can you really protect your assets being a male?

What I can tell you is that I personally advocate for traditional gender roles. Women excel at raising children and men excel at protecting and providing for their families, they've been doing it for millions of years. Then in the 70's, 3rd Wave Feminism comes along and turns everything on it's head and poisons the water supply.

Divorce rates skyrocket and we now have two generations (soon to become three) full of entitlement princesses who think they 'can have it all'. We have huge numbers of children being raised by strangers in baby day-zoos, because mummy wants to play 'career woman'. Children aren't an accessory, they are actual real, live human beings who need their mothers, especially in infancy.

So I bet I've raised the ire of more than a handful of people by now... Well, let me ask you this, if I am 'sexist' why is it, that when ForbesWoman surveyed working women, 84% of them preferred to be stay at home mums. You can't deny millions of years of biological instinct. Forbes try to spin it by pathetically attempting to make it into something that women have no choice but to work, which is of course nonsense. In fact, they put all the blame on men: Forbes notes that "more than one in three resent their partner for not earning enough to make that dream a reality." Naturally, the choices women make are all men's fault, as usual!

We need to advocate for women to do what they do best - be caring, nurturing, loving mothers to their children in the home. Let dad go out and do what needs to be done to maintain food, clothing and shelter for his wife and kids. When you put these two elements together, it becomes an indestructible force, able to raise confident, loving, well adjusted little people. Not perfect and doesn't work like that in every situation, but look at where we are today: Slutwalks, escalating single motherhood, 60% of first marriages ending in divorce, an ever increasing number of men wisely outright rejecting marriage, thanks to the plethora of horror stories out there in internet-land, female solipsism gone wild, with women putting their wants first, everyone else be damned, including their own children, etc.

Phew! I think I'll end it there Fifth, I have things I need to get done today ;).

I’m a bit of a sucker for the traditional family myself, mostly because my husband and I were both raised in single parent households and see it as having been detrimental to our upbringing. Perhaps it’s just a grass is greener thing, I’m not sure. I think in our artificially constructed society, the most ideal situation is two parents and I do think we have too flippant an approach to marriage and divorce. That said, it's not really my place to tell people what to do.

The biggest problem I have with traditional family advocates is their tendency to murk the waters with evolutionary psychology. If single mother households and career women fly in the face of millions of years of evolution, so does the traditional family.

First, we are not instinctively monogamous. It actually goes against our biological instincts. We were never intended to mate for life. That we choose do so is fine, but let’s not pretend that millions of years of evolution have lead us to do so.

Secondly, pre-agricultural societies did not abide by the ‘women care for children and men protect and provide’ mantra. The stereotype of hunter-gatherer societies – man hunting large game with brute force whilst woman picks berries with an infant attached to her teat – is fairly inaccurate. There was a lot more sexual parity in hunter-gatherer societies. Men often gathered and women often hunted. The women usually hunted small game and the men large game. In some societies women hunted large game and this was sometimes done in a group of men and women hunting as a pack. It was only with the advent of agriculture that ‘traditional’ gender roles were established and this was because agricultural work was more physically demanding and the women were often simply incapable.

Thirdly, our modern notion of the traditional family is a cheap, inauthentic and unnatural imitation of what we have been doing for millions of years. The 'traditional' family usually entails women staying home and caring for the children in near isolation. In pre-agricultural societies, child rearing was a joint exercise and the work shared between females. It was far more communal and bares little resemblance to modern stay at home parenting. From a man’s perspective, sitting at a computer in an air-conditioned office also bares little resemblance to his biological role as a protector and provider. I hate to sound 'white people problems', but these can be fairly soul crushing existences.

Fourthly, if we’re to abide by our biological instincts, does that apply to all aspects of life or only to the family unit? Where does that leave pacifism? Archaeologists estimate that approximately 25-30% of all hunter-gatherer deaths can be attributed to homicide. Should men go to war with their neighbouring suburb to feed their biological thirst for blood? Should pacifists be deemed unnatural abominations?

I could go on but I've already typed too much.

So, advocate for traditional families if you must, just don’t drag ‘millions of years’ into it.

I also think that if we’re going to advocate for a traditional family dynamic then we should probably treat women taking on traditional roles with a little more respect. In every single one of these threads the stay at home mothers have been painted as lazy freeloaders who make the choice to have children, to stay home and do all ‘fun’ stuff while they force their ‘yes, ma’am’ husbands to do the donkey work.

