Dont you just hate that?

[willair]

If i feel like that i usually take profit. It does look a bit speccy, but looks like it might be in for a decent upward trend. How many you have?

Caltex looks good. Not a tip of course, just thinking out loud.

Yes it is very high risk,in money terms not a lot but in holding units over half a mill it's only a number and the entry price, but i have been watching this one all the way down,and as it always happens they can only go so low,or implode no one expected it too happen,with the M-F they have undermanagement..imho..willair..

 

[boods99]

Glad you asked.

Well, James Packers Consolidated Media (CMJ) sold 87 million x seek.com.au (SEK) @ $5.05 this morning on the open market. Which brought the price down to that level for a while but its on the way back up now.

Funnily enough i was holding both. I had $20k worth of CMJ which jumped 10% this morning and i sold.

MCC is going strong and i have a sell order in for $9.40 because i want to go out. Should sell soon. Should be a ~$5k morning for me when it sells.

Well done...love your work
Still waiting for my books to arrive so I can read up on trading before I take the plunge. Starting to get a grasp on market depth and also position sizing.
Keep the updates coming mate, very interesting.

 

[boods99]

Everything is going good,the only trade iv'e made over the past 2 weeks was and is a very high risk shorterm is TCQ at 8 cents i could walk away now after tax with above 45% from what i started with,but i just don't know on this one it could still go back to 5 cents or 24..imho willair..

Geez...if it was me, I'd be tempted to sell. Could you not just sell out, realize the profit, and then buy back in close to the price you sold?

Boods

 

[boods99]

Geez...if it was me, I'd be tempted to sell. Could you not just sell out, realize the profit, and then buy back in close to the price you sold?

Boods

^^^ After thinking about it for a while, I have come to the conclusion that this is possibly the stupidest thing I have ever said...

 

[joanmc]

Not stupid at all boods depending on what your intentions and strategy are. I do that regularly to lock in profit. But I am trading to create an income, I am NOT investing. It makes more sense doing it with CFDs rather than straight shares though.

 

[boods99]

Not stupid at all boods depending on what your intentions and strategy are. I do that regularly to lock in profit. But I am trading to create an income, I am NOT investing. It makes more sense doing it with CFDs rather than straight shares though.

Joanmc,
I was approaching it as a way to lock in the profit, but when I thought about it, buying in again at the same price that you sold, still exposes the full amount again, and with the added bonus of 2 x brokerage fees to boot!!

I am also looking at trading, rather than investing. I've still got a lot to learn though!

Boods

 

[boods99]

Another question for all you people is; if you buy a good blue chip stock, with the intention of moving it on quickly for a profit, and the market goes the opposite way than you thought, wont it be easier to just hold onto the shares until they recovered (assumng they do recover, as they are good quality shares) instead of having a stop loss triggered that will realise this loss?

Stop me if I'm on the wrong track here! Is this seen as a "trap for young players" perhaps?

Boods

 

[steveadl]

If you're a trader it would mean you have a chunk of your capital locked up sitting there. It may be safe, but you can't use the capital for trading profit elsewhere.

I did a few trades like that in bluechips, but that's only because I wasn't doing it for income, so if I was left holding the bluechip it wouldn't have bothered me. Did this a few times with WDC.

 

[The Fence]

Another question for all you people is; if you buy a good blue chip stock, with the intention of moving it on quickly for a profit, and the market goes the opposite way than you thought, wont it be easier to just hold onto the shares until they recovered (assumng they do recover, as they are good quality shares) instead of having a stop loss triggered that will realise this loss?

Stop me if I'm on the wrong track here! Is this seen as a "trap for young players" perhaps?

Boods

Consider this.... HIH was considered a good stock....along with many others that go down for one reason or another....Lehmans...safe as a bank heh...!

Lock it in Eddie I say....and buy back when it dips again...which it will....

You do have alot to learn on this point alone...I'd suggest if you will be trading not investing....then go with a reputable trading course like Safety in the Market or others that offer some technical learning....the ASX website has a plethora or learning and guidance for starters...good luck and stay disciplined.

FWIW....I'm holding CSL for long term and some MBN and ELD for short term....got out of BXB today for a lovely run up over the last few weeks....will be back into it on the bigger dips....if there are any that is.....boy the materials are pumping solidly hey..!

 

[evand]

There is a saying for traders. "Cut your losers off quick and let your winners run" That's the idea of the stop loss, your emotion or decisions dont come into it, when it gets to that point, you sell.

A big part of success in this game is not only picking winners but restricting losses. In fact i've heard it said that the whole game is about limiting your losses rather than increasing your gains. And there's some truth to that.

Whatever you do, don't go buying more of a stock as it falls in price. That's called catching a falling knife and a big trap for beginners (including myself years ago )

Another question for all you people is; if you buy a good blue chip stock, with the intention of moving it on quickly for a profit, and the market goes the opposite way than you thought, wont it be easier to just hold onto the shares until they recovered (assumng they do recover, as they are good quality shares) instead of having a stop loss triggered that will realise this loss?

Stop me if I'm on the wrong track here! Is this seen as a "trap for young players" perhaps?

Boods

 

[The Fence]

In fact i've heard it said that the whole game is about limiting your losses rather than increasing your gains. And there's some truth to that.

You bet there is Ev....in fact you can have more losing trades than profiting trades and still come out on top....

Consider this....6 out of 10 trades are losers ...2 trades are breakeven...and 2 are profitable....and you still should be in front.....

Now, all this "trading" seems so very short term stuff...but consider the long term effects of a disciplined strategy....yes you do have to be long term somewhere in the trading mix....

Yes, agreed a have scars on my hands too Ev... lol....chalk it up to experience and never go back there...!

