Ray White Payment Gateway fee -- anyone use this system?

[dsherriff]

Payment Gateway Fees

Hello all
I could not help myself in posting a response to this thread.
I am a real estate agent principle and operate a rent roll of approx 400 properties within the Ray White group. We employ 4 staff members plus one admin to maintain a rent roll of this size. I believe we offer a large benefit to Landlords as this is what we do all day every day, and like you all with your jobs we become very knowledgeable with the legislation. The Tenancies act is complicated and fraught with danger for Landlords that can at times be flippant to the law. Payment gateway is a third party web based company called ipayrent and the fees do not come to the agent at all. The fees are charged by and go direct to the third party for their services the same as the bank charge for these same services. There are many advantages for the Agent and the tenant. The agent has an upload file that is emailed to the agency daily and this automatically receipts to the tenants electronically coded account. For us to manually receipt 400 tenants would take one person 6-8 hours per day and tenants decide to use their own codes that cannot be traced back to the correct tenant (what a mess this creates for property managers). This also eliminates the human error that can occur from the bank tellers, the tenant, the agency. Easy when you have a handful of tenants but not so easy when you have 400. The Banks are only now starting to get up to this level of service so the third party company has been the Industries only option till recent. If we decide to change banks we would have to let every tenant know new bank details and wait until all tenants have started in the new account before closing the old, this can take 3 months or more and upsets the tenants and throws out their payment schedule. With the third party it is one notification and tenant is not interrupted with their payments. Further to this Banks charge us huge fees to operate a trust account as it is, plus the yearly audit fees with the accountants and OCCBA want there cut as well yearly. It all sounds on the out side that the Real Estate agent makes the cash but let me tell you that on average the agency receives $1100- $1500 per property per year for all that they do before expenses and wages are taken out. Hope this clears up some misunderstandings in the thread.

 

[Ausprop]

if this is indeed complusory then there would be stronger interest than just the tribunal. we all heard the debate that raged when ebay tried to force everyone onto paypal and we saw where that went.

 

[CHAOS]

Payment gateway is a third party web based company called ipayrent and the fees do not come to the agent at all. The fees are charged by and go direct to the third party for their services the same as the bank charge for these same services. QUOTE]

It does not matter that these fees do not contribute to your profits. You employed a company to make collecting the rent easier for your business and you may need less manpower in the office saving you money also. Your expense to cover.

Can you explain the OTC fee of $3.00? Surely this is not collected by a third party?

I recently enrolled my child in after school care and was given a direct debit form. The service provider has outsourced their fee collection. Where it lists account set up fee, depsoit fees, credit card fees it says PAID FOR BY THE BUSINESS. The after-school care provider wants us to pay via direct debit becasue it is to their benefit so they are picking up the tab.

Having said that though these expenses are probably already factored into the prices they charge like many business do - electricity prices come to mind!

 

[fisherman]

An interesting thread.

Regardless of the rights and wrongs of this fee and it is small (yes there is a principle involved) I don't see why the property owner would get involved as the meat in the sandwich between the property manager and the tenant.

I would be discouraging the tenant from contacting me direct and referring him/her back to the PM. The first obvious reason is that the owner is not aware of what has transpired before. There may be the unusual exception to this rule but it would involve something serious, such as the PM charging higher rent than is being declared to the owner.

As well, tenancy regulations provide many conditions and means for the resolution of problems. Tenants have enough advocates, and free. We should not be adding to our risks and daily woes by putting our spade into the water as well. Especially given the likelihood of salties lurking in the muddied waters.

Property owners complain about government regulators presuming to make them their brother's keeper. Property owners have cause for such grievance. We shouldn't be adding to it through our own decisions.

 

[joanmc]

We just did a handyman job and the tenant there is apparently being charged $9.90 to pay her rent. I think this is a bit extreme. The agency refuses to accept cash. I am wondering if it is illegal to refuse cash as it is legal tender?

 

[skater]

We just did a handyman job and the tenant there is apparently being charged $9.90 to pay her rent. I think this is a bit extreme. The agency refuses to accept cash. I am wondering if it is illegal to refuse cash as it is legal tender?

I thought that an agency had to give one option of payment that was free to the tenant. Sheesh! $9.90 is a bit extreme. If I was the tenant, I'd be making waves over that.

 

[livewildcard]

Wonder if thats true or tenant is just saying that.

 

[mattysavager]

Our office used to use Stratapay as an option for rental payments. It costs the tenant $2.50 per transaction, and the company keeps that. We always offered direct deposit, but many tenants preferred Stratapay as they could pay by credit card etc.

