Unprofessional PM; name and shame?

[AdamN]

After 7 years of using the same PM in SEQ I recently terminated our agreement on the following (non-exhaustive) grounds:

• Underpaying of rent for the last 3 consecutive years to the tune of thousands of dollars
• Overcharging of levies/rates payments, combining hers with ours and charging us for both
• Took off for 6 weeks vacation, did not inform me, rents were not paid in her absence
• Charged us for monthly mows, however tenants have informed new PM that mows weren't done and have been mowing themselves
• Was supposed to receive regular inspection reports with photos under the management agreement, rarely did
• Asked if she could recommend a builder for some work as I'm based abroad, said she could not despite having several IPs herself, had to do the running around myself from 6000 kms away.

So after years of "trusting her judgment" I was eventually fed up with such unprofessional and incompetent service. My biggest regret is not cutting ties earlier. Better late than never I suppose.

The kicker though is that she chose to enforce the 90 day termination period. She just lost a customer and a reference, so I fail to see how she can still be charging 3 months commission when she is no longer providing a service to a dissatisfied customer who just terminated the agreement for cause. I understand that it’s her legal right to do so, but there is legal and there is ethical, and from an ethical perspective I don’t see how she can possibly justify charging for work that she has not done. In my mind it borders on theft. Every other agent I considered to replace her all said that if I wasn't happy with their service at any time that I could take my business elsewhere, no strings attached. But not my ex-PM. It essentially reinforced to me how out of touch with the market and reality she is.

I'm debating whether to name and shame, to prevent others from having to deal with such unprofessional and incompetent conduct.

BTW, this is not meant to be a PM bashing thread, as I'm sure there are some good ones out there. I'm merely conveying my own poor experience with a particular PM, so I'm not tarring them all with the same brush.

 

[twobobsworth]

Doesn't sound good Adam.

On your next agreement make sure it doesn't say 90 days again regardless of what the PM says. In QLD the minimum notice period is 30 days.

 

[AlmostBob]

rei complaint
small claim to recover unpaid monies
police complaint for theft/fraud of having you pay her bills
90 days,, make the **expletive**'s life difficult

 

[handyandy]

Hi Adam

Have those issues of under rent paying, her rates etc been resolved or are they still outstanding? If they are outstanding then I would suggest you make a complaint to the relevant Qld authority that supervises her license.

I don't know who the supervisory body is in Qld but there will be one and I am sure someone will shortly advice who they are, failing that, just ask your new PM who they are.

I agree with twobobsworth make sure the new agreement is only for 30 day termination - a bit like a prenup get it signed when everybody is happy.

Cheers

 

[Jamie M]

rei complaint
small claim to recover unpaid monies
police complaint for theft/fraud of having you pay her bills
90 days,, make the **expletive**'s life difficult

I agree with Bob. I wouldn't be worried about the name and shame - I'd be more concerned about getting back the money that's owed.

Cheers

Jamie

 

[russellpeter]

talt to the RTA its agents like this that give us all a bad name

http://www.rta.qld.gov.au/

 

[Sez]

Wow - that really is just appaling! I am both for and against the name and shame. The reasons for this is that sometimes the owner really is wrong (though not in this case!) and if they try to name and shame an agent for following legislation which they don't like it can result in a poor reference for a good agent.

This agent however, sounds like they need a reality check, definately talk to the QLD authority! I'm surprised she is able to get through her yearly audit unscathed!!

If you really feel the need to give her a poor reference - womow.com, you can review almost any company anywhere and others will go there to check a place out before using their services, I believe it will make you feel better too as you seem to want to be able to share your experience.

The other thing from this that I would like to say is - if you have a good PM go out of your way to give them a good reference!!! People always, always make the time for negative opinions on any service they receive but no-one really takes the time to compliment good service.

 

[Lamingtons]

Overcharging of levies/rates payments, combining hers with ours and charging us for both

Wouldn't that be fraud?

 

[Sez]

Overcharging of levies/rates payments, combining hers with ours and charging us for both

Wouldn't that be fraud?

or theft. Thats why I wonder how she gets through audits!!! Using a trust account for all transactions agencies are audited every 12 months (at least they are in VIC) and anything like that should have been picked up......not good.

 

[AdamN]

Thanks for the responses.
To those suggesting I take steps to recover the money, I did, and have received every owed cent.
I should clarify the underpayment situation:
At the end of each financial year when preparing my tax papers for my accountant, I would compare the rental statements of what the agent claimed she had paid, against the actual bank account statements where she would deposit the rent. Every year for the last 3 years there was a shortfall, and not just a few bucks, but hundreds and ultimately thousands of dollars. She eventually paid, but I was tired of the constant policing. One year I might have been OK with the discrepancy, but not 3 consecutive years when I'd already pulled her up for the first 2.