 

[chilliaa]

Another question for all you people is; if you buy a good blue chip stock, with the intention of moving it on quickly for a profit, and the market goes the opposite way than you thought, wont it be easier to just hold onto the shares until they recovered (assumng they do recover, as they are good quality shares) instead of having a stop loss triggered that will realise this loss?

Stop me if I'm on the wrong track here! Is this seen as a "trap for young players" perhaps?

Boods

You answered your own question: with the intention of moving it on quickly.

Therefore 100% uniquivocably, non-negotiable, no further comment, do you apply a stop loss and off load it if necessary as a loss.

The number one way that amature traders blow themselves up is by turning trading positions into 'investments'

 

[evand]

Reminds me of a saying:

A long term investment is just a short one that didn't work out.

And one from my granny:

You'll never go broke taking a profit haha

The number one way that amature traders blow themselves up is by turning trading positions into 'investments'

 

[jaycee]

buggers cut off my intenet access at work. All I got is telstra.com for access to yellow pages etc. So all I can do is check some/most holdings on their finance news page.

Funny how people learn - stumble on an idea, think its clever, then learn its stupid/dangerous. $ cost averaging by buying when the price is going down = catching a falling knife. Was almost gonna do that with CSL a couple of months go.. bought in too high but sill holding my big $500 parcel..should be right

dumped my tax return into my trading a/c and buggered if I can figure out with my level of knowledge (wht's it called.... none) what the hell to buy...

my idea is to build a decent value portfolio wihtout chucking in more money out of my norm pay - annual bonus of 3k net eg may go into this pa (tax return may soon be eaten up helping on IP #2)...

I've made 2 succeful trades winning about 30+40odd % on each - MAE then MND. Over a few months that is.

Then I jumped back into MAE and into another dont ask me why bomb which Im holding at decent losses

any suggestions for someone who wnaats to dngerousy trade a bit in smaller numbers of $500-$1k worth of shares ?

 

[Aaron Sice]

check out small/mid cap resource shares. a little volatile at present, but there's some great range trades out there.

i look at the charts on asx.com.au and if i see a little wavy pattern, and are buying, then wait - buy near the bottom of that little wavy pattern when the 3d MA crosses the 5d MA for a short trade, or for long term trade when the 20d MA crosses the 50d MA.

just my little strategy with mid/small caps. caveat emptor et al.

 

[jaycee]

appreciate that thanks.

 

[chilliaa]

Funny how people learn - stumble on an idea, think its clever, then learn its stupid/dangerous. $ cost averaging by buying when the price is going down = catching a falling knife. Was almost gonna do that with CSL a couple of months go.. bought in too high but sill holding my big $500 parcel..should be right

Jayce i dollar cost average all the time (both upwards and downwards).
Over the last 18 months i was dollar averaging all the way into march 09.

But the difference is i prohibit myself from trading. I do this to give myself a pyschological barrier from the mood of the market, otherwise i would be tempted to convince myself (and at the end of the day who do you really kid but yourself) that a loosing trade was justified somehow as an investment.

A good trader responds correctly to the underlying mood of the market, a good investor goesnt give a hoot about the mood of the market, if anything they use short term moods to create longer term exit and entry points that are justified around their investment mandates.

 

[jaycee]

At least I could have done worse than CSL.

Yeh I like the ide of building a portfolio of decent size, but atm, limited funds so learning the market and trading a bit seemed like a good idea. So far 2 out of 2, but that was over a good few months... thought this was a good a palce as any to get into trouble - I'm joking, I'm joking

Actually Bluecard, tried to emulate the chart you were desribing but not seeing the sme n ubmers you described, I can only see choices of 5, 10, 20, or 30 (?)

 

[chilliaa]

At least I could have done worse than CSL.

Yeh I like the ide of building a portfolio of decent size, but atm, limited funds so learning the market and trading a bit seemed like a good idea. So far 2 out of 2, but that was over a good few months... thought this was a good a palce as any to get into trouble - I'm joking, I'm joking

Actually Bluecard, tried to emulate the chart you were desribing but not seeing the sme n ubmers you described, I can only see choices of 5, 10, 20, or 30 (?)

if i may give a bit of advice, it seems like you are 'trending' towards a traders philosophy. If i am right then forget about trying to 'invest' in the stock market and try to learn the secrets of being a good trader.

Even though bluecard and i have a different philisophical view when it comes to the stock market i have always respected him. Why? because bluecard is a trader, but at least he recognises what he is and thus adopts appropriate strategies to suit his style ( i will never forget bluecard being quite happy when the market was going down why? because he was happily shorting stuff, he wasnt trying to blend an investment philosophy with an investing philosophy).

Again Sun Szu art of war: know yourself know your enemy (in this case both yourself and the market), a 1000 battles a 1000 victories.

 

[evand]

What BC is saying is that when the short term average crosses over the long term on the upside it's a buy signal and when it crosses on the downside its a sell signal. Broadly speaking.

Its one of a classic tool of Technical Analysis for traders and a very good one. And investors as well i suppose.

And he's saying use longer term averages to differentiate between a trading opportunity and an investing one.

Any success stories with this in the small resource sector BC?

I'll try to attach an eg.

You can see where the pink line (11 day moving average) crosses the blue line (31 day moving average) on the downside at the top left of the chart shows the price will fall, as you can see from the chart. ( a sell signal) GET OUT!)

And when it crosses the blue line at the bottom its a buy signal (GET IN!) as the price is ready to rise again, as you can see from the chart.

You can adjust the averages to show a shorter time frame (trading) or a longer one (investing).

Hope this helps someone. Hope this whole thread helps people, i'm loving it. That's why i'm putting it all out there and i hope people can benefit from it.

If mods aren't ok with this thread continuing in its current style, let me know. I don't want to turn this place into a hotcopper.



Its not 100% fool proof but a very good indication.