Need help with how to best evict tenant who is abusive when drunk

A

Anh

Hi All,

I would really appreciate your feedback on how to best evict my current tenant who is abusive when drunk and how to resolve my issues with my rental house.

I manage my own rental property and rent them out by room to 6 people, each with individual lease and lodge the bond with RTA. Most of them are long term tenant 1-2 years and no trouble.

One of them who has been there nearly 1.5 years and he pays rent on time but the only problem is he does not get a long with other tenants and when he is drunk, he is very hard to deal with.

Today i had been called over to settle the issue with loud music he turned on last night when he was drunk, he came out and very aggressive with other tenants and threaten to hit one person, threw ice cubes over another person, so i called the police.


I will speak to the abusive tenant tomorrow when he is sober and will ask him to leave. Not sure how it would turn out but i would like him to leave immediately ( as i read the RTA website: immediately if the tenant cause danger to another person) or given he has been there a while to give him 1 week-2 weeks notice so he can find another place. I would prefer him to leave immediately but not sure how he would take it.

i think i have few issues to deal with:

1. Manage the property myself: time consuming however the house is hardly ever vacant (3%) and add about $$6-8k more than renting the whole house via agent which helps my cashflow significantly.

2. I rent the house by room:

-issues with Council (might be illegal ? as i rent to 5-6 unrelated people - not students, all professionals/workers)


- bank do not want to revaluate to release equity and they might consider it commercial lending rate or low LVR.

- issues with insurance: as i understand now i will need to buy specialised insurance as the normal LL insurance won't be enough to cover.

The solutions i can think of to get around the issues are:

Option1: Still rent the house by the room but :

1. Contact the Fire safety consultant to make the place complied to Council requirements, thank you to our forum member for the contact details.

2. Get all the tenants to sign one single lease to get around bank lending

3.Buy specialised insurance.

Option2: rent the whole house out via agent

At this moment i find it very hard to be persistent as there are a lot of obstacles, i guess that is part of life, i just have to deal with it one at a time.

Thank you all for sharing your experience and providing advice and support.

Much appreciated.

Anne
 
Perhaps you can talk to him and others to see what the hatred is all about - it could get resolved. He may not know his shortcomings until someone lets him know.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
JWR said:
Perhaps you can talk to him and others to see what the hatred is all about - it could get resolved. He may not know his shortcomings until someone lets him know.
Click to expand...

Thank you JWR but i have done that in the past. He is just a different person when drunk. I would not risk it again and would not want him to cause injury to other tenants.

Not worth the stress at all, i just want him to move out peacefully.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I think it's important to show that you are in control. I have had to do the same with a tenant when I rented by the room a couple of years ago. Gave him 1 weeks notice. I didn't even go into any RTA stuff. Just told him what he had done, that it was not tolerated and that he had to get out.

Today, that house is rented through an agent, but with a special clause allowing the tenant (who was one of the previous tenants renting by the room) the right to sublet the house. This allows me to charge over market rate and the whole issue of dealing with multiple tenants/insurance/banks is now his problem, not mine. :)
 
If he doesnt agree to leave, and there is really a danger when he is drunk, one of the other tenants could take out an AVO.
 
dan75 said:
I think it's important to show that you are in control. I have had to do the same with a tenant when I rented by the room a couple of years ago. Gave him 1 weeks notice. I didn't even go into any RTA stuff. Just told him what he had done, that it was not tolerated and that he had to get out.

Today, that house is rented through an agent, but with a special clause allowing the tenant (who was one of the previous tenants renting by the room) the right to sublet the house. This allows me to charge over market rate and the whole issue of dealing with multiple tenants/insurance/banks is now his problem, not mine. :)
Click to expand...

Thanks Dan75 for your advice. One thing i am not quite clear is how you can charge over market rent if you sign one lease with the tenant ? as i would have thought that renting by the room increases the rent ?
 
