Self Defence

[eXc]

First step is involve teachers, principal and parents. See how you go.

unfortunatley in my experience, defense in its self isn't enough.Cracking a bully and taking him to the ground will end with the entire class/school laughing at him. Especially if he is dropped by the little kid.

My mistake at school was just taking the bullying. Teachers wouldn't do anything. In hind sight, I would just smash them. I saw it happen a few times at my school and it was the only way.

I will never forget the day, that after 4 years of bullying "The gay kid" (who wasn't gay) had enough of getting bullied, he dropped the bully in one hit, the bully was picked on so much after that, he change schools. Ironically to the same school I changed to. Funny how he didn't pick on me at the new school where I could have shared the story with others...

Another friend of mine, similar scenario, he ened up snapping, it took 3 big guys to get him of the bully, he had his thumbs pushed into his throat and was going to kill him. Sure, that was wrong, but no-one ever messed with him again cause he was crazy!


The thing I would suggest you be careful of with martial arts, is some kids start telling everyone " I know xxxxxx" well you will soon be challenged by people wanting to prove how tough they are.

 

[Cartoon]

This is in interesting read hearing lots of people talk about karate and akido and such. I have done many many different styles and will say that there is no such thing as the best type to do, some are how ever more effective in situations then others.

Martial arts get broken into 2 main areas - sport and defence, these areas get broken down again into another 2 - traditional and non traditional.

So do you want your son to learn sport or defence?

Now traditional arts and teachings take a long time for the skills to be usefull, non traditional arts are a little quicker at learning. Sport styles are good for one on one issues but dangerous if there is the issue of more than one person.

Here is a little brake up for you,
sport - boxing, kick boxing, bjj, tae kwon do, judo, i also class most karake styles in here.
Defence - jeet kune do, akido, Krav maga are the better of them.

Why do i say this???? well in the sport types you are learning with rules and mainly 1 on 1 issues and learning to 'fight' in a ring. Defence styles teach you to get away with eye strikes, nut shots, what ever it takes.

Dont get me wrong sport based styles are help full and used within the defence styles but they are different. My choice would be

Jeet kune do - made up of many many styles and you end up creating your own style taking what works for you and discarding what does not
on par with JDK would be Krav maga - this is a middle eastern art based on real life situations. Both of the above teach you how to get away, avoid a fight and some things people thing are wrong like if the other guy seriously wants to fight and you cant get away then hit him first! it may be your only chance to survive. Weapons training is also involved

Skip Akido, it takes to long to learn how to use it.

Next would be MMA, mixing boxing, kick boxing, BJJ, hapkido and judo. rule one of a street/school fight, never ever go to the ground unless u have to.

My back ground is tae kwon do, boxing, MMA, jeet kune do and now I study Krav Maga.

Hope that helps! it all depends on what he is into and what you belive is safe, suitable and happy for your son to do.

 

[_Kaos_]

Mixed Martial Arts (MMA)! It's all the rage and very effective as it teaches everything from stand up defence (and attack) to ground defence. Most altercations end up on the ground at some point.

Obviously, it's best to walk away but sometimes it's simply not an option.

Aspects of MMA are even used in Defensive Tactics training for law enforcement as officers need to decentralise subjects as quickly and safely as possible. No lessons on punching people in the throat etc just sound defence techniques to defend from injury and effect an arrest.

 

[josko]

I'd like to add this in light of my own experience with my son. He's a VERY bright and very mature boy but is definately introverted.

In year 6 last year, the testosterone must have been pumping and a few of the boys started to exert themselves.

To cut the stort short (again) my son indured some taunting and there was a scuffle in which everyone was saying the big kid won.

My son completely lost his confidence, his apetite and started hating school. Most of it was in his head and he just couldn't understand why anyone would want to pick on ANY person. Basically, he needed to toughen up BIG time.
So, we did some boxing training and eventually, I told him to stand tall and go up to the boy that was causing him trouble (recently seperated parents, overweight and not too bright....)...and ask him what his problem was. (Only when the boy taunted him or pushed him.)