Around 2 years ago we stopped giving out Stratapay Cards. It was a lot of adminstration to get tenants set up on the Stratapay website, give them a card, and then set up our system to receive the rent. We got sick of wasting time doing it, for tenants to turn their nose up at the $2.50 per payment charge.

Now almost all of our tenants just transfer us rent every fortnight. I do the banking every day (we have around 80 payments every day that I enter, it takes me 30 minutes).

We frequently have tenants thank us for allowing them to transfer rent, and that's usually accompanied by a complaint about 'X Chain' real estate agent who forced them to pay fees when paying rent. It seems tenants don't like paying $2.50-$10 for the convenience of paying online. I don't blame them.

Most agencies also accept payment via cheque, which is technically 'free' for the tenant, so that might satisfy any requirements that they have.

 

[mattysavager]

For us to manually receipt 400 tenants would take one person 6-8 hours per day and tenants decide to use their own codes that cannot be traced back to the correct tenant (what a mess this creates for property managers).

Our office rents to around 700 tenants and I manually receipt the rent. I start at 8.30am and always finish balancing the account by 9am. I could do it with one hand tied behind my back, and on a typewriter and it wouldn't take me 8 hours.

And if a tenant doesn't use the correct reference number, that's their problem.. They'll provide a transfer receipt when they receive an SMS/breach for rent arrears...

 

[joanmc]

Just to clarify we are not her landlords and the company is not our PM company for our rentals. We have a property maintenance business and were there in that capacity. Her rent is 290 per week but effectively she is paying 300 pw. She said she has asked to pay in cash but was told no she could only Bpay, bank cheque or money order.
It just made us wonder about the legality of refusing legal tender to pay a bill.

 

[neK]

For us to manually receipt 400 tenants would take one person 6-8 hours per day and tenants decide to use their own codes that cannot be traced back to the correct tenant (what a mess this creates for property managers).

Translation:
If i use this system, it saves one full time staff wage at say $50k p.a.
Now this system charges $2 per transaction, i know ill force all my users onto this system, make them pay $2 per transaction, meanwhile I'll save $50k p.a.
To ensure users don't complain, im going spin some BS about how this benefits them and completely disregard how it saves me (the property manager) money each year

Seriously, if it saves the property manager money, they should wear it. Plain and simple, don't spin BS expecting people to accept it.

 

[skater]

Translation:
If i use this system, it saves one full time staff wage at say $50k p.a.
Now this system charges $2 per transaction, i know ill force all my users onto this system, make them pay $2 per transaction, meanwhile I'll save $50k p.a.
To ensure users don't complain, im going spin some BS about how this benefits them and completely disregard how it saves me (the property manager) money each year

Seriously, if it saves the property manager money, they should wear it. Plain and simple, don't spin BS expecting people to accept it.

I agree wholeheartedly, however the poster is a one post wonder, just here long enough to try to justify his position.

 

[MattyD]

Bon,

Surely it's easier to move house ?

I'm not being facetious and taking the ****, I do mean it seriously.


Stuff like the above is why I self manage

I have recently signed a 6 month lease with Ray White and have only found out after signing the lease that I'll be charged a superflous $3 for every BPAY transaction. I am a uni student who earns a very minimal amount of money to live off of and the cost of moving houses is quite substantial to me.

In short, no, it's NOT easier to move house!

And I think it is disgusting that I should be expected to when I signed a lease agreeing to pay X amount of money per week to live in this house and now I am expected to pay more. Yes, $3 per week is not massive, but hey, there is a principle too.

Add to this the fact that I have been treated with nothing but disrespect by the agents at Ray White. From the very start, they have arranged inspection times and just didn't show up on two occasions, staff members failed to call me back as promised, meetings were missed, and all of this occurred at my own expense, I was the one who had to miss out on work to do these things. No explanation, no apology. Every interaction I've had with them has been characterised by things like this; every staff member I've dealt with has been completely incompetent and insufferably rude.

I am a good tenant with a good tenancy history. I pay rent on time, I keep my rented properties clean and in good form, I am always polite and courteous when I deal with people and I am now quite frankly tired of being pushed around and taken advantage of by real estate agents!

Now I'm in an awkward position, I want to continue renting this property regardless of the terrible property managers and staff at my local Ray White; when I agreed to take this lease I came to a verbal and written agreement with the property owner and Ray White that they would offer us a 6 month lease (even though we wanted the guarantee of 12 months because we simply can't afford to be moving that much) on the condition that unless we proved to be bad tenants (trashing the place, paying rent late etc) we would be offered another 6 month lease at the same price afterwards.