Anh said:
Hi All,

I would really appreciate your feedback on how to best evict my current tenant who is abusive when drunk and how to resolve my issues with my rental house.

I manage my own rental property and rent them out by room to 6 people, each with individual lease and lodge the bond with RTA. Most of them are long term tenant 1-2 years and no trouble.

One of them who has been there nearly 1.5 years and he pays rent on time but the only problem is he does not get a long with other tenants and when he is drunk, he is very hard to deal with.

Today i had been called over to settle the issue with loud music he turned on last night when he was drunk, he came out and very aggressive with other tenants and threaten to hit one person, threw ice cubes over another person, so i called the police.


I will speak to the abusive tenant tomorrow when he is sober and will ask him to leave. Not sure how it would turn out but i would like him to leave immediately ( as i read the RTA website: immediately if the tenant cause danger to another person) or given he has been there a while to give him 1 week-2 weeks notice so he can find another place. I would prefer him to leave immediately but not sure how he would take it.

i think i have few issues to deal with:

1. Manage the property myself: time consuming however the house is hardly ever vacant (3%) and add about $$6-8k more than renting the whole house via agent which helps my cashflow significantly.

2. I rent the house by room:

-issues with Council (might be illegal ? as i rent to 5-6 unrelated people - not students, all professionals/workers)


- bank do not want to revaluate to release equity and they might consider it commercial lending rate or low LVR.

- issues with insurance: as i understand now i will need to buy specialised insurance as the normal LL insurance won't be enough to cover.

The solutions i can think of to get around the issues are:

Option1: Still rent the house by the room but :

1. Contact the Fire safety consultant to make the place complied to Council requirements, thank you to our forum member for the contact details.

2. Get all the tenants to sign one single lease to get around bank lending

3.Buy specialised insurance.

Option2: rent the whole house out via agent

At this moment i find it very hard to be persistent as there are a lot of obstacles, i guess that is part of life, i just have to deal with it one at a time.

Thank you all for sharing your experience and providing advice and support.

Much appreciated.

Anne
Click to expand...
I would be checking with the Qld Fire Safety Laws for this set-up,and the insurance factor would be a risk if something like this gets nasty and hes drunk and out of control then fire may be also a problem imho you are out in the open with this all it takes is someone to understand the way the legal system works..
 
If you are aware of the insurance issues and the problem of renting to unrelated parties, why haven't you done something before now. You are taking a huge risk in my opinion.

Is it only that you are having an issue with one tenant that you are looking at getting the fire department involved?

It sounds like you are renting this room by room via an agent? Doesn't the agent know the rules?

It also sounds like you need the extra rent from renting room by room.

For me it is simple... get it sorted legally so that you can rent room by room... or do what is legal and rent the whole house out.

I would NOT be risking everything I have for an extra $8K per year, when one little problem could bring everything crashing down.

I'm assuming here that should something go wrong, the house burn down, the insurer will say "sorry, it didn't comply as a boarding house, therefore you are uninsured." Who do you think will be sued? Will you have insurance cover?

Doesn't bear to think about how you would fare should that happen. You would lose way more than just that house.
 
kathryn d said:
Offer the tenant some money if he moves today.
Bribery..or incentives... work well with some people.
Click to expand...

Despite the last sentence being true, I am truly surprised by the first

Anh, be interested to know how the meeting went today if you care to share In theory, I'd like to do what Dan75 did.
 
Anh said:
Thanks Dan75 for your advice. One thing i am not quite clear is how you can charge over market rent if you sign one lease with the tenant ? as i would have thought that renting by the room increases the rent ?
Click to expand...

Because there are two contracts. One between dan75 and his tenant, who is now the 'head tenant', for $X per week. This head tenant can then sub-lease the property room-by-room for $X+$Y, but officially dan75 has no involvement in this. So the total rent can be higher.
 
Anh, chances are you wont change an alcoholic's behaviour unless they go to AA.

Surprised how the other tenants put up with it.

