Recap on The Great Depression Ahead

I'm reading this book right now and I must say it's rather unnerving given the current economic situation...
The Great Depression Ahead: How to Prosper in the Crash Following the Greatest Boom in History. By Harry S Dent.

The idea of the risk to the economy from the retirement of baby boomers has been mentioned on Somersoft but in no great detail for some time. So perhaps a brief refresher might be worthwhile.

As I am now seeing it, Harry Dent's premise is that while the boom of the 90s and early 2000s were caused by easy & cheap money, that easy money was in turn created because of demand from the large number of baby boomers entering their peak spending years (reliably 46-50 years old). And indeed the stagflation of the 70s was caused by the drop in the number of people in their peak spending years (46-50 years after birth numbers dropped throughout the 30s and early 40s).

The unnerving part is Mr Dents forecast for the future. According to his reading of the baby boomer tea leaves, their peak spending years are over as of 2010-2012, and that countries who had post WW2 baby booms will go into a ten year plus depression (see charts). If he's right, no amount of rates easing or printing money can solve the problem, only a decade of deflation.

Japan went through the 'Lost Decade' (now two decades), of deflation for much the same reasons. Unfortunately I couldn't find a graph online which shows the correlation of Japans Nikkei index with the dropoff in consumer spending.

China's and India's birth cycles are different to Aus, US, UK & Europe. So for this reason Australia may be sheltered somewhat, but China can't continue grow as fast as they have been, if the world goes into depression.

Dent began making these forecasts in the 90s I think. He successfully forecast the decade long boom of the 90s. Though the Dow fell short of hitting his later forecast of 40,000 by 2006, he did get the direction and timing right.


Births.jpg



Average20Spending.jpg



Below: The grey chart is US Births lagged by 50 years for peak spending. It seems to show that peak spending at 50 years of age coincided with stagflation, then the boom of the 90s/2000s, and will result in an extended depression, before a recovery.

Moses-Kim_origin-demographics.jpg
 
mmm - sounds like Indian RE is the place to be.

The unnerving part is Mr Dents forecast for the future. According to his reading of the baby boomer tea leaves, their peak spending years are over as of 2010-2012, and that countries who had post WW2 baby booms will go into a ten year plus depression (see charts). If he's right, no amount of rates easing or printing money can solve the problem, only a decade of deflation.

if he's right, then there's no more ROOM for rates easing, short of central banks paying people to take money. the US can dilute it's currency all it likes at the risk of war, which it would profit from regardless.

Though the Dow fell short of hitting his later forecast of 40,000 by 2006, he did get the direction and timing right.

just a bit, don't you think?
 
Will baby boomers be as restricted in spending as previous generations, taking into account the effect of super, investments and generally working longer?
 
I read that a while back.
If I remember right , the DOW was also meant to be at 28000 by now - and a precurser to the great crash that was to follow. Only problem is that its a long way off that mark - so steep rise then steep fall is not going to happen anytime soon!!!
 
Will baby boomers be as restricted in spending as previous generations, taking into account the effect of super, investments and generally working longer?

IN mid-2007, the average superannuation balance of workers aged 55-64 was only $71,731. 1 in 5 had balances over $100,000. The average is skewed because of those with much larger balances, the mean would be lower than $71k.

It's not a huge sum to retire on.

Link
 
This is why there are arguements for a Big Australia.

The idea being that the influx of 20-30 year olds would help the economy when the boomers left their jobs.

One factor i think that is often left out of the discussion is the effect that inheritence will have. A shift of wealth may very well maintain spending.

Euthenasia anyone? :p
 
This is why there are arguements for a Big Australia.

The idea being that the influx of 20-30 year olds would help the economy when the boomers left their jobs.

One factor i think that is often left out of the discussion is the effect that inheritence will have. A shift of wealth may very well maintain spending.

Euthenasia anyone? :p

Wonder why do they tax smokers so heavily then? Sounds like encouraging it would be prudent macro economic policy?

;)
 
Wonder why do they tax smokers so heavily then? Sounds like encouraging it would be prudent macro economic policy?

;)

Should give them Green Stamps which they can save for a trip BEFORE they shuffle off this mortal coil. Would be cheaper than their new hips etc if they grew old. LOL
 
Interesting. It seems that the impact of demographics is very significant; certainly more than is generally appreciated.
 
For sure. Compare the massive area of Australia and its small population with the teeming billions in Asia: even at 100 million population, Australia wouldn't be 'big'.
 
Harry Dent has some interesting ideas, but I'm not convinced he factors in social change well. His overall patterns are probably reasonable in a qualitative sense, but his quantitative predictions are pretty fuzzy.

If someone had accepted that they weren't retiring until their 70's, would they really start living more frugally than their lifetime habit more than 20 years prior to retirment starting? Also, many Australians aren't having kids until their 30's now, and will be supporting these kids well into THEIR 20's, which blows the peak spend age out of the water. As a mid 30's professional, having a child puts me in the minority compared with my peers. Many (most?) still believe they have 'heaps of time yet'. My mother was 42 on my 21st birthday - I think this represents a pretty major social change.
 
Harry Dent has some interesting ideas, but I'm not convinced he factors in social change well. His overall patterns are probably reasonable in a qualitative sense, but his quantitative predictions are pretty fuzzy.

If someone had accepted that they weren't retiring until their 70's, would they really start living more frugally than their lifetime habit more than 20 years prior to retirment starting?

I don't necessarily disagree with your assertion that Dent's ideas can seem somewhat slippery. They are predicated on a huge number of factors. However it's worth noting that these forecasts are for the U.S.A, which may not have had the same 'work longer' reaction that we have. Despite any slipperiness in the factors Dent looks at, I don't doubt that aging baby boomers will at some point want to protect their retirement incomes.

Also, many Australians aren't having kids until their 30's now, and will be supporting these kids well into THEIR 20's, which blows the peak spend age out of the water. As a mid 30's professional, having a child puts me in the minority compared with my peers. Many (most?) still believe they have 'heaps of time yet'. My mother was 42 on my 21st birthday - I think this represents a pretty major social change.

Dent is on about Americans of the baby boomer generation, because their numbers are greater than subsequent generations they have more of an effect on the economy. He definately does take into account changing trends such as a given generations change in parenting age. However it is difficult to factor in trends which are only just starting to become apparent.
 
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I see in the US that Fannie Mae have recently offered yet another NO DOWN home loan package for FHO's called "Affordable Advantage" to moderate income earners.

They will assist FHO these "AA" purchasers if they lose their job and also will lower entry fees on purchase costs

Seems like round 2?
 
Found a new chart, this is a more recent forecast of the net number of people entering the workforce (U.S. forecast), so it adds 20 year olds and subtracts 63 year olds (retiring). Compared to inflation.

InflationForecast.jpg
 
From Current Monthly: HS Dent Forecast
It is the Daily Growth Index in Chart 2 from Consumer
Metrics that seems to be telling the real story, as it
measures consumer spending in real time over the
Internet. This index was the reason way back in March
that we forecast that second quarter GDP would be very
disappointing and would trigger a further stock decline.
This index leads by approximately 4 months and forecasts
a deep recession like late 2008 to mid-2009.

GDPForecast.jpg
 
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