Australias next Prime Minister

Incorrect. You can't see cos you clearly don't wish to see.

You've fallen for the same trap that most modern Australians and media have fallen into - the Presidential style - leader takes all approach.

Once you understand a bit more about how the system works....and I find that unlikely with your blanket 'all politicians lie' mantra. It's very cool to say but grossly inaccurate, there are many many upstanding candidates from both sides of Parliament.....you'll find out that the general party position overrules what the leader says / thinks.

This was amply demonstrated when your favourite "ol' Malcolm" got the heave ho. The branch members were not happy at all with Malcolm agreeing with labor's position on climate change and the carbon tax. They accurately sensed the groundswell of the majority of the Australian population who consider the Carbon Tax a farce and the underlying premise of the Climate Change debate wholly unsubstantiated....to the satisfaction of the common people who will bear the brunt of the Tax.

As it turned out, the change to Tony and the policies he wanted put forth at the Fed election in August 2010 saw the biggest loss of seats for Labor for any first term Fed Govt in history. It was simply the fact that Labor had such a commanding lead from the 2007 election that they managed to hang on for a draw at 72 seats each. To claw back something like 16 seats was a huge swing away from Labor as compared with the 2007 result.

Subsequently of course, with the Green influence now amply demonstrated, and what silent little economic freeloaders they have proven to be, the Australian population has now seen what Labor and the Greens philosophies on management are, and clearly don't want a bar of it.

Bring on an election.

The subject is Australia's next Prime Minister. Not Australia's next elected party. Hence I was responding to that question. I highly dislike Abbott and the direction that he is taking the party. It is populist and lowest common denominator. As much as I found Costello irksome at the time he wrote a very interesting opinion piece about the drift of the party away from it's roots. It's just a fourth rate tea party copy now.

I want a viable alternative. Not neat little sound bites designed to appeal to those who just want to blame all the ills on immigrants and women.

Oh - and I did have a chance to vote for who would be the next PM. And I put him last ;)

Care to point out specific areas which the policy of the greens mimics a communist state? Please. Details. And don't just use that pathetic errrrm they want to tax me and stuff. All states impose taxes of some sort. I'm looking for key policy points. Such as the way in which the approach taken to natural resources (bugger the environment, we got some soil to rip up, yeah hah) are very similar.

As for Carbon Tax - is that the same Carbon Tax that Tony Abbott supported over the ETS in 2009? My. What a short memory you have. So, really, all that the ALP have done is implement a policy that Abbott has already stated support for. He should be happy he has such an impact.

Oh, and it is the nature of the party political system that politicians have to lie at some stage. This is more true of the ALP than liberals as at least the liberals allow a conscience vote. But there are some former politicians I do respect. Chief amonst them is the late Peter Andren. Now, there was a man with morals, ethics and commitment to his local community.
 
As it turned out, the change to Tony and the policies he wanted put forth at the Fed election in August 2010 saw the biggest loss of seats for Labor for any first term Fed Govt in history. It was simply the fact that Labor had such a commanding lead from the 2007 election that they managed to hang on for a draw at 72 seats each. To claw back something like 16 seats was a huge swing away from Labor as compared with the 2007 result.

Policies? What were they? I remember a lot of three word slogans which were designed to appeal to the unthinking masses. But I don't remember much policy detail.

I remember one idea, of giving every stay-at-home mum $10,000, which fitted with Abbott's staunchly conservative views. This was defeated in the party room by those with a better understanding of economics.

The way the polls are, Abbott will be Prime Minister after the next election, and hopefully he will be a good one.

But he worries me because he is staunchly conservative, has no understanding of economics and has admitted he puts 'pragmatism ahead of policy'.

Not much of a choice at the moment...
 
Care to point out specific areas which the policy of the greens mimics a communist state? Please. Details. And don't just use that pathetic errrrm they want to tax me and stuff. All states impose taxes of some sort. I'm looking for key policy points. Such as the way in which the approach taken to natural resources (bugger the environment, we got some soil to rip up, yeah hah) are very similar.

