TIC simply clever marketers
I have just spent some time reading this thread from the start and felt I just had to add my two pennies worth. I have no personal experience with TIC but I am aware of how they operate.
IMO they misrepresent themselves by using a business name which includes the word 'club'. I won't go on about this as many of you have already very eloquently stated why this is wrong. However, I will say TIC deliberately use the word club to target inexperienced investors with the intention that the buyer lets down their guard and either forgets, or doesn't even realise, they are dealing with sales agents acting for the seller. The very fact these potential buyers reveal their financial details to TIC is evidence of this. Ask yourself, when would you ever offer a real estate agent a complete financial picture of your position? The only people you would disclose this personal information to would be your accountant, financial advisor or lending institution.
Only a licensed real estate agent is legally allowed to sell real estate (the exception being if you are selling your own property). TIC is not a club, it is a real estate agency and they hold a licence to sell property in each state. In addition, any person directly involved in the selling of real estate (in Queensland) must hold at least a saleperson's certificate under the Property Agents and Motor Dealers Act 2000. I am sure every other state in Australia has similar requirements. Do not think for a minute TIC is a club in the general sense of the word, it is not.
TIC says they act for the buyer. I fail to understand how this is so when they are acting as agent for the seller and paid a commission by the seller. TIC prepares and signs a form 22a (legal requirement in QLD and I'm sure in every other state has something similar) stating they are the seller's agent and TIC must set out in writing the commission the seller has to pay. How do they get away with saying they act for the buyer?
Incidentally, if I were the seller I would be rather upset to be paying any commission when my own agent states he is acting for the buyer and not acting in my interests. I guess at least TIC will not entertain any negotiation on the property asking price, so as a seller I would be extremely happy with that! However, if I’m paying up to 6% + GST in commission I certainly wouldn’t have any room for negotiation.
Just on commission disclosure to the buyer, in Queensland (form 27c), it is a legal requirement to state, in percentage and dollar value, exactly how much commission is paid on a sale. However, the clever markerters get around this by splitting the fees up between different entities claiming part as commission and part as ‘marketing’ or whatever in order that the buyer does not see that, eg $24k + gst is paid out in commission on a $400k sale. That’s pretty shocking and they don’t want you to realise this.
Sometimes they do pay financial planners or accountants an introductory fee (2 to 3 % + gst) and this is why some suggest investment in real estate to their clients and refer them to particular agents. They earn a handsome fee for simply giving the agent a contact and then occasionally help close the sale if the buyer/client refers back to the planner or accountant before committing to the deal.
But often 2 or more of the entities on the 27c are simply the agency. The agency will claim commission of around 2.5 to 3 % + gst and the same again under another entity “the marketing company” and this unfortunately is legal.
TIC says they act for the buyer and guide the buyer towards purchasing a good investment, why then are they not licensed to give financial advice? When are the relevant state governments going to require them to be licensed to give investment advice? Even my accountant has on occasion said he is not licensed to answer a particular question regarding investment and I should ask my financial planner.
Free service??? What's free? Every single person involved in the purchase is paid a fee or commission. No single person works for nothing. The buyer pays for every service either directly or indirectly.
On the whole I think some of the properties offered by TIC are well located and well priced, but not all. Christine's poor investment choice is evidence some are very poor investments indeed (Jenman's original story). Buyers need to do their own research and form their own opinions. The problem is they do not due to the way TIC present themselves. TIC confuses the buyer into thinking they are property investment advisors. Novice investors mistakenly trust TIC and forget they are dealing with sales people, pure and simple. TIC show potential investments in a clever format designed to hoodwink the inexperienced buyer to think TIC is acting in their interests. People, please listen….. THEY ARE NOT. TIC is a real estate agency, a business not a club.
(Please do not read this as agent bashing, TIC actually give real estate agents a bad name.)
Whilst TIC deliberately set out to represent themselves as a club rather than a real estate agency, ultimately I believe the buyer is responsible for their own decisions. If buyers hand over the responsibility to another party and neglect to perform the most basic research or investigation themselves, and it turns out to be a poor investment, they should not blame anyone but themselves.
Just an aside - in Queensland ALL real estate contracts have a front page (in huge print) warning the buyer to seek an independent valuation and advice. Many ignore this warning and sign contracts without even letting their solicitor look it over, let alone get a valuation. Yet the same people will complain and blame someone when they make a bad decision.
If buyers (like Christine) choose to ignore the fundamentals of investing and elect to do no research of their own then who should they blame? They cannot/should not absolve themselves of all responsibility.
It all comes down to that ugly word greed:
Greedy buyers looking only at the potential gains. Either ignorant or too lazy to perform even the most basic research or self education. Unwilling to pay for unbiased advice and eagerly accepting “free” advice.
Greedy agents masquerading as something other than what they truly are, real estate agents working on commission, willing to sell inappropriate property to hapless individuals who do not understand what they are doing.
Sorry this post is so long but I've got 'most' of it off my chest.
I have just spent some time reading this thread from the start and felt I just had to add my two pennies worth. I have no personal experience with TIC but I am aware of how they operate.
IMO they misrepresent themselves by using a business name which includes the word 'club'. I won't go on about this as many of you have already very eloquently stated why this is wrong. However, I will say TIC deliberately use the word club to target inexperienced investors with the intention that the buyer lets down their guard and either forgets, or doesn't even realise, they are dealing with sales agents acting for the seller. The very fact these potential buyers reveal their financial details to TIC is evidence of this. Ask yourself, when would you ever offer a real estate agent a complete financial picture of your position? The only people you would disclose this personal information to would be your accountant, financial advisor or lending institution.
Only a licensed real estate agent is legally allowed to sell real estate (the exception being if you are selling your own property). TIC is not a club, it is a real estate agency and they hold a licence to sell property in each state. In addition, any person directly involved in the selling of real estate (in Queensland) must hold at least a saleperson's certificate under the Property Agents and Motor Dealers Act 2000. I am sure every other state in Australia has similar requirements. Do not think for a minute TIC is a club in the general sense of the word, it is not.
TIC says they act for the buyer. I fail to understand how this is so when they are acting as agent for the seller and paid a commission by the seller. TIC prepares and signs a form 22a (legal requirement in QLD and I'm sure in every other state has something similar) stating they are the seller's agent and TIC must set out in writing the commission the seller has to pay. How do they get away with saying they act for the buyer?
Incidentally, if I were the seller I would be rather upset to be paying any commission when my own agent states he is acting for the buyer and not acting in my interests. I guess at least TIC will not entertain any negotiation on the property asking price, so as a seller I would be extremely happy with that! However, if I’m paying up to 6% + GST in commission I certainly wouldn’t have any room for negotiation.
Just on commission disclosure to the buyer, in Queensland (form 27c), it is a legal requirement to state, in percentage and dollar value, exactly how much commission is paid on a sale. However, the clever markerters get around this by splitting the fees up between different entities claiming part as commission and part as ‘marketing’ or whatever in order that the buyer does not see that, eg $24k + gst is paid out in commission on a $400k sale. That’s pretty shocking and they don’t want you to realise this.
Sometimes they do pay financial planners or accountants an introductory fee (2 to 3 % + gst) and this is why some suggest investment in real estate to their clients and refer them to particular agents. They earn a handsome fee for simply giving the agent a contact and then occasionally help close the sale if the buyer/client refers back to the planner or accountant before committing to the deal.
But often 2 or more of the entities on the 27c are simply the agency. The agency will claim commission of around 2.5 to 3 % + gst and the same again under another entity “the marketing company” and this unfortunately is legal.
TIC says they act for the buyer and guide the buyer towards purchasing a good investment, why then are they not licensed to give financial advice? When are the relevant state governments going to require them to be licensed to give investment advice? Even my accountant has on occasion said he is not licensed to answer a particular question regarding investment and I should ask my financial planner.
Free service??? What's free? Every single person involved in the purchase is paid a fee or commission. No single person works for nothing. The buyer pays for every service either directly or indirectly.
On the whole I think some of the properties offered by TIC are well located and well priced, but not all. Christine's poor investment choice is evidence some are very poor investments indeed (Jenman's original story). Buyers need to do their own research and form their own opinions. The problem is they do not due to the way TIC present themselves. TIC confuses the buyer into thinking they are property investment advisors. Novice investors mistakenly trust TIC and forget they are dealing with sales people, pure and simple. TIC show potential investments in a clever format designed to hoodwink the inexperienced buyer to think TIC is acting in their interests. People, please listen….. THEY ARE NOT. TIC is a real estate agency, a business not a club.
(Please do not read this as agent bashing, TIC actually give real estate agents a bad name.)
Whilst TIC deliberately set out to represent themselves as a club rather than a real estate agency, ultimately I believe the buyer is responsible for their own decisions. If buyers hand over the responsibility to another party and neglect to perform the most basic research or investigation themselves, and it turns out to be a poor investment, they should not blame anyone but themselves.
Just an aside - in Queensland ALL real estate contracts have a front page (in huge print) warning the buyer to seek an independent valuation and advice. Many ignore this warning and sign contracts without even letting their solicitor look it over, let alone get a valuation. Yet the same people will complain and blame someone when they make a bad decision.
If buyers (like Christine) choose to ignore the fundamentals of investing and elect to do no research of their own then who should they blame? They cannot/should not absolve themselves of all responsibility.
It all comes down to that ugly word greed:
Greedy buyers looking only at the potential gains. Either ignorant or too lazy to perform even the most basic research or self education. Unwilling to pay for unbiased advice and eagerly accepting “free” advice.
Greedy agents masquerading as something other than what they truly are, real estate agents working on commission, willing to sell inappropriate property to hapless individuals who do not understand what they are doing.
Sorry this post is so long but I've got 'most' of it off my chest.