The boy backed off but pushed my son before he tried to run. I had told my son not to start it but to end it. If the boy pushed him, my son was allowed to hit him back and I told him this- "Hit him as hard as you can."

I do not condone violence but where bullies are concerned- you sometimes need to fight fire with fire. Rather than let it drag out for months...I decided three weeks was enough. Bullies are usually insecure and cowards underneath, most of them with trouble at home.

Bully was crying, I got a call from the Principal and the bullies mother.....and my son said while he hated doing it, he was glad he did. Now in high school...so far so good- he is friends with everyone-even the bully.

It solved the problem straightaway. In hindsight, I wished I'd given my son a few boxing lessons sooner.

Regards JO

 

[josko]

First step is involve teachers, principal and parents. See how you go.

unfortunatley in my experience, defense in its self isn't enough.Cracking a bully and taking him to the ground will end with the entire class/school laughing at him. Especially if he is dropped by the little kid.

..are.

Agree.

Anyone that has had a child bullied knows that teachers can do nothing. Yet it is COMPLETELY necessary so that the teachers can see what is happening and know who is telling the truth if there is a scuffle/fight.

My talk with the Principal ended up with her admission that while the school does not condone any type of violence....if she were my son she would ahve done the same thing.

Regards JO

 

[redwing]

Hiya

My son, 10 years old has been "head-locked" by this big bully in school.

I am thinking of some self defence classes for him:

Which would you recommend:
tae kwon do/jujitsu/karate/martial arts or whatever?

would love to hear if you have personal experience on how effective it is!

thanks so much!

hi Virgo

What occurred prior to and post the headlock incident?

Why do you want to put your son into self-defence classes; what are your expectations from him in a similar set of circumstances after these classes?

Is your son interested in the self-defence classes, like anything, commitment is a necessity?

Contrary to the 8 minute ab’s advertisements, results are not instant.

Recommendation of a particular type of self-defence maybe based upon your sons interest in and commitment too.

Effective at what!?

What the expectations here…..?

Lots to think about, including:

What if the bully is a golden-gloves boxer, trains with his dad the towns MMA champ, his dad is the sergeant at arms in the local bikie chapter, the bully is the local coppers son or his mum is a lawyer who is as sure as god made little green apples that her precious couldn’t be involved in such shenanigans and to infer or comment otherwise, will surely see her unleash the hounds of hell upon your unprepared family, wallet or purse?

What if it’s not physical bullying, but taunts, jeers, teasing and ridicule that cause the hurt?

If it not the physical type of bullying, what happens if your son, who’s now training three times a week “snaps” and hurts the other kid. What if that kids also a nasty, persistent bully that just happens to be a girl?

What if the bully’s a bully because there are ‘serious’ home problems and they need help?

What happens if knives or other weapons get involved if things escalate? How the comfort factor and expectations here?

That all said, self-defence training is great confidence and skill booster for children should you be lucky enough to find a good trainer.

Like any school, try and get some referrals, trial the classes before fully committing and find something enjoyable for your child.

Hope I've given some food for thought

*see the attached*

Distance is a great equalizer, as you move further and further away its harder and harder to get headlocked, headbutted, elbowed, punched, knee'd, kicked...then again a crowbar is also a great equalizer; it all depends upon your expectations and desired results!

 

[Cartoon]

if you goo a real and good self defence the first thing u are taught is to avoid the conflict and find a way to get out with out fighting.

the next thing is to stun the attacker so you can get away. the thing that is usefull in your sons situation is that he will learn to stand up for hims self but avoid the fight also. now not all classes will teach this effectivly so its hard to find the right one.

To some of the other comments, MMA teaches you to fight and belt the crap out of some one. U need to have a real good mental understanding of the damage you can do when learning this. While most fights end up on the ground MMA will teach u to take them to the ground. not a good idea when the other guy may have mates.

If the kid is a golden glove boxer he will put his guard up! straight away you know he knows something and automatically change to defence and hit vital points eg, the nuts. A good selfdefence will teach you this to, at this point a 10 year old will not have enough understanding of what self defence is about to get this. but he will have a great base.

some one said wing chung, its a great direct powerfull style, restrictive but prob a good option for your son to learn some defence and understanding. kinda wish i did some wing chung when i was a kid.

