Goods & Services that Have Risen in Price Due to The Carbon Tax

Token Funder said:
Indeed. Simply posting overly simplistic numbers that appear to tell an obvious story but in fact reflect a more complex set of circumstances is intellectually lazy and generally the hallmark of someone simply pushing an agenda.
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Nice try - but no cigar.

If you are trying to equate what I said about WA electricity prices over 4 years with the enormous bellwether national economic scorecard over a 20 year period, that starkly differentiates the economic management credentials of each political party.....you are sadly mistaken.

The surplus posted by the Federal Treasurer every year takes into account every single line item of every single event right across the country. It isn't some fairy figure plucked out of the air.....certainly not over 20 years.

No need for hallmarks or hidden agendas with me.

I thoroughly and 100% support the Liberal Party ideals and principles on which it was founded. I'm upfront about it.

How anyone with their head screwed can support the gaggle of banner waving union thugs to manage anything, with bigger thugs behind the scene controlling the show is beyond me. I guess you like that sort of thing though.
 
Council Rates - City Of Stonnington

I just received my first 2012/3 Rates & Valuation Notice.

Admittedly this is just one of my IPs, and is the City of Stonnington (Melbourne - for those unfamiliar we are talking about Prahran, South Yarra, Armadale, Glen Iris etc). The actual general residential charge factor remains largely unchanged for the past four years.


The only other potential related carbon tax impact is the garbage charge 120 litre. This has increased 6%. In the flyer that comes with the rates notice, the commentary says as follows....

partly due to the introduction of the Federal Government's carbon pricing, increases in the State Government's EPA landfill levy and other increases to waste disposal costs.
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However, this has increased in the past 2 years by 10.3% & 6% respectively, so this years 6% increase seems in line with previous increases. This charge makes up about 20% of the total rates & valuation notice.
 
DavidMc said:
Energy has never been cheaper to produce, yet we pay the highest prices ever for it.

The majority of this cost comes from the deregulation of the industry, smart meter roll out and the like...

Were all those who are complaining about Carbon Tax in this thread saying anything about Smart Meters?

Were was the 29 page whinge thread on those?
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Aaron_C said:
The thing is, the Carbon Tax is a price hike. Combined with the dodgy practices of the electricity industry with the forced installation of these 'Smart' Meters means we will all be paying more for something that has the capacity to charge us more for using power during certain times of the day. I have even heard that the Smart Meters give the electrical companies the power to shut down your power remotely if the grid is overloaded. Can you believe it?
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Agreed. My point is though the level of discussion / complaint is well out of proportion.

To me it implies the average poster doesn't fully understand the truth behind the recent electricity price increase issue (which is peoples main problem with the CT - as all the other increases flow from there (pun intended)), not doing their DD on them and posts are (dare I say) driven more by the emotional button pushing of the various interest groups rather than the reality.

Just food for thought.
 
DavidMc said:
Agreed. My point is though the level of discussion / complaint is well out of proportion.

To me it implies the average poster doesn't fully understand the truth behind the recent electricity price increase issue (which is peoples main problem with the CT - as all the other increases flow from there (pun intended)), not doing their DD on them and posts are (dare I say) driven more by the emotional button pushing of the various interest groups rather than the reality.

Just food for thought.
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I think the majority understood that if they voted Labor, there would be no Carbon Tax and wouldn't have to pay $23 to discharge a tonne of Carbon Dioxide, that BTW is only worth around $7 a tonne in the real market to discharge Carbon Dioxide but because Julia needed to give into the Greens who think that although $7 to discharge a tonne of Carbon is the market rate, but this price is not high enough to create enough pain to the Australian people or Australian business, so instead of there electricity bills going up by X, they now go up by X + Carbon Tax.
 
To me it implies the average poster doesn't fully understand the truth behind the recent electricity price increase issue (which is peoples main problem with the CT -

Maybe yours, not mine. I am concerned about the strangling of industry. Without that all we have is a lot of holes in the ground.
 
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Light hearted Carbon Tax humour because it's Friday
 

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how anyone with a decent IQ can sit there and say that Julia Gillard didn't give the strong and distinct impression that a vote for Labor meant there would be no action on anything to do with an emissions trading scheme, carbon, price, carbon tax - whatever - is beyond me, too.
 
Aaron Sice said:
how anyone with a decent IQ can sit there and say that Julia Gillard didn't give the strong and distinct impression that a vote for Labor meant there would be no action on anything to do with an emissions trading scheme, carbon, price, carbon tax - whatever - is beyond me, too.
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Realistically it would seem that the Liberal and Country party supporters are the most vociferous about it with their Ditch the Witch type of sloganeering campaigns.
The Green voters wouldn't be against Carbon Pricing.
Swinging voters probably go both ways.
Some Labor voters may object but some would support Carbon pricing so maybe it's not such a big issue with them.
Personally I think it would be amusing if someone started a Dump the Turd campaign aimed at Abbott. I can picture the placards now carried by a crowd of Turnbull supporters. ;)
 
There is no direct proof of that, its largely a myth. Beside a cut and edited youtube clip. Tony Abbott has turned it into a massive lie and its isnt. But bogans believe it.