Sorry about the long posts.
 
Mark- if women are the best at rearing children, they should be the ones to get custody. You can't have it both ways.

You want women to be kept at home to spend much of their time looking after the children while the man goes out to work. But if they split, you want that same man to have an equal right to have custody of those same children. That's inconsistent.

Brilliant post.
 
IVF is a fix to a medical problem. You want the traditional family, yet don't want advances in medicine to help people conceive. Strange logic.

once again you dont make any sense, as per usual
whats wanting a traditional family have anything to do with helping people conceive? if its not meant to be , its not meant to be
 
Mark- if women are the best at rearing children, they should be the ones to get custody. You can't have it both ways.

So if a mother is physically/emotionally/sexually abusive, she should get custody? You know very well that I was talking in context of marriage. When the parents divorce, as I have stated several times, the children have the right to equal access to both parents. In some situations, the mother is the better parent to have primary custody, in others, it's the father.

But this is just common sense. You're an intelligent man Geoff, frankly I expect better than that.

You want women to be kept at home to spend much of their time looking after the children while the man goes out to work. But if they split, you want that same man to have an equal right to have custody of those same children. That's inconsistent.

Explain to me how that is inconsistent? Marriage and divorce are two separate issues. Why should a man, who has been divorced by his wife, not have equal access to his children?
 
once again you dont make any sense, as per usual
whats wanting a traditional family have anything to do with helping people conceive? if its not meant to be , its not meant to be

I'd you can't conceive, that means you can't have kids. If you can't have kids, you don't have a traditional family. I'm sorry, I forgot I have to dumb everything down to a 5 year old level when talking to you.

If you heart failed, would you get a transplant, or is that 'meant to be' as well?
 
So if a mother is physically/emotionally/sexually abusive, she should get custody? You know very well that I was talking in context of marriage. When the parents divorce, as I have stated several times, the children have the right to equal access to both parents. In some situations, the mother is the better parent to have primary custody, in others, it's the father.

But that's not what you said. The woman is the carer, by genetic predisposition. Now, your muddying your own waters.

But this is just common sense. You're an intelligent man Geoff, frankly I expect better than that.

Ash, the traditional response of an Internet poster, when he realises another has made him look like a goose. Go on the attack! Well played, sir.
 
Fifth;1004733I also think that if we’re going to advocate for a traditional family dynamic then we should probably treat women taking on traditional roles with a little more respect. In every single one of these threads the stay at home mothers have been painted as lazy freeloaders who make the choice to have children said:
Hello Fifth,

I must say that I think that was an excellent post. You write extremely well. My posts in this thread no doubt sound that I am labeling the stay at home mother as a freeloader.

That is not my intention, my beliefs are that child raising is obviously a valuable role and if two 25yo's get together and build a family and some wealth and the female has been at home for a period and career is a bit behind then asset split sould be 50/50 or maybe even a bit more in favour of her.

My issue is when the couple get together later and the male has significantly more assets, the wife never earns any income and stays with the kids. A 50/50 split of assets accumulated since they were together is a pretty fair split imo. However I often see 50/50 and even 75/25 of all assets in favour of the woman. I can't see how that is fair. Sure split was has been made while "working together' but what he bought in beforehand surely should be his.

While it is not freeloading the mothers around where I live have it far better than those I witnessed growing up. My mum for example raised the kids 90% of time, worked full time, did all the household duties . What I see nowdays is most don't have paid employment, have domestic help for every conceivable chore and live a pretty sweet life. Good luck to them for achieving that lifestyle but to then expect 75% of net assets on departure is a bit rich imo.

BT
 
So if a mother is physically/emotionally/sexually abusive, she should get custody? You know very well that I was talking in context of marriage. When the parents divorce, as I have stated several times, the children have the right to equal access to both parents. In some situations, the mother is the better parent to have primary custody, in others, it's the father.

But this is just common sense. You're an intelligent man Geoff, frankly I expect better than that.



Explain to me how that is inconsistent? Marriage and divorce are two separate issues. Why should a man, who has been divorced by his wife, not have equal access to his children?
Equal access has not been mentioned per se before. You've been saying that men are hard done by, and that they should have more consideration in a divorce, while at the same time saying that it's the woman's natural role to stay at home and care for the kids. Access is just one part of a separation. The original post in this thread was about protecting assets.

im not trying to start a gender war here, the above is teh facts, ive been burnt once before, I have 10x more to lose this time, so I will protect myself

what are other reasonable ways that I can protect myself and my kids future

And yet a gender war is now raging.