 

[Guest]

if you goo a real and good self defence the first thing u are taught is to avoid the conflict and find a way to get out with out fighting.

the next thing is to stun the attacker so you can get away. the thing that is usefull in your sons situation is that he will learn to stand up for hims self but avoid the fight also. now not all classes will teach this effectivly so its hard to find the right one.

To some of the other comments, MMA teaches you to fight and belt the crap out of some one. U need to have a real good mental understanding of the damage you can do when learning this. While most fights end up on the ground MMA will teach u to take them to the ground. not a good idea when the other guy may have mates.

If the kid is a golden glove boxer he will put his guard up! straight away you know he knows something and automatically change to defence and hit vital points eg, the nuts. A good selfdefence will teach you this to, at this point a 10 year old will not have enough understanding of what self defence is about to get this. but he will have a great base.

some one said wing chung, its a great direct powerfull style, restrictive but prob a good option for your son to learn some defence and understanding. kinda wish i did some wing chung when i was a kid.

Me too, I wish I had more time for my Wing Chun studies before I left for interstate.

http://www.wslwingchun.com/news

Above is page, which contains a Youtube link of our teacher (currently in Malaysia, I believe), explaining some of the concepts.

Wing Chun isn't pretty, but from what I see, it's a very effective "striking" martial art. It's based on only a few very simple principles (directness, effectiveness, and simplicity). Best thing was, students were encouraged to approach this school of martial arts with an open, challenging, and inquiring mind - keeping what works for us, and discarding the rest.

 

[_Kaos_]

On second thoughts and review of this thread MMA probably is not the best for this situation taking into consideration the boys age and requirement for such a skill.

Best to stick with the basics such as boxing or even better kick boxing. Great for fitness, confidence and self defence.

Hope it all works out for you, I had to make a few visits to schools when my little brother was bullied due to inaction of the staff.

Google the Casey bully video, when kids just snap!

 

[james_w]

I have done several martial arts

and I noticed a few replies say TAE-KWON-DO is mainly kicking I did cheah advanced tae kwon do for 20 years

and it's more then Just kicking and there is tournaments etc

full and semi contact, take downs,holds etc once you get to dans it is a lot more then just carters.

I still like it as one of the best type of martial arts as a starting point

as it is easier to learn and you will already know some moves in other martial arts when progressing to another form.

There is also many forms of tae kwon do rhee,cheah,kato,progressive,ITF etc.

Cheah advanced tae kwon do is a mix of several martial arts before MMA became popular.

I have also done aikido,mua thai,Judo,boxing,win chun,zen do kai

Most clubs will not teach a kid for the purpose of being able to beat a bully.

with that said there is quite a few moves yeah the obvious hit or grab down below.

But if the bully has had any martial art training them self they would expect this and would probably be standing in stance to avoid this.

Martial arts no matter which one you choose you need to have a passion or it's a waste of time for you and the instructor/s.

Not Just want to learn To fight others at school not sure now but if you got caught fighting when I did martial arts you got banned from attending for a period of time.

I would suggest Cheah advanced tae kwon do and after a little while move to aikido.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XYWxkIdBiA&NR=1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lREm1_e8nuU&feature=related

 

[virgo]

Thanks!

Hiya

Thanks to all of you who has taken the time and effort to give such detailed replies and suggestions!

Just to let you know, the bullying problem (i think i exaggerate because it is a one-off incident) has been resolved with a firm teacher and supportive parents (on both sides...)

The last time i ask, the boys have been playing soccer together!

However, i still think it is good to engender some self-confidence in my son; he is very nice and gentle (we are very nice and gentle parents!) and physical tussles is a very big no-no!

However i took him down to try out Tae-Kwon-do last week (the grandmaster is a 9th dan!); he loves it !
Spoke to a 14 year old girl (black belt) who has been doing it since she's 8; mum says she started due to school bullying too!

In fact, i saw him adapting some of the moves (after just 1 lesson!) on his older brother last night! Very very impressive!