Need help with granny flat layout

[kristaje]

As some of you may remember, I have some problem with unapproved granny flat in Campbeltown council area (thread: http://somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?t=60734). Main issue was that side boundary is <0.9m. Since then the property has been rented to a family as one house, and the gf area is used as storage (it's approved as garage & storage with toilet).

Anyways, a couple of years went by, there was recently a change of regulation re. side boundary, and I'm now in the process of getting the structure approved as gf again via private certifier route, with the help of Serge/Brazen.

While we're doing this, I'm looking at possibility of making it a 2-bedder rather than a 1-bed gf. Structure 14mx4.2m, so close to 60m2. Layout is a bit tricky, as we'd have to make the side wall fire-rated, so there could be no opening on that side. I wonder if any of you could help with suggestions on possible layout? Attached are the site plan and 2 possible layout that I did myself. First try, so please excuse the amateur-ness of it

Thanks all.

 

[kristaje]

Other thing, I heard that it's a regulation that a bedroom couldn't face the street? Just wonder if this applies to gf only, or also other resi houses? Was a bit surprised hearing this one actually, as our previous home (and I believe most of terrace houses in Balmain NSW) has a bedroom at the front with window overlooking the street.

Also, what is the interpretation of 'not facing the street'. Does it mean has no door facing the street? Can a bedroom wall (without opening) faces the street? If you see the first picture, this gf is quite far back from the street, around 14-15m, will this be an issue?

 

[daniel ngo]

There is a metal fire-screen-mesh that you could use for the window with/Or a fire rated window

Hopes that help

 

[kristaje]

thanks Daniel.
do you know if that mean that i don't need to remove the window but only need to cover it with this mesh before closing it with firewall?

In relation to my pref. post re. bedroom facing the street, I've found the explanation here as below:

13 Articulation zone

(1) Development for the purposes of a secondary dwelling (other than development on a battle-axe lot) must not result in neither the principal dwelling nor the secondary dwelling having a front door and a window to a habitable room in the building wall that faces a primary road.

(2) Development for the purposes of a secondary dwelling (other than development on a battle-axe lot) must not result in neither the principal dwelling nor the secondary dwelling having a window to a habitable room in the building wall that faces a parallel road.

(3) Development for the purposes of a secondary dwelling may incorporate an articulation zone from the secondary dwelling to a primary road, unless the secondary dwelling has a setback from the primary road of less than 3 metres.


I guess this means I need to close out the opening where roller door is currently at. Does anyone know if I need to wall it up or could I get away with adding a wall lining inside?

Also, any feedback on the granny flat floor plan design?

 

[marg4000]

Check thaj option 2 is allowable - some councils do not allow a toilet to open directly to a kitchen.

I know you will be looking for the cheapest option, but the bathroom opening to the living area would be a real turn off for most.

If you want really 2 beds then a bit of re-jigging of the bathroom would probably be worthwhile, even if you have to sacrifice space for a small hallway to the door.
Marg

 

[neK]

I prefer Option 1, but the bedrooms look too small.
Option 2 is ok, but the lack of actual windows to bedroom and toilet opening into kitchen is a turn off.

is moving the bathroom a option?

Because a well laid out granny flat would fetch better rent than a crappy laid out that looks and feels like a garage.

 

[daniel ngo]

... do you know if that mean that i don't need to remove the window but only need to cover it with this mesh before closing it with firewall?

An example = http://www.invisi-gard.com.au/fire_attenuation.php. What we are doing is using an "alternative solution". These technologies are from the bushfire code (AS 3959-2009). Another possible "alternative solution" is to have a sprinkler outside your window (Wet wall construction).

Best if you have your designer talk to the manufacturer. Together, they have to prove that the method/material used meet the "performance requirement" of the BCA.

Also, any feedback on the granny flat floor plan design?

I like option-2, with change kitchen & living to there beds are now, and vice versa

Hope that helps

OOPs ... forgot to mention, check to see if your eave is > 450 from the boundary. Otherwise you will have fire issue with it.

 

[neK]

I tried to match the placement of your windows/doors.

1. Assuming you can move the bathroom, perhaps something like this.

2. If you can't move the bathroom but there is a possibility the floor of the bathroom can be raised to accommodate for the pipes. The kitchen also has a space for a front loader washing machine. You'll need to find a slim toilet to give more walking room to the shower. Also there is more wasted space in the 2nd option (about 4sqm)

 

[westminster]

I think your bathroom and bedrooms are too small. If you want to leave the bathroom there I would access it from the side where the toilet is and rejig the layout so that it's opening to the hallway not to a living area or kitchen

I like Nek's ideas for the space .

I would also consider moving the fence to increase the outdoor living space.

 

[westminster]

I can't read you dimensions but option would be

2 bedrooms above the bathroom (with bathroom entrance off hallway).
Kitchen below bathroom
living/dining below kitchen with sliding doors where the garage roller it
A frame pergola extended along roof line from living area to make a nice alfresco area
Fence off from road side

 

[neK]

Based on what i can make out and calculate, it would appear the area above the bathroom is 5600mm. Can fit two bedrooms with a width of 2.8m. Adding in a built in, the bed1 would be 2.8 x 3.5, bed 2 would be 2.8 x 2.5 (this room would be too small unless you choose not to put a built in).

That said, I think the living/dining/kitchen would look much nicer on the roller door end. You could make the front look a lot nicer that way and I think its worth making the beds smaller to have much nicer entry point.

Also the alfresco area would give the place a house feel as opposed to a garage feel.

