm lucky that I've never felt this way about my wife, I adore her, we've been together for over 10 years.

It does seem to me (I could be very wrong), that you need to get things out in the open. You've mentioned that he makes hurtful remarkes that make you think he beleives you're not worth of him. He could be saying this out of ignorance.

A good partnership is about open an honest comminication. Both with your partner and yourself.

 

[Aaron Sice]

3 stages of a relationship
eros = 0-2 years. where the word "erotic" comes from. i shouldn;t need to spell this definition out.

philos = 2-7 years. building the fundamentals of a relationship, or the philsophy behind being together. the beginning of philos was generally the end of the the courtship. however lately the end of philos is now when people get married. trouble is, philos is the stage that sex dries up up as you work out the fundamentals together, which is the main known problem behind the " 7 year itch".

agape = 7+ years. children, mortgages, schooling, investments, car crashes, mid life crises all come under this category.

i think there should be something after agape, like agape being 7-20 years and call it bylon (as in ba-BYLON) for 20+ years where you realise you have such a strong bond that now there is nothing to focus on but each other and to enjoy the fruits of your labour (grandkids, super, holidays etc).

my thoughts anyways. eros-philos-agape is an ancient idea, but certainly worth looking at to understand more about you own position.

unfortuantely, no one tells you what happens during or "after" agape.

 

[BayView]

Well, yeah, it could. If he has no idea that I am feeling this way, then the last thing I would want is to suggest a Councillor. Besides, I really don't want someone like that inside my head.

Don't mind talking about it here as I don't know anyone personally & he doesn't come here.

You really need to say to your husband: "we need to talk".

It will be hard, but it needs to be done soon.

Based on what you're telling us, he sounds as though he is unaware of your feelings right now.

This has to be addressed.

He may be feeling exactly like you, but also afraid to say something. Men are worse at this stuff than women as a rule, so take the initiative and schedule some time for a heart-to-heart.

 

[wylie]

I agree with LA Aussie. According to the statistics, many, many men whose wives leave them just have NO idea that there was anything wrong.

Let's face it, much as we love 'em, men just don't "talk" about relationships like women do. We women can have a counselling session over a coffee with our friends, but men generally don't do this, so do not air their worries or annoyances to other men.

We women know that talking about something gets it out of our heads and lets us get it into perspective. Men tend to stew. I know I am generalising, and all men are not like this, but plenty of them are.

I would gently bring up the subject. He may think his put downs are his way of being funny, or him trying to let you know he doesn't like your new hairdo or whatever issues he has, but doesn't know how to "talk" about it (just guessing here as I don't know what is said).

Don't leave it too late to salvage your marriage.

 

[Noeyedear]

Ice,
Wylie is pretty accurate in this statement. I have to put my hand up and own up to this.
There is no way I would have talked about my relationship with my wife to anyone and certainly not to another male. I guess it is just men are from mars and women from venus.
Talking may or may not get things back on track. But by not talking there is only one way it can go. I really hope you can work it out.

Let's face it, much as we love 'em, men just don't "talk" about relationships like women do. We women can have a counselling session over a coffee with our friends, but men generally don't do this, so do not air their worries or annoyances to other men.

We women know that talking about something gets it out of our heads and lets us get it into perspective. Men tend to stew. I know I am generalising, and all men are not like this, but plenty of them are.

 

[Simon]

I agree with LA Aussie. According to the statistics, many, many men whose wives leave them just have NO idea that there was anything wrong.

Let's face it, much as we love 'em, men just don't "talk" about relationships like women do. We women can have a counselling session over a coffee with our friends, but men generally don't do this, so do not air their worries or annoyances to other men.

We women know that talking about something gets it out of our heads and lets us get it into perspective. Men tend to stew. I know I am generalising, and all men are not like this, but plenty of them are.

I would gently bring up the subject. He may think his put downs are his way of being funny, or him trying to let you know he doesn't like your new hairdo or whatever issues he has, but doesn't know how to "talk" about it (just guessing here as I don't know what is said).

Don't leave it too late to salvage your marriage.

I agree. If you have a problem and have said nothing then chances are he is thinking everything is fine. Don't expect him to be intuitive enough to read your mind.

Talk to him before you meet someone else and there is no opportunity for him to address your concerns.

If you keep expecting him to know your feelings you will get more and more frustrated with his inability to read the situation. Then when you go he will feel like a train has hit him.

Please don't waste everything you have had together. Tell him how you feel and ask him to join you for professional help - don't just try to sort it out yourselves. There is too much at stake.

In his way he loves you more than you are telling yourself he does. Just make sure he has a chance to fix things. Not allowing him a chance to know how you feel and giving him no time to act will be the bitterest memory he will have of you when you are gone.

Sorry that I am not more articulate but I hope you get the gist of what I am saying. He just is unable to intuit your emotions and the unhappier you get the worse things will become and the more you will blame him.

Please do what you can to tell him that there is a problem that is threatening to destroy his world, it may take a bit to get it through his skull but when he realises what is at stake he will change.

All the best

 

[evand]

Or maybe not. Maybe he knows exactly whats going on and doesn't want to be in the marriage anymore.

Who knows? Not all guys are the same.

Please do what you can to tell him that there is a problem that is threatening to destroy his world, it may take a bit to get it through his skull but when he realises what is at stake he will change.

All the best