And condescension is not a way to help your viewpoint.
 
You said it was a great post, yet Mr Fab would have a fundamental disagreement with your brothers being the primary carer for his kids.

Sorry, just noticed your post.

One brother ended up with a 2 yr old, after the wife left the marriage. She agreed for the child to remain with him.

The other brother was the one who wanted a child, as his wife didn't care one way or another. He was more hands on, even though they raised the child together. She worked full time outside the home. My brother started his own business, and had flexible hours. While the child was a toddler, his maternal grandmother babysat him.

I didn't see anywhere where Mr Fab had a problem with the fathers taking over primary childcare roles.

However he did address your concern in post #245.
 
Sorry, just noticed your post.

No worries, your brothers sound like good guys. They both sound like a prime example contradicting Fab's point, that the woman is the best one to raise the kids. (While married. If course this changes, according to Fab, as soon as the couple separates.)

Each couple can work out what's best for them. As your bro's have done. Good luck to them.
 
To the OP

I would have thought it was abundantly clear by now from the first page of this thread that you can't protect your assets - as a male or as a female. The Family Court can choose to look through whatever structures you may care to setup, if they feel they have a valid reason. And their ways are mysterious, often arbitrary and at the very least unpredictable - for both men and women.

If you wish to protect your assets you can, however:
1 - Start a relationship with someone significantly more wealthy than you, to improve the odds of a more favourable settlement in the event of a split; or
2 - Not get into a relationship at all.

You need to decide which is more important - the loving companionship of a long term partner as you travel through life together - or your assets.

Which is more important to you? Which will make you happy?

For me, there are things in life that are worth more than money and this is one of them. Consider a different hypothetical situation - say you had a child and they contracted a fatal illness that could only be cured by an amount that would involve selling everything you owned and hocking yourself up to the eyeballs. Would you do it?

That is the type of risk we take when we have children - there are circumstances beyond our control where their issues can dominate our lives to the point where we are only effectively living for them. Much the same for long term relationships - they have the potential to break us financially and emotionally and also be the most fulfilling and happy experience of our lives.

There is far more to life than your assets... indeed assets are some of the least important things!
 
Equal access has not been mentioned per se before.

Although it is not the best of situations, the child has a right of access to BOTH parents,

Geoff, in all seriousness, how do you reconcile my saying that in a marriage, the mother should be the primary caregiver, since mothers are naturally the better parent in cohabitation to me saying that mothers should automatically get custody in divorce?

You know they are two different issues, you can't compare the two.
 
Geoff, in all seriousness, how do you reconcile my saying that in a marriage, the mother should be the primary caregiver, since mothers are naturally the better parent in cohabitation to me saying that mothers should automatically get custody in divorce?

You know they are two different issues, you can't compare the two.
I did not say that mothers should automatically get custody. You are managing to twist everything I say.

"In all seriousness" I don't like the condescending tone which implies that you are right and I am stupid.

I'm out.
 
Indeed. Same here.

I get a feeling it won't be revealed however. Just another one of those fabulous fantasies about how bad women are :rolleyes:
If the hat fits....

I can see the meeting with the lawyer and the soon-to-be ex-wife;

Lawyer; "Righto; we'll go the husband for 100%"'

S.T.B.E.W; "O.K".

So, they do just that.

Now; there wasn't any moment during their conversation where there was a gun held to her head and made her agree to go for the 100%.

She could just as easily have said; "No; I want to split it down the middle".
 
My posts in this thread no doubt sound that I am labeling the stay at home mother as a freeloader.

That is not my intention, my beliefs are that child raising is obviously a valuable role and if two 25yo's get together and build a family and some wealth and the female has been at home for a period and career is a bit behind then asset split sould be 50/50 or maybe even a bit more in favour of her.

My issue is when the couple get together later and the male has significantly more assets, the wife never earns any income and stays with the kids. A 50/50 split of assets accumulated since they were together is a pretty fair split imo. However I often see 50/50 and even 75/25 of all assets in favour of the woman. I can't see how that is fair. Sure split was has been made while "working together' but what he bought in beforehand surely should be his.

