"White Flight" - Could this trend happen in Australia?

[sanj]

This is partly what I mean, let me get my very broad brush out, if you are born in Africa, Asia, Middle East etc.. you can live in your own country and largely not have to live with "Westerners" if you don't want to. But in Western countries this will eventually become impossible, rightly or wrongly but shouldn't we have a choice ?

And unless Sash or Sanj have had their town / city overtaken by another race I don't think their opinions are worth much on this subject.

Wow.

I can't comment on an issue re immigration because I'm brown in what you consider to be a white country? I was born in Singapore and moved to australia, 2 countries built on immigration and my opinion isn't worth much on the subject? Which town of yours has been overtaken btw? I'd like to ensure you qualify to comment under your own rules

You need to wake up and realise this isn't the white man's country and never will be. It belongs to no singular race which is one of the many things that make it great.

Btw you're showing your igo rance by clumping all westerners and all say Asians together with your comment that Asians don't have to live with westerners.

What's a westerner? You? What similarities do you have with say someone from denmark? What about Asians? What does someone from China have in common with someone from say sri Lanka?

You'll be less afraid of people you clearly don't understand if you stop grouping everyone

 

[Chomp]

Yeah I stand by what I said, your opinion doesnt count for much, I didnt say you couldnt comment, we are a free country

Its a Westerners country and we are still linked with Britain, if you don't think that counts for much then yada yada yada

I'm ignorant, really I dont this so !, I'm fairly well traveled and have lived abroad, I have mates who are Danish actually, we love football and we like the gammel dansk

I do group as its human nature to stereo type, I know not everyone fits in the box and that's cool so I am cautious, but I would say around 90% of the time when I do, I get it right.

 

[sanj]

So what's a westerner then? Genuinely curious about your definition.

 

[strongy1986]

They cluster for many reasons and not just comfort. The cluster didn't happen overnight and was not planned. Nature just took its course. Some cultures look for good schools so they move to an area with good schools. Obvioulsy thier family friends may have the same view so word of mouth gets their family friends to also move in the area cause of good school.

As I said, nothing was planned. Let's say a couple of indian families moved to suburb X; one of the families opened up a shop that sold indian food. Word gets around and more indians move into the area cause they can buy their groceries from there.

Very similar to a new residentiall complex going up. No one wants to live here until a wollies opens up across the road.

There are white people living in China and in one small city for example, it could grow in that a community of white people who speak english live in this area for many reasons. I admit comfort plays a role, possibly a few shops where they speak english as well and sell their good old brands of products back at home.

Let's be honest, if its comfort, what is the big deal. Who doesn't want comfort. If you're an aussie mid class type of guy,would you live in Lakemba where its full of middle eastern families; of cause you won't because you're not comfortable there and there is nothing there for you. You go where there is something to offer.

You might move into a suburb where there is more of your kind because they undertsnad you and your culture. It's as simple as that.

Couldn't agree more

 

[MightyWill]

No chip, I understand it's easier

So why do people think it's racist for a white person or any person to move out of an area that is now dominated by cultures other than there own

As you said they move to feel more comfortable and be around people who are 'similiar'

Maybe white people voice out more in the world and pretty much stick their noise in every other countries business; the USA for example. My point is that people already are judging on whites before they even make a move because they always have something to say about the world.

Other countries go about their lives normally and don't really give a shi# about western politics, etc.

It's in our nature to hang around our own. You see gorillas hanging with monkeys?

White person moves out cause he may not fit in no more and doesn't like it. Fair enough reason. Chinese guy migrates to Sydney and moves back after two years; he doesn't like it here and doesn't fit in.

Australia is still a young and very small populated country. We have 28 million people. That is the population of a med size city in china. The number of Chinese coming here is nothing. I'll be honest and say that there are numbers that also go back cause they just don't like it here which is fair enough.

If we didn't have immigration coming over, how big do you think Australia will be and where it's economy will be right now. Australia would be so far behind in terms of being a first world country. Disliking migrants is like saying I dislike our export and import of resources.

Note that I don't like using the white term; white could mean a various number of races and cultures, and you can blame the white people for coming up with the term. Actually, blame the Americans. Some so called whites don't even look white so give up the white, black bullshi# talk.

 

[Chomp]

I would say it's someone who embraces the westerners way of life, regardless of colour or nationality. I did mention "white" before but I realize that is incorrect.

