Pergola approval

[scientist]

I want to build a pergola in my PPOR. The rule with my local council is that the pergola must be 25m2 or less, else a DA is required. I plan to build a pergola roughly 40m2 and I've been told I can lodge it as a 'complying development' whatever that means.

I had a look at the application procedure and checklist and it's pretty long. The council isn't helpful in giving real world practical advice and just tell me to hire x y z (at god knows what cost) for all their report requirements. Basically the drawings and the engineer report (regarding the building details) are the two main ones.

Just want to ask - for DAs for something this small, do many people do it themselves? What is the extent of the DIY - do you do your own drawings? And where do I find an engineer to sign off on my drawings regarding the foundations and design being sound? And finally if DIY is too much for me, are there any companies that will do the entire DA process for me? I'm going to build the thing myself, I'm only after the process being handled.

 

[redwing]

Is there a difference between a Patio and a Pergola according to Council?

 

[vaughan]

I want to build a pergola in my PPOR. The rule with my local council is that the pergola must be 25m2 or less, else a DA is required. I plan to build a pergola roughly 40m2 and I've been told I can lodge it as a 'complying development' whatever that means.

I had a look at the application procedure and checklist and it's pretty long. The council isn't helpful in giving real world practical advice and just tell me to hire x y z (at god knows what cost) for all their report requirements. Basically the drawings and the engineer report (regarding the building details) are the two main ones.

Just want to ask - for DAs for something this small, do many people do it themselves? What is the extent of the DIY - do you do your own drawings? And where do I find an engineer to sign off on my drawings regarding the foundations and design being sound? And finally if DIY is too much for me, are there any companies that will do the entire DA process for me? I'm going to build the thing myself, I'm only after the process being handled.

Council DAs need shadow diagrams and all sorts of complicated things. Best to keep to the exempt development envelope, or prepare to jump through the DA hoops.

BTW, 40m is the size of a granny flat. Huge.

Is it a pergola or a paved area with a roof over top? A paved area probably won't need approval. A roof may need approval. You may be able to get your 40m2 paved area with a 25m2 roof over the top as an exempt development.

BTW, something built as an exempt development (i.e. no council approval needed) still needs to be built to the relevant standards, otherwise council can come around and order it demolished.

 

[scientist]

It's a wood deck on joists - should I look into whether the 25m2 roof can get this through as exempt?

 

[vaughan]

Chapter and verse form the SEPP:

Subdivision 6
2.11 Specified development
Balconies, decks, patios, pergolas, terraces and verandahs

The construction or installation of a balcony, deck, patio, pergola, terrace or verandah (whether free standing or attached to the ground floor level of a building, or roofed or unroofed) is development specified for this code if it is not constructed or installed on or in a heritage item or a draft heritage item or on land in a foreshore area.

2.12 Development standards

The standards specified for that development are that the development must:
(a) be for domestic purposes only, and
(b) have an area of not more than 25m2, and
(c) not cause the total floor area of all such structures on the lot to be more than:
(i) for a lot larger than 300m2—15% of the ground floor area of the dwelling on the lot, or
(ii) for a lot 300m2 or less—25m2, and
(d) not have an enclosing wall higher than 1.4m, and
(e) be located behind the building line of any road frontage, and
(f) be located at least 900mm from each lot boundary, and
(g) (Repealed)
(h) to the extent it is comprised of metal components—be constructed of low reflective, factory pre-coloured materials, and
(i) have a floor height not more than 1m above ground level (existing), and
(j) if it is a roofed structure attached to a dwelling—not extend above the roof gutter line of the dwelling, and
(k) be no higher than 3m at its highest point above ground level (existing), and
(l) if it is connected to a fascia—be connected in accordance with a professional engineer’s specifications, and
(m) be constructed or installed so that any roofwater is disposed of into an existing stormwater drainage system, and
not interfere with the functioning of existing drainage fixtures or flow paths, and
(n) if it is located on bush fire prone land and is less than 5m from a dwelling—be constructed of non-combustible material, and
(o) if it is constructed or installed in a heritage conservation area or a draft heritage conservation area—be located behind the building line of any road frontage.