You're kidding right? The core values of a communist party is that they mine?

May as well say Stalin and Abbot have the same haircut: therefore Abbot is a commy!
 
You're kidding right? The core values of a communist party is that they mine?

May as well say Stalin and Abbot have the same haircut: therefore Abbot is a commy!

I'm trying to work out what green policies are the mirror image of a communist state. I always hear this glib throw away line but yet to see substantial proof of it.

What I am saying is that in one area the policy position of the liberals is much closer to the former USSR than the greens current policy.

Oh - and at the last election I put Abbott (personally) last and the greens second last, so I am not a huge fan of them either.
 
Oh - and at the last election I put Abbott (personally) last and the greens second last, so I am not a huge fan of them either.


You poor misguided sod. If you did that, then you are definitely in the irrelevant minority.


You either voted for poor ol' Hugh, who only managed 18,000 out of the 89,000 votes, with his vote screaming back from a pitiful 28% of the primary back to an irrelevant 21% of the primary OR you voted for Alex representing the Sex party....


Come on, tease me Ideo, which one did you vote for, the irrelevant Labor candidate or the Sex party candidate ??


http://www.abc.net.au/elections/federal/2010/guide/warr.htm


There really is nothing sadder than some Ideological twisted soul, squirreled away in some safe Federal seat, where the man he despises and disagrees with all of his values is not only his local representative, but safely returned with an increased all conquering thumping 59% primary vote.


You really must lead a tortured life.....do you wear purple a lot ?? :D
 
I didn't vote labor.

They were third on my lists.

I can't remember if it was the Australian Sex Party or the Secular Party. ALP was third.

I was completly unenamoured with any party or candidates. I longed for a good indie candidate, but it wasn't too be. As I said, I highly respect people like Peter Andren who represent their constituents rather than the party machine.

I wasn't going to protest vote for the greens as I am against a lot of their policies. I was disapointed in the ALP, and do not like the current direction of the Libs. Living in a safe seat means my vote is largely irrelevant. In fact, I think the booth I voted at (in Mosman) had over 90% of votes go to Abbott. I disagree with him and dislike him on a personal level, but that's what the majority of people in the seat I live in wanted, so that's how a democracy works.

I'm not going to pout and sulk about it and carry on about it. I'll leave that to the ideologically tied liberal supporters. They do more than enough of it for everyone. Although in fairness, if Oakeshott et al had decided to back the coalition then blind ALP supporters would be carrying on the same.
 
I'm trying to work out what green policies are the mirror image of a communist state. I always hear this glib throw away line but yet to see substantial proof of it.

What I am saying is that in one area the policy position of the liberals is much closer to the former USSR than the greens current policy.

Oh - and at the last election I put Abbott (personally) last and the greens second last, so I am not a huge fan of them either.

A quick surf on the Greens site reveals the following policies. While they're not as bad as a "Communist state" (whatever that means - usually a dictatorship) they are clearly unfriendly to the interests of private capital and involve "socialising" wealth, in a number of forms.

While I agree with many of their environmental policies, I just wish they weren't watermelons. I can't support them with policies like this...