While it is not freeloading the mothers around where I live have it far better than those I witnessed growing up. My mum for example raised the kids 90% of time, worked full time, did all the household duties . What I see nowdays is most don't have paid employment, have domestic help for every conceivable chore and live a pretty sweet life. Good luck to them for achieving that lifestyle but to then expect 75% of net assets on departure is a bit rich imo.

BT

I agree with you. I believe that assets accumulated during marriage should be evenly split but assets accumulated before marriage should generally go to the original 'owner'. I don't think a person with zero dollars should be able to marry a millionaire, divorce them a year later and become an instant millionaire. At the same time, after years of marriage and several children, I find it sad when divorcing couples are bickering over who brought what to the marriage to the point of triviality. Some couples go a bit berserk with this, even expecting judges to divide the household furniture.

This is debatable, but I believe that it's most ideal for a couple to get married when they're young so that they can build a life together without the complications of who brought what to the relationship. If a married couple are happy together, they've already fulfilled their 'contribution' obligation so far as I'm concerned. Realistically, life isn't always ideal and there will always be late marriages, divorces and second marriages. Divorce is a truly messy business and an amicable divorce requiring no legal intervention is infinitely more desirable than expecting a judge to decide your fate. Alas, life doesn't work like that.

So far as wealthier stay at home mums go, I think it's just a different world to the average. Most women do their own housework and chores. It's obviously easier than it once was with all the household gadgetry, cleaning products and easy meals available now, but I don't think it's all lazing by the pool and hair appointments, especially when the children are young.

Anyway, I understand where you're coming from and I don't think you're labeling staying at home mums as freeloaders.
 
Last edited:
To the OP

I would have thought it was abundantly clear by now from the first page of this thread that you can't protect your assets - as a male or as a female. The Family Court can choose to look through whatever structures you may care to setup, if they feel they have a valid reason. And their ways are mysterious, often arbitrary and at the very least unpredictable - for both men and women.

If you wish to protect your assets you can, however:
1 - Start a relationship with someone significantly more wealthy than you, to improve the odds of a more favourable settlement in the event of a split; or
2 - Not get into a relationship at all.

!


Best post on this thread yet.


See ya's.
 
To the OP

I would have thought it was abundantly clear by now from the first page of this thread that you can't protect your assets - as a male or as a female. The Family Court can choose to look through whatever structures you may care to setup, if they feel they have a valid reason. And their ways are mysterious, often arbitrary and at the very least unpredictable - for both men and women.

If you wish to protect your assets you can, however:
1 - Start a relationship with someone significantly more wealthy than you, to improve the odds of a more favourable settlement in the event of a split; or
2 - Not get into a relationship at all.

You need to decide which is more important - the loving companionship of a long term partner as you travel through life together - or your assets.

Which is more important to you? Which will make you happy?

For me, there are things in life that are worth more than money and this is one of them. Consider a different hypothetical situation - say you had a child and they contracted a fatal illness that could only be cured by an amount that would involve selling everything you owned and hocking yourself up to the eyeballs. Would you do it?

That is the type of risk we take when we have children - there are circumstances beyond our control where their issues can dominate our lives to the point where we are only effectively living for them. Much the same for long term relationships - they have the potential to break us financially and emotionally and also be the most fulfilling and happy experience of our lives.

There is far more to life than your assets... indeed assets are some of the least important things!

completely agree with you, although it hasnt been all solid legal advice since we dont have any family court lawyers on here, but the general gist of things has been the same,

either dont get into a relationship, or get with someone the same or wealthier or just spend it all before you get close to one,

and yes there are more important things in life however,assets not only represent money but they also CAN represent a future, secuirty, personal satisfaction, acheievements,and hard work for the most part


If the hat fits....

I can see the meeting with the lawyer and the soon-to-be ex-wife;

Lawyer; "Righto; we'll go the husband for 100%"'

S.T.B.E.W; "O.K".

So, they do just that.

Now; there wasn't any moment during their conversation where there was a gun held to her head and made her agree to go for the 100%.

She could just as easily have said; "No; I want to split it down the middle".
thats obviously an exagerrration but I completely see your point,

its amazing how so many of them start out with reasonable intentions, eg split it 50/50, but once some overzealous lawyer, or man hating best friend or some feminist they all of a sudden forget a lifetime of morality and self respect all for a few $$$$
 
Back
Top