If your deck area is greater than 25m2 you'll need to get council approval. However if the deck was 25m2 and there was paving around it, then you'd be sweet. (As long as the other requirements are meet too.)

You could have a 25m2 carport, as well as the pergola, and still be exempt.

 

[Propagate]

What if you designed it as 2x 20m2 decks with 2x 20m2 roofs over?

Abutted up to each other to give the appearance of one structure, but not physically connected to each other?

Would that count as not needing DA?

 

[Tonibell]

If budget is important then you really want to do this as an exempt development. Complying developments and DAs come with a lot of added expense.

It is really worth understanding the code - it is not that long or complex and there are a lot of easy to read guides.

You will find there is a lot you can do as an exempt development - this thread shows what we were able to do.

http://somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90076

 

[scientist]

What if you designed it as 2x 20m2 decks with 2x 20m2 roofs over?

Abutted up to each other to give the appearance of one structure, but not physically connected to each other?

Would that count as not needing DA?

This is some good thinking!

 

[DaveM]

What if you designed it as 2x 20m2 decks with 2x 20m2 roofs over?

Abutted up to each other to give the appearance of one structure, but not physically connected to each other?

Would that count as not needing DA?

Typically complying developments are limited to one per lot to stop this exact thing from happening

 

[scientist]

If budget is important then you really want to do this as an exempt development. Complying developments and DAs come with a lot of added expense.

It is really worth understanding the code - it is not that long or complex and there are a lot of easy to read guides.

You will find there is a lot you can do as an exempt development - this thread shows what we were able to do.

http://somersoft.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90076

Thanks - I read your other thread, my question is if you can do this with exempt developments (i.e. stack individual exempt dev pieces together to effectively achieve a bigger building / floorspace) then what's the point of the thresholds for complying / DA? Are you sure there isn't a provision somewhere that deals with this tactic, or something vaguely worded in terms of following the codes with 'good faith' etc?

I would love to be able to do what you've done, just worried there could be trouble down the line. What is really considered 'separate'? e.g. if I were to build 2 decks 20m2 each, what signifies that they are separate?

 

[scientist]

Chapter and verse form the SEPP:



If your deck area is greater than 25m2 you'll need to get council approval. However if the deck was 25m2 and there was paving around it, then you'd be sweet. (As long as the other requirements are meet too.)

You could have a 25m2 carport, as well as the pergola, and still be exempt.

(c) not cause the total floor area of all such structures on the lot to be more than:
(i) for a lot larger than 300m2?15% of the ground floor area of the dwelling on the lot, or
(ii) for a lot 300m2 or less?25m2, and

for (c) (ii) my lot is 480sqm and the house is only around 110sqm floor space inside. With this rule, does that mean the pergola max size is 0.15 x 110 = 16.5sqm?

Also this rule seems to prevent what Propagate suggested, which was build 2x 20sqm pergolas next to each other.

Can someone in the know please comment?

 

[vaughan]

Sounds as though the max pergola is 16.5 m2 as exempt development. If you want more then put in a DA.

 

[Tonibell]

Thanks - I read your other thread, my question is if you can do this with exempt developments (i.e. stack individual exempt dev pieces together to effectively achieve a bigger building / floorspace) then what's the point of the thresholds for complying / DA? Are you sure there isn't a provision somewhere that deals with this tactic, or something vaguely worded in terms of following the codes with 'good faith' etc?

I would love to be able to do what you've done, just worried there could be trouble down the line. What is really considered 'separate'? e.g. if I were to build 2 decks 20m2 each, what signifies that they are separate?

I studied the code in detail and consulted with experts. For sheds it specifically allows you only two per site. The minimum distance between them is not specified - so you can have two sheds side by side, which is what I have done with 20 centimetres separation. I have then joined them. My understanding is you can have 0 distance between them, I've done it this way so that worst case is I just separate them again. I now cannot have any other sheds, cabanas etc on the property. Below is the section of the code for this.