- require elections of boards of publicly listed companies to be conducted by an independent statutory body.
- reduce inequities in the current personal tax system by:
• reducing tax breaks for high income earners;
• removing Fringe Benefits Tax concessions which promote increased use of motor vehicles;
• removing the concessional arrangements for Capital Gains Tax;
• only allowing losses from an investment to be offset against income from the same investment;
• abolishing the 30% Private Health Insurance Rebate in order to increase funding for public hospitals;
• taxing family trusts in the same way as companies;
• eliminating high rates of effective marginal taxation for those on welfare benefits; and
• introduce a new top marginal tax rate of 50 per cent on incomes of $1 million or over.
- introduce an estate tax with full provisions to protect the family farm, the family home and small business with a threshold of $5 million as indexed from the year 2010.
- conduct a full review of the superannuation system with the aim of reducing its complexity and establishing progressive rates of superannuation taxation.
- return the company tax rate to 33% and broaden the company tax base by reducing tax concessions.
- limit tax deductibility for salaries & salary-related expenses for any individual employee to $1million per year.
- allow workers to terminate substandard individual or collective agreements and be covered by a relevant award or collective agreement.
- ensure effective dispute resolution processes are available to all workers, including through conciliation and arbitration.
- require employers to enter into collective agreements with their workforce unless a majority are demonstrably opposed to collective bargaining, with the Industrial Relations Commission to have the power to arbitrate if no agreement can be reached.
- require employers to inform new and existing employees that they are entitled to join a union, and enable the provision of information about the unions responsible for the sector and industry.
- repeal provisions against legitimate union activity (such as sections 45D and 45E in the Trade Practices Act 1974), and protect unions and workers against common law actions.
- legislatively protect the right to strike, as recognised in International Labour Organization conventions No. 87 and No. 98, as a fundamental right of workers to promote and defend their economic and social interests.
- abolish the requirement for secret ballots before industrial action.
- strengthen unions’ right of entry to recruit members, inspect for and remedy breaches of occupational health and safety provisions, breaches of the Fair Work Act and relevant awards or agreements, and other activities relating to strengthening workers’ organisations.
- protect the right of trade unionists to have their dues deducted from their wages directly.
- repeal any independent contractors legislation that strips employment rights from individuals.
- limit the use of independent contractor arrangements to individuals who are genuinely running their own business.
38. create and enforce industrial and immigration laws that stop the exploitation of foreign workers, by ensuring they receive the same pay and entitlements as a local worker doing the same job.
- establish minimum employment standards for trainees and apprentices.
- ensure that relevant training and skills development is made available to all workers, including apprentices, trainees, part-time and casual employees, without loss of pay.
- abolish the Australian Building and Construction Commission and repeal the Building and Construction Industry Improvement Act.
- abolish the Office of the Employment Advocate and the Office of Workplace Services and reinstate the functions of the Industrial Relations Commission.
- require the Commonwealth Occupational Health and Safety Authority (Comcare) to fund additional industry liaison staff, review provisions under Comcare so that workers receive fair treatment and benefits and are not disadvantaged.
- introduce national industrial manslaughter laws.
- ensure all employees, including casual, fixed term and probationary workers, and employees of small business have the same rights to challenge termination of employment where it is unfair, with reinstatement to be the remedy except in exceptional circumstances.
- repeal the current National Code of Practice for the Construction Industry.
- increase casual loadings to a minimum of 30% and introduce the ability for casual employees to convert to permanent part time work after 3 months of continuous employment, where employment is on a continuous ongoing basis.
- provide a national paid parental leave scheme.
- establish a National Pay Equity Standard to help correct the gender pay gap.
- provide industrial tribunals with full powers to make orders to give effect to gender pay equity, on a workforce, industry or workplace basis.
- establish industry trust funds for protection of workers’ entitlements.
- require the ABS to publish more meaningful monthly measures of underemployment and unemployment, with broader definitions of unemployment.
- amend the Trade Practices Act to introduce a National Unfair Contracts regime.
- use a combination of government job creation and industry policy to achieve full employment and job security for all who seek employment.
- legislate for a mandatory minimum of five weeks paid annual leave for all employees.
- limit the tax deductibility of any executive salaries to 25 times the minimum full-time adult wage.
 
It was lucky Abbott never became a priest, he has the morals of a demon. All-For Gambling, Anti Carbon Tax, Anti health care, Anti anything that is right and decent, the bloke is a mad evil twisted snake. I'm gobsmacked that any Aussie would like him, that is truly how I feel. This is nothing to do with politics, I just can't stand him! In a way I wish he had become a priest as I feel physically sick every time I see his nasty fake face on TV. :mad::eek:
 
It was lucky Abbott never became a priest, he has the morals of a demon. All-For Gambling, Anti Carbon Tax, Anti health care, Anti anything that is right and decent, the bloke is a mad evil twisted snake.