Now I'm in a position where I feel indignant about their unprofessional, disrespectful actions and I frankly want to flat out refuse to pay these additional fees and take them to the tribunal. Unfortunately, if I do this and stand up for my rights, I will likely not be offered another 6 month lease and have to fork out the hundreds of dollars to move again, regardless of the fact that I have been a good tenant and have treated everyone with respect and courtesy in all of my dealings.

Before anyone points the finger and tells me that it's completely up to me whether or not I rent through Ray White I'll stress the fact that I was not informed about these extra charges before signing the lease. As it was, between us entering our application for the property and signing the lease, the PM put the rent up by $15 p/w without even informing us!

Supporting one's self through university is a pretty tough gig at times and I feel like I've been pushed and shoved around by Ray White in this instance.

Does anyone know if I have a leg to stand on should I choose to fight these superflous fees (Note: I was not given a payment option that did not occur a fee) and also hope to sign a new 6 month lease at the property as agreed?

Sorry about the novel sized post, I've just been feeling really upset about my whole experience and wanted to get it off my chest!!

 

[MattyD]

PS,

Section 59 of the Residential Tenancies and Rooming Accommodation Act 2008 (QLD)

Restriction on amounts that may be taken from
prospective tenant:
The lessor or lessor’s agent must not take an amount from a
prospective tenant for a residential tenancy other than the
following—
(a) a key deposit;
(b) a holding deposit;
(c) a rental bond;
(d) rent.
Maximum penalty—20 penalty units.

Is there some loophole that allows Ray White to effectively do this?

Also, I hate that the QLD Gov't has recently cut all funding to the Tenant's Union of QLD and Tenant Advice & Advocacy Service QLD. Really disadvantages renters who are just trying to get an honest deal...we all need somewhere to live.

 

[BeYourOwnAgent]

It's against the Act - you cannot charge a tenant any fees associated with collecting the rent.

It's only a matter of time before RW get in trouble for this, regardless of how they try and paint the picture.

 

[happy landlord]

In Qld you have to give tenants 3 options in which to pay their rent. Would like to know how these agents get around the law by making tenants pay through these systems?

I have heard of other agencies who do this as well.

 

[BeYourOwnAgent]

In Qld you have to give tenants 3 options in which to pay their rent. Would like to know how these agents get around the law by making tenants pay through these systems?

I have heard of other agencies who do this as well.

They can't force tenants to use this system - it's against the law.

 

[kristinadalitha]

NSW property managers by law have to provide "ONE FEE FREE" way of paying rent.

 

[tenantsrep]

Reply to all

Does anyone else here use Ray White as their property manager and their tenants have to use the Ray White Payment Gateway system to pay their rent?

I recently had an email from a tenant complaining that she has been told to use this system to pay her rent and will be charged a fee of $1.65 each time she makes a payment.

I did some googling and found this on a Ray White site:
Rent must be paid weekly, fortnightly or monthly via Ray White Payment Gateway (telephone, internet, direct debit, BPay, Post Billpay), Centrepay or Money Order. [Please note charges apply for these methods of payment: $1.65 for Ray White Payment Gateway or 2.2% of the transaction fee if paid by Credit Card via Ray White Payment Gateway; $2.00 for BPay; $3.00 for Post BillPay; $0.99 for Centrepay; And from $4.00 for Money Order (prices quoted correct as at 1 April 2009).

The tenant emailed me saying:



I also don't think it's very fair that tenants are being asked to pay this fee but not sure whether i should offer to pay the fee or just hope the tenant accepts it.

Has anyone else had complaints from their tenants about this system?
Are there any alternative methods for tenants to pay their rent so they can avoid this fee?

I have just had a week long fight with Ray White over this.They are saying I have options of "Bank Cheque, Payment Gateway, Deduction from Pay"
I pointed out that Bank Cheque is not an approved option and that they must give two "APPROVED" options other than their preferred option. They have relented and "allowed" me to carry on with my EFT payments for the moment.
So it seems, by my experience, they are getting away with it by misinforming and intimidating tenants. Ultimately when pressed they have given in so of course now I cannot take them to the "tribunal" as now I don't have a disagreement with them, so now they won't get into trouble and be fined.
Everyone should read this http://www.rta.qld.gov.au/Resources...-agents-newsletter/December-2013-January-2014. The section on "Paying Rent viaThird Party Providors, by the RTA General Manager. This and the "Act"should be a definitive answer to all on this forum, agents and tenants.
So What it seems we need is people to be informed of there rights so they can stand up for themselves and someone to take Ray White to the "Tribunal"

 

[Scott No Mates]

I recall reading recently a case where the tenant took the agency to the tribunal over the additional charge of $1.95 & won.