 

[sanj]

So what's a westerner then? Genuinely curious about your definition.

To elaborate - if someone is say 3rd generation aussie but of Chinese heritage are they a westerner? Or does their skin tone preclude them from qualifying chomp?

 

[Chomp]

To elaborate - if someone is say 3rd generation aussie but of Chinese heritage are they a westerner? Or does their skin tone preclude them from qualifying chomp?

You are trying to bait me Sanj, If they embrace the westerners way of life it doesn't matter to me. (Unless they support dockers, then all bets are off)

 

[strongy1986]

Because it's someone's home town vs a foreign country, an entirely different proposition. The whole premise that people of different colors and cultures would make me want to move suburbs in my own home town is ridiculous.

Btw I didn't say it's automatically racist, sometimes is plain xenophobia or just ignorance.

Incidentally you're the only one mentioning colour here, I feel the same way regardless of what colour the person is. especially in a country like australia that's built on immigration.

If I used the term Australian instead of white you would be lecturing me on how Australians are made up of many different ethnicities and not just Anglo Saxon - which I understand

The thread was titled white flight after all

 

[sanj]

You are trying to bait me Sanj, If they embrace the westerners way of life it doesn't matter to me. (Unless they support dockers, then all bets are off)

I'm not trying to bait you but you still haven't answered the question. Who is a westerner and what is that based on? It's pretty relevant to the entire discussion we've had cos you brought it up a fair few times

 

[Chomp]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_culture

In a very large nutshell I guess !

But this is what I am saying, certain city's, town suburbs have had mass immigration and the culture has been lost. This shouldn't be allowed to happen though, it wouldn't happen in reverse would it, but we should all just be PC and let it ? It's easier just to move ?

 

[strongy1986]

Maybe white people voice out more in the world and pretty much stick their noise in every other countries business; the USA for example. My point is that people already are judging on whites before they even make a move because they always have something to say about the world.

Other countries go about their lives normally and don't really give a shi# about western politics, etc.

It's in our nature to hang around our own. You see gorillas hanging with monkeys?

White person moves out cause he may not fit in no more and doesn't like it. Fair enough reason. Chinese guy migrates to Sydney and moves back after two years; he doesn't like it here and doesn't fit in.

Australia is still a young and very small populated country. We have 28 million people. That is the population of a med size city in china. The number of Chinese coming here is nothing. I'll be honest and say that there are numbers that also go back cause they just don't like it here which is fair enough.

If we didn't have immigration coming over, how big do you think Australia will be and where it's economy will be right now. Australia would be so far behind in terms of being a first world country. Disliking migrants is like saying I dislike our export and import of resources.

Note that I don't like using the white term; white could mean a various number of races and cultures, and you can blame the white people for coming up with the term. Actually, blame the Americans. Some so called whites don't even look white so give up the white, black bullshi# talk.

Was all of that directed at me??

Id hope not because all I did was ask a few questions. Never said immigration was a bad thing

 

[sanj]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_culture

In a very large nutshell I guess !

But this is what I am saying, certain city's, town suburbs have had mass immigration and the culture has been lost. This shouldn't be allowed to happen though, it wouldn't happen in reverse would it, but we should all just be PC and let it ? It's easier just to move ?

I understand what western culture broadly is but what is a westerner? You haven't been able to answer it. Is it based on ethnicity or culture?

Eg if a wasp aussie couple moves to say singapore and has a kid, is that kid a westerner?

What about the opposiTe? I'm pretty aussie and certainly consider myself to be an aussie, am I a westerner?

Who qualifies and who doesn't?

This has nothing to do with PC btw.

Re mass immigration into a certain area - this has happened around the world fOr a long time and often has a hugely positive impact.

In australoa look at examples of Leichardt, Carlton, cabramatta, North perth, northbridge etc.

Overseas look at say little india or Chinatown in Singapore, often the most interesting and most popular areas now are areas that were once greatly changed by migrants.

Why do you assume it's a bad thing?

 

[BayView]

doesnt sound like it, this is from 2011 ABS stats

"37.8% of people living in Noble Park were born in Australia. The other top responses for country of birth were India 8.5%, Vietnam 8.1%, Sri Lanka 5.3%, Cambodia 4.2%, Bosnia and Herzegovina 1.9%."

obviouly a very diverse suburb but aussie born still 38% of which youd expect WASP to be a significant %

LOL!