 

[kristaje]

Hi Marg, neK, Daniel and Westminster,

Many thanks for all the feedback. There are really good suggestions there - and neK, I really like the layout you provided.

There's another twist, found out yesterday from Serge that there is a requirements for the PPOS (personal private open space) of 24m2 with 4m width needed with direct access from habitable room that is not a bedroom. Means either living/dining needs to have access to this 24m2 open area.

In the current position of the structure, the only 24m2 PPOS available is on the front of the place (in front of current roller door), otherwise side fence will need to be moved back towards the main house.

As we're residing overseas at the moment, my preference is not taking something to complex - if possible. Talked with my managing agent yesterday, the different in rent potential between 1 and 2 bedder gf will be $30 pw, which is not much to justify any complex work.

At the moment, I'm thinking more of get it approved as 1-bedder first, with living/dining/kitchen at roller door side (yes - agree with neK and Westminster on this as a better place for living/dining/kitchen), then maybe add a 2nd bedroom/study afterwards. Wonder if subsequent approval is needed to add this 2-bed later on?

Thanks again all. I'll keep you updated on how things go.

 

[neK]

Is that colourbond fence that runs parallel to the longer side of the garage already there? Or was it something you were planning to put in?

 

[kristaje]

Hi neK,‬

The fence is already there. It looks quite straight forward to move it back, but I'd guess some landscaping will need to be done afterwards. Currently the yard next to GF is paved, while on the other side is turf.

I just sent Serge a couple of drawings (attached). His current suggestion is also to have living/dining/kitchen in the front (near current rolling door) - seems like it's current consensus on best use of this area. Changes I'd proposed were change to the toilet orientation and bathroom door location, so bathroom door opens to hallway (see Drawing 1).

Re. 2 bedroom, I was thinking of splitting the back area into 2, as per your suggestion (see Drawing 2). No window in the 2nd bedroom, but since it's located in front of the sliding door facing out - using a french door should provide good lighting to the room. Would be interested in your thoughts on this. Thanks again.

 

[westminster]

Hi neK,‬

The fence is already there. It looks quite straight forward to move it back, but I'd guess some landscaping will need to be done afterwards. Currently the yard next to GF is paved, while on the other side is turf.

I just sent Serge a couple of drawings (attached). His current suggestion is also to have living/dining/kitchen in the front (near current rolling door) - seems like it's current consensus on best use of this area. Changes I'd proposed were change to the toilet orientation and bathroom door location, so bathroom door opens to hallway (see Drawing 1).

Re. 2 bedroom, I was thinking of splitting the back area into 2, as per your suggestion (see Drawing 2). No window in the 2nd bedroom, but since it's located in front of the sliding door facing out - using a french door should provide good lighting to the room. Would be interested in your thoughts on this. Thanks again.

If there is turf on the other side I would just move the fence sideways and then have a few metres of turf on the GF side and the rest on the house side.

Then you have a choice of having the habitable private space there or at the roller door section.

Your options for the second smaller room are
- velux window in the roof (bit pricey but nice as you can put shades on them)
- skylight
- french doors - but I'm not sure if they get around the window requirement - Brazen will be able to know

 

[neK]

whats the gap between the colourbond fence the garage?

If you have 3m width, this is what I would try for.

Also with the front, depending on the type of roof you have, you might want to make the front look like this, that way it doesnt actually look like a garage.

http://marketnews.com.au/2011/04/double-fronter-or-two-storey-single-fronted-cottage/

 

[kristaje]

Thank you very much, neK and Westminster for all your suggestion. Much appreciated.

After much thinking and many emails back and forth with Serge, I decided to go with a 1-bedroom granny flat as attached. Reasons are mainly to minimise complexity on work done & cost/rent potential. Also I prefer to keep current tenant (staying in main house) during the work, so refrain from moving the dividing fence.

As stands now, few things will need to be done after approval, as follows. I'll keep updating this thread as it progresses.

1. Bathroom window removed, inside relined with matching tiles or villaboard as necessary.
2. Bathroom skylight installed
3. Fire rated wall to left hand side of outer building installed.
4. Internal walls relined and insulated where missing
5. Front wall installed + Door + Window + Insulation
6 Kitchen reinstalled + new plumbing to meet BASIX
7. Floors done using floating floorboard
8. Vertical Blinds installed to all windows and sliding glass door.
9. Rainwater Tank installed + external tap.
10. Solar Hot water System installed
11. Waterproofing certificate done
12. Termite Certificate done maybe (structure has steel frame, so may get away without this)
13. CERTIFIER CARRIES OUT FINAL INSPECTION & ISSUES OCCUPATION CERTIFICATE

Now, crossing my fingers for the approval

 

[kristaje]

Hiya all,

Just an update on the GF: it's finally approved today!

Current tenant is on an expired lease, so my PM will be talking to them signing a new lease only for the main house. Hope we could get the GF back soon and start work.

Meanwhile I will need to decide on the builder to use. Serge and Steve from Rightgroup had kindly refer me to several builders, a couple of them look good - I think it'll come down to whose timeline matches ours better. Quotes ranging from 33k-35k so far, and potential rent is $230K, so return is pretty good. Main house rent without GF will be $10pw less than current.

 

[kristaje]

A quick update on the GF....

Unfortunately there has been some delay. Current tenants refused to sign a new lease for house only, as they needed the current garage for storage. We proposed getting a shed erected at the main house backyard to be used as an alternative storage area, but they refused. So at the end we gave them a 90d notice to vacate. Counting down days now....

 

[kristaje]

Another update....

As of last week, the GF build is in progress, and should be completed in the next 3-7 weeks (yay!).