.Subdivision 9 Cabanas, cubby houses, ferneries, garden sheds, gazebos and greenhouses

2.17 Specified development

The construction or installation of a cabana, cubby house, fernery, garden shed, gazebo or greenhouse is development specified for this code if it is not constructed or installed on or in a heritage item or a draft heritage item or on land in a foreshore area.

2.18 Development standards


(1) The standards specified for that development are that the development must:
(a) (Repealed)

(b) not have a floor area of more than:
(i) on land in Zone RU1, RU2, RU3, RU4 or R5?50m2, or

(ii) on land in any other zone?20m2, and

(c) be not higher than 3m above ground level (existing), and

(d) be located at least 900mm from each lot boundary, and

(e) if it is not on land in Zone RU1, RU2, RU3 or RU4?be located behind the building line of any road frontage, and

(f) not be a shipping container, and

(g) be constructed or installed so that roofwater is disposed of without causing a nuisance to adjoining owners, and

(h) to the extent it is comprised of metal components?be constructed of low reflective, factory pre-coloured materials if it is located on land in a residential zone, and

(i) if it is located on bush fire prone land and is less than 5m from a dwelling?be constructed of non-combustible material, and

(j) if it is constructed or installed in a heritage conservation area or a draft heritage conservation area?be located in the rear yard, and

(k) if it is located adjacent to another building?be located so that it does not interfere with the entry to, or exit from, or the fire safety measures contained within, that building.

(2) There must not be more than 2 developments per lot.

 

[Tonibell]

Sounds as though the max pergola is 16.5 m2 as exempt development. If you want more then put in a DA.

It sounds like it is better to have a cabana or a gazebo rather than a pergola in this instance. Could then have two as long as there are no sheds etc already on the property.

 

[Doovalacky]

And where do I find an engineer to sign off on my drawings regarding the foundations and design being sound?

If you buy it kit form the supplier will normally include design specs and foundation requirements.

 

[Public Servant]

I studied the code in detail and consulted with experts. For sheds it specifically allows you only two per site. The minimum distance between them is not specified - so you can have two sheds side by side, which is what I have done with 20 centimetres separation. I have then joined them. My understanding is you can have 0 distance between them, I've done it this way so that worst case is I just separate them again. I now cannot have any other sheds, cabanas etc on the property. Below is the section of the code for this.


.Subdivision 9 Cabanas, cubby houses, ferneries, garden sheds, gazebos and greenhouses

2.17 Specified development

The construction or installation of a cabana, cubby house, fernery, garden shed, gazebo or greenhouse is development specified for this code if it is not constructed or installed on or in a heritage item or a draft heritage item or on land in a foreshore area.

2.18 Development standards


(1) The standards specified for that development are that the development must:
(a) (Repealed)

(b) not have a floor area of more than:
(i) on land in Zone RU1, RU2, RU3, RU4 or R5?50m2, or

(ii) on land in any other zone?20m2, and

(c) be not higher than 3m above ground level (existing), and

(d) be located at least 900mm from each lot boundary, and

(e) if it is not on land in Zone RU1, RU2, RU3 or RU4?be located behind the building line of any road frontage, and

(f) not be a shipping container, and

(g) be constructed or installed so that roofwater is disposed of without causing a nuisance to adjoining owners, and

(h) to the extent it is comprised of metal components?be constructed of low reflective, factory pre-coloured materials if it is located on land in a residential zone, and

(i) if it is located on bush fire prone land and is less than 5m from a dwelling?be constructed of non-combustible material, and

(j) if it is constructed or installed in a heritage conservation area or a draft heritage conservation area?be located in the rear yard, and

(k) if it is located adjacent to another building?be located so that it does not interfere with the entry to, or exit from, or the fire safety measures contained within, that building.

(2) There must not be more than 2 developments per lot.

Thanks for pointing that out!

I was really upset when I realised I couldn't build my 45sqm deck & pergola without getting approval, but now I have hope that I can build 2 decks located side by side with a small gap...and wondering if on the top I could have shade cloth and have it classed as a fernery (would just have to purchase a few ferns).

Its definitely something I will propose to council in the upcoming weeks.