The excuses as to why she hadn't paid were pathetic. e.g "well because your name starts with a T (our trust name) this means you're at the bottom of my client list, so I didn't have any money left in my internet banking account to pay your rent as I'd already paid all my other clients"
Yes, that's a valid reason that I can swallow when I have mortgages to service with monthly payments!

As for my new PM agreement, there is no notice period. The PM's approach is that if his clients don't believe that he is performing to their expectation then they are free to leave at any time, no strings attached. And that is in the agreement.

 

[Peterw]

Adam, there was an agent very heavilly fined, and had their licence withdrawn, for not paying rent to clients. I cannot understand how their auditor did not pick up on the errors. I would suggest that you notify the Qld Office of Fair Trade. They are giving us all a bad name, and should no longer be operating.

 

[Ed Barton]

Adam, there was an agent very heavilly fined, and had their licence withdrawn, for not paying rent to clients. I cannot understand how their auditor did not pick up on the errors. I would suggest that you notify the Qld Office of Fair Trade. They are giving us all a bad name, and should no longer be operating.

also, how can there be 'no money left' in a trust account unless someone's got their hand in the till?

 

[pennyk]

Agents who carry on with this sort of behaviour should be reported and investigated.
You can be sure you are not the only one who is experiencing this, and if you stay silent others will be burned.

 

[cu@thetop]

rei complaint
small claim to recover unpaid monies
police complaint for theft/fraud of having you pay her bills
90 days,, make the **expletive**'s life difficult

Agreed. If they want to enforce the 90 day period make them work for it!

 

[NedKelly]

I'm debating whether to name and shame, to prevent others from having to deal with such unprofessional and incompetent conduct.

Can you give us a clue, like they are big and yellow, or maybe you thought they were a US TV show with the Star Trek guy or even you first went into their shop to hire a balloon for the day.

 

[twobobsworth]

As for my new PM agreement, there is no notice period. The PM's approach is that if his clients don't believe that he is performing to their expectation then they are free to leave at any time, no strings attached. And that is in the agreement.

No legally enforceable by you anyway so hopefully they stick to their word.

 

[AdamN]

Can you give us a clue, like they are big and yellow, or maybe you thought they were a US TV show with the Star Trek guy or even you first went into their shop to hire a balloon for the day.

Not one of the big boys. Sole trader agent. I dare say most people would not have heard of them before, probably for good reason.

So you're probably asking, then why did I use them to start with?
Well, we had used her Buyers Agent services over the years through a friends recommendation (she did well for them) and we then just took up her PM services by extension as it was convenient. However I've realised that I value professionalism, competence and integrity over convenience, so we gave her the boot.

 

[shuggy]

I'm debating whether to name and shame, to prevent others from having to deal with such unprofessional and incompetent conduct.

I think it'll be deleted if you name and shame. I tried a similar thing not long ago about an unscrupulous agent in Southport SEQ with red, black and yellow colours but it was quickly deleted.

As for my new PM agreement, there is no notice period. The PM's approach is that if his clients don't believe that he is performing to their expectation then they are free to leave at any time, no strings attached. And that is in the agreement.

I wouldn't trust them.. politely insist you'd prefer a 30 day notice period in writing but are happy to go along with his suggestion of leaving at any time if you're unhappy... edit, just saw that it was in the agreement, sounds like he's a fair guy.

 

[ACTInvestor]

Well, we had used her Buyers Agent services over the years through a friends recommendation (she did well for them)

Your friend may not have been so fastidious with their monthly statements. It is my understanding that unless your tenants haven't paid rent or your costs have equalled your rental income, you should always receive rent. Trust accounts are based on each individual client. So it shouldn't matter if your name starts with 'T' or 'A', you get the money owing to you from your property.

 

[AdamN]

Your friend may not have been so fastidious with their monthly statements.

You could be right there.

It is my understanding that unless your tenants haven't paid rent or your costs have equalled your rental income, you should always receive rent. Trust accounts are based on each individual client. So it shouldn't matter if your name starts with 'T' or 'A', you get the money owing to you from your property.

Sounds good in theory. What's that line again... "in theory there is no difference between theory and practice, but in practice there is".

My understanding was that she had a common "pooled" account that all tenants she was managing across all her clients would pay their rent into. Then each month, from the funds deposited by all tenants into that pooled account, she would pay her clients.
So client A would receive $X, client B would receive $Y, client C would receive $Z, etc. According to her, on some occasions, for whatever reason (either some of her tenants didn't pay their rent on time so there was a shortfall, or she had her hand on the till as someone else suggested) by the time she got to us, there was no money left in the kitty as we were towards the end of the client list. As if that explanation would be acceptable to us. It staggered me that there are people out there who believe it is OK to run a client facing business like this, particularly a business like property investment where cash flow is king.