I can always count on you to drag out a stat - that in this case is misleading, and you are ill-informed as a result.

37.8% were born in Aus - that has no representation to colour or race, and while they might be Aussie born; culture is always a very strong aspect of peoples' lives...

Conversely; it also means that 62.2% of the suburb were not born in Aus.

The thread is called "White Flight". It refers to the evacuation of WASP folks from various places as other races move in. It is basically a racist scenario - the WASPS don't want to be surrounded by the other races.

Blunt, but it's what this thread refers to. I didn't invent the term, or the practice; just explaining without the PC.

Go to Noble Park, and go to Parkmore shopping centre, and drive around.

Oh; you can't - you live in Perth which is a bit far.

Maybe you'll just have to believe me, my wife, her folks and their friends.

But don't be too sad; most WASP folks (who can afford to) move away from skanky bogan areas which are predominantly f/wit WASPs as well; you'll never see a surgeon living in The Pines; they'll move out as soon as they can. But you'll always see more f/wit skanky bogans turning up with the ute full of furniture to move into that area.

It's not just race or colour that makes folks move away from an area - but in this thread it is.

It's human nature; folks move away from folks they are not keen on, to folks they would rather be around when they are able to. Been happening for eons.

 

[sanj]

Fair enough BayView, you're right about the fact that the aussie born stay refers to nationality and not race.

Out of curiosity, what is your or anyone else's definitely of a westerner? Chomp is unable to answer that question and im curious what other people think

 

[willair]

Out of curiosity, what is your or anyone else's definitely of a westerner? Chomp is unable to answer that question and im curious what other people think

That's the biggest challenge we all face in Australian is scaling everyone in,but you seems to be carrying a lot of monkeys on your back if one was to read your posts and the animosity they carry,so the question is sanj?? what is a westerner to you,just remember to breathe before you answer the question if you can..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNviFAVFvJE

 

[redwing]

The internet tells me they are: A native or inhabitant of the west, especially of western Europe or North America.

Geographically we are southern, but we have eastern and western neighbours

But I believe we are all part of the global village with all the good and bad that entails

 

[BayView]

Fair enough BayView, you're right about the fact that the aussie born stay refers to nationality and not race.

Out of curiosity, what is your or anyone else's definitely of a westerner? Chomp is unable to answer that question and im curious what other people think

My interpretation of westerner is a WASP...cowboys, white folks who eat cucumber sandwiches and drink fine tea, or the full-on Aussie skank-bogan with the mullet, Conformadore and poor attitude, or the Yank WW11 flying ace who is chivalrous and brave.

Loads of different versions of White Anglo-Saxons, basically...

I don't know if that is accurate though. Probably is. Who coined that description?

Easterner is the Middle East,

Oriental is anyone Japanese,

Asian is anyone with different shaped eyes to westerners and black hair.

South American is everyone below the USA.

These are the main ones I've grown up with, and no doubt inaccurate.

They are not derogatory (or meant to be) - just a description of geographical positioning for each type of race.

 

[sanj]

That's the biggest challenge we all face in Australian is scaling everyone in,but you seems to be carrying a lot of monkeys on your back if one was to read your posts and the animosity they carry,so the question is sanj?? what is a westerner to you,just remember to breathe before you answer the question if you can..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNviFAVFvJE

There are no monkeys on my back and no animosity from me, there were some posts that didn't make sense to me and I wanted clarification on.

ultimately it isn't an easy thing to define but what you have posted is probably along the lines of what I think is right too, a native or inhabitant of the west.

This leads to my point though that if inhabitants of the west are indeed considered westerners then I don't quite understand chomps point about westerners being forced out because in that case often these suburbs will have, by definition, westerners moving in but of a different colour. What's the issue with that? Why is that inherently bad according to some?

 

[sanj]

So BayView in your mind it's based on ethnicity, I asked a few people this last night and got mixed responses, certainly some agreed with you.

I guess my issue with it is that say in the exampLe I posted earlier- someone say 3rd generation aussie of Chinese heritage will be a lot more western/aussie/whatever label culturally than say someone first generation singaporean of WASP heritage so it doesn't make sense to me that the aussie is not considered western but the singaporean is.

If we then consider nationality etc the entire diatribe against people stealing westerners place and all that xenophobic nonsense becomes irrelevant