Fortunately your opinion is definitely in the clear minority.

You have a very skewed and twisted view of the world, as the clear majority of the entire Australian population think his policies are worth supporting more than the opposition view on the world.


I'm gobsmacked that any Aussie would like him, that is truly how I feel.

Indeed, you're surely living under a festering rock. Your feelings are clearly misleading your logic. To be gobsmacked at his popularity and the overwhelming majority he enjoys at all levels is to deny the undisputed published facts ;

At a local level, his views / policies enjoy a thumping majority in his own electorate. A large 59% of the primary vote, and a commanding 63% of the 2PP vote.

In his NSW home territory, at a state level, his views / policies just enjoyed the largest support ever. The things you support and think are "right and decent" just got kicked by the entire State's population to the back blocks for the next 20 years. Your views of the world are about as popular as a f@rt in an elevator right now.

On a national level, his views / policies enjoy a clear majority.....even after taking the hopelessly inept Tasmania and South Australia into account, who all agree with your position / view of the world.


This is nothing to do with politics, I just can't stand him! In a way I wish he had become a priest as I feel physically sick every time I see his nasty fake face on TV. :mad::eek:

Grab a couple of great big buckets rachels, over the next couple of years you're gonna need 'em. :)
 
I suspect Dazz is right as to his inference that Abbot will get in next election-all other things being equal, so to speak.

Is it a genuine majority or a win by default because of a no show by the other team-ie Labor teaming up with Mr Muddle.

The Greens; who I previously had some sympathy and votes for are now off my christmas card list (like the Democrats after Spot-Destroyer). I turned on them a few months ago when I saw the young female one mouthing off in a fashion that showed she or her party are unable to handle their newfound power.

Labor- a once noble party who has lost their way and is now run by careerist apparatchiks

But the rallying around the Liberal cause- at Uni I never met one young lib who was not silver spooned with a "born to rule" attitude and an arrogance matched only by their avarice- the rallying is because they have no real competition to show them up as the self centred "stuff you jack I'm alright" types that they are.

Many of these people can't think beyond the next election or when their Super entitlements package will vest.

I'm sure some forumites will bleat "put up or shut up"- that is run for a position myself. Not really interested in the absence of full control of the decision making. But I do reserve the right to be critical- an old saying is "You don't have to be a chef to criticize the cooking".

There are only a handful that I feel are suitable as PM material. Rudd was one, Turnbull another.

None from the Greens.

Maybe that sheila from the Sex Party- I'll have to look into that.

Here endeth the rant.
 
There are only a handful that I feel are suitable as PM material. Rudd was one, Turnbull another.
Yes Rudd was very good although with a few weakness, one he would suck up to China like a schoolboy in his stint. i think now he has matured to be a much better leader. I liked Turnbull and he was about what he believed in and not the most popular vote stand. This is what I don't like about Abbott, he only goes with what is going to get him votes and in most cases he just goes the easy way and opposes all of the Labour and Green policies. I also agree with Rachel, he is pretty disgusting, I'm a person that can see through a person and what they are made of and their inner thoughts very easy and that man is bad. In fact if Liberals had any other leader besides him I might even listen to some of their policies but with him there it just reminds me how could a political party have this weirdo as their leader and that is when I don't go any further, I can't get past him.
 
I'm sure some forumites will bleat "put up or shut up"- that is run for a position myself. Not really interested in the absence of full control of the decision making.
:eek: :eek:

Yeah - Gaddafi had similar thoughts.

Methinks it's better cu to have a majority vote, rather than dictatorial control.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely....and all that. :)
 
I don't think Abbott is doing as good a job as he could, but I have no idea why some people seem to have such a nasty hatred of the guy. He's a politician, and a good one at that. Both major parties indulge in game playing and populist silliness.