You guys sound like kids in a school yard "mumm.....she lied..... she lied"

You want to see lies, Check this out.

http://www.awu.net.au/109589607626152_5.html?H|19|109589607626152|1650569191203

Also, here is an interesting piece. All he does is lie. He has nothing else.

"Over-investment in electricity infrastructure, and a failure in the regulation of power prices which was financing it, was a "fabrication", Opposition Leader Tony Abbott told us yesterday.

"Why should we believe the Prime Minister now about so-called gold-plating of power infrastructure when she's never talked about it for the last five years?" he told the ABC's AM program.

Well Tony, on this occasion, you should probably believe the Prime Minister because she is saying the same thing as your own resources spokesman; because conservative state premiers have also been raising the problem; and because the problem is set out in great detail in the reports of energy regulators.'

http://www.elp.com/index/from-the-wires/wire_news_display/1721413529.html

Aaron Sice said:
how anyone with a decent IQ can sit there and say that Julia Gillard didn't give the strong and distinct impression that a vote for Labor meant there would be no action on anything to do with an emissions trading scheme, carbon, price, carbon tax - whatever - is beyond me, too.
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evand said:
There is no direct proof of that, its largely a myth. Beside a cut and edited youtube clip. Tony Abbott has turned it into a massive lie and its isnt. But bogans believe it.
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can everyone just youtube "family guy no donkey"

i mean really evan.....really?
 
SO WHY have electricity bills gone up by 80%
over the last 2 years with NO CARBON tax
in force??
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Well for a long time the states ran the system, and like all governments took more dividends OUT than could be afforded.

Do that for decades and your infrastructure becomes decrepit. Being aware that they couldn't keep milking it, they sold it and spent the cash. Now they have a convenient whipping boy.... the big bad generators who assumed their responsibilities.

Julia seems to be suggesting that we have a gold plated reticulation system - look around and note the number of poles in your neighbourhood that look ready to fall down and see if you agree. Recently a pole transformer near me just fell to the ground because the crossbeams it was mounted on rotted.

Distributors have a charter they must meet on reliability and it sounds low - 95%. How would you like to lose power an hour every week? Of course power is a trade off: Your provider can fix things when they break or they can undertake preventative maintenance so YOU don't suffer the inconvenience. Personally, I would prefer the higher price that goes with higher reliability.
 
ps The generators have had to pay the mandated feed-in tariffs that the governments have set for a number of years now. They are a direct cost!
 
Sunfish said:
ps The generators have had to pay the mandated feed-in tariffs that the governments have set for a number of years now. They are a direct cost!
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Just to clarify retailers pay tariffs to generators not the other way around... the only people generators pay are their suppliers, coal and gas companies and the ATO.

BTW the transmission companies on the east coast are generally gold plating their networks. It's the obvious result of a system that gives them a regulated return on their investments well above their cost of capital (equity and debt). The only way to grow profit is to grow the size of their investment so they make all sorts of arguments to the regulator why they absolutely need that new transformer / new line. Add this on to previous decades of under investment courtesy of state govts ripping cash out of THE utilities they own and there has been a lot of catching up to do with network tariffs.

Distribution network companies are only just catching on to the same strategy. Their infrastructure still has some way to go to make the grade - particularly the state owned ones. The private distribution companies have been gold plating for years now for the same reasons as the transmission companies. There is no temptation for them to need the cash for something else - they just want to maximise their investment.

Retailers are only a small part of the value chain. Smart meters are needed to send the right price signals to consumers as to the real value of power at different times of the day. Without them there will continue to be massively inefficient costs in installing generation to service peaks that last mere hours per year.
 
Sunfish said:
Well for a long time the states ran the system, and like all governments took more dividends OUT than could be afforded.

Do that for decades and your infrastructure becomes decrepit. Being aware that they couldn't keep milking it, they sold it and spent the cash. Now they have a convenient whipping boy.... the big bad generators who assumed their responsibilities.

Julia seems to be suggesting that we have a gold plated reticulation system - look around and note the number of poles in your neighbourhood that look ready to fall down and see if you agree. Recently a pole transformer near me just fell to the ground because the crossbeams it was mounted on rotted.

Distributors have a charter they must meet on reliability and it sounds low - 95%. How would you like to lose power an hour every week? Of course power is a trade off: Your provider can fix things when they break or they can undertake preventative maintenance so YOU don't suffer the inconvenience. Personally, I would prefer the higher price that goes with higher reliability.
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read earlier this week in the papers that Macfarlane Generators were
withholding power at certain times just to push the power cost up
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-06-12/peak-capacity-tom-koutsantonis/4065732
A national report says companies in South Australia and Tasmania tend to cause higher prices by withholding capacity more often than in other states.


also the power companies and water companies work on volume to make money so