You have to get rid of him straight away. Take legal action. You have plenty of witnesses to his behaviour. Good Luck.
 
datto said:
Anh, chances are you wont change an alcoholic's behaviour unless they go to AA.

Surprised how the other tenants put up with it.

You have to get rid of him straight away. Take legal action. You have plenty of witnesses to his behaviour. Good Luck.
Click to expand...

I have just spoken to him and asked him to leave as soon as possible and the latest is this Sat. He said he would let me know when he finds a place this week.

I think my problem is not understanding the rules/regulations

I have also asked my other tenants (4) to sign a single lease ( which means i won't rent by the room any more). This way my understanding is that i can get around the issues with Council/Bank/Insurance. Am I correct ?

Thank you all

Anne
 
Aaron_C said:
Because there are two contracts. One between dan75 and his tenant, who is now the 'head tenant', for $X per week. This head tenant can then sub-lease the property room-by-room for $X+$Y, but officially dan75 has no involvement in this. So the total rent can be higher.
Click to expand...

Exactly. I'm not sure if this would have been possible had I not managed the property myself prior to this arrangement. I think I was only able to do it because I recognized that one of the 'boarders' had a good job, was responsible, and was smart enough to understand the talk I gave him about the possibility of living in the house almost 'rent free' by sub-letting the other rooms. You just have to find the right person who can think outside the square.

Basically, we first made a verbal agreement on the weekly rent under his name only. I then engaged a PM to set up the lease: no advertising fees or other charges. This one turned out pretty good.
 
'I have just spoken to him and asked him to leave as soon as possible and the latest is this Sat. He said he would let me know when he finds a place this week."

Yeah right, I can only be cynical of his response. To me, this fella's behaviour is abhorent. I bet ya he's manipulative. He probally needs 3 years to find another place. Keep on top of him. Don't let him squeeze more time out of you.

"I think my problem is not understanding the rules/regulations "

hey, thats why you got us at somersoft!

"I have also asked my other tenants (4) to sign a single lease ( which means i won't rent by the room any more). This way my understanding is that i can get around the issues with Council/Bank/Insurance. Am I correct ?"

I think so, but look, Im no expert on this matter. All my properties have single leases and no probs so far.
 
Form 18A doesn't specify a limit to the number of people who can be under one single lease. It does, however, have up to 4 fields under Item 2, where the different tenants are listed. I guess the majority of leases wouldn't need more than 4 separate names.

One of our other properties has 3 people listed in the lease. There was nothing special about setting up that particular lease (different house to the one I mentioned earlier).

I also agree with datto about the first point. It is none of your concern to learn 'when he finds a place this week'. This is where you go "No mate, you don't get it, you need to be out of here by "X" date. If you are unable to find a place, you will have to stay with a friend or relative as there is someone else moving in on that date".
 
dan75 said:
Form 18A doesn't specify a limit to the number of people who can be under one single lease. It does, however, have up to 4 fields under Item 2, where the different tenants are listed. I guess the majority of leases wouldn't need more than 4 separate names.

One of our other properties has 3 people listed in the lease. There was nothing special about setting up that particular lease (different house to the one I mentioned earlier).

I also agree with datto about the first point. It is none of your concern to learn 'when he finds a place this week'. This is where you go "No mate, you don't get it, you need to be out of here by "X" date. If you are unable to find a place, you will have to stay with a friend or relative as there is someone else moving in on that date".
Click to expand...

Thanks Dan75, i did tell him to leave by Sat the latest but i would like him to move out earlier/asap. You are right i need to be tougher.

I did checked Form 18A today and also spoke to one agent who i will meet with on Monday, she told me that all tenants would need to be on the lease, not mentioning how many can live at the house. ( i read the house code from BCC and 5 unrelated people can live in one house).

Now i actually am not interested in sub-letting , i like what you have done Dan75: engaged the agent in setting the lease up so all tenants go on the same lease, else i will ask the agent to advertise and manage the place for me.

I want to do the right thing to avoid unnecessary stress.
 
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