The reason Abbott is opposing so many of the Labor and Greens policies is simply because they are largely a load of badly thought out garbage. Heaps of wastage, buggerising around the issue of refugees (which is way smaller than many would have us believe), and about facing on having a carbon tax.

I don't find any of the current crop of pollies particularly exciting, but to suggest Abbott is somehow any worse than the rest seems pretty superficial and silly to me.
 
This is what I don't like about Abbott, he only goes with what is going to get him votes and in most cases he just goes the easy way and opposes all of the Labour and Green policies. I also agree with Rachel, he is pretty disgusting, I'm a person that can see through a person and what they are made of and their inner thoughts very easy and that man is bad. In fact if Liberals had any other leader besides him I might even listen to some of their policies but with him there it just reminds me how could a political party have this weirdo as their leader and that is when I don't go any further, I can't get past him.

This is what I don't like about Gillard, she only goes with what is going to get her power and in most cases she just goes the easy way and agrees with all the Greens policies. I also agree with dazz, she is pretty disgusting, I'm a person that can see through a person and what they are made of and their inner thoughts very easy and that woman is bad. In fact if Labour had any other leader besides her I would never listen to any of their policies but with her there it just reminds me how could a political party have this weirdo as their leader and that is when I don't go any further, I can't get past her.
She makes me cringe when I see her meeting other world leaders and that stupid giggle she lets out...obviously thinking..."this is fun being PM...hee hee..."


:rolleyes:
 
This is what I don't like about Gillard, she only goes with what is going to get her power and in most cases she just goes the easy way and agrees with all the Greens policies. I also agree with dazz, she is pretty disgusting, I'm a person that can see through a person and what they are made of and their inner thoughts very easy and that woman is bad. In fact if Labour had any other leader besides her I would never listen to any of their policies but with her there it just reminds me how could a political party have this weirdo as their leader and that is when I don't go any further, I can't get past her.
She makes me cringe when I see her meeting other world leaders and that stupid giggle she lets out...obviously thinking..."this is fun being PM...hee hee..."


:rolleyes:

"Ha ha, don't be silly, Fence." Or should that be "don't be soilly, Fence". Of coooourse it's fun being PM, how could you thoink otherwoise?
 
:eek: :eek:

Yeah - Gaddafi had similar thoughts.

Methinks it's better cu to have a majority vote, rather than dictatorial control.

Absolute power corrupts absolutely....and all that. :)

I probably didn't articulate that as well as I should have- I love democracy and majority vote is the way to go- but once you vote me in for 3 years stand aside and let me get the job done.

You know I could almost imagine Hitler being a young lib if he dropped those more extreme policies with the Jews , Military expansionism:rolleyes:
 
I probably didn't articulate that as well as I should have- I love democracy and majority vote is the way to go- but once you vote me in for 3 years stand aside and let me get the job done.

You know I could almost imagine Hitler being a young lib if he dropped those more extreme policies with the Jews , Military expansionism:rolleyes:

Yep. Abbott and Hitler are twins.
 
This is what I don't like about Gillard, she only goes with what is going to get her power and in most cases she just goes the easy way and agrees with all the Greens policies.


:rolleyes:

I'm not a big Gillard fan but one thing I can say about her is that she does not always go for political interests. Things that come to mind are Carbon Tax (not popular), Pokies Reform (Not Always Popular) and quite a few others that are not as news worthy!
 
I'm not a big Gillard fan but one thing I can say about her is that she does not always go for political interests. Things that come to mind are Carbon Tax (not popular), Pokies Reform (Not Always Popular) and quite a few others that are not as news worthy!

These ARE the policies she agreed to, to get herself the votes to get into power.

Because of the 'deals' the cost to Gillard, the Labor party, the Greens and the Independents, come next election will be huge.

I'd say she's PO more than a few in her own ranks too (as you would be if you knew she was soley responsible for ending your political career prematurely).

Not JG for PM, that's for sure.

I think it would be hilarious having Hanson-Young as PM for a few days - no more though cos they don't make buckets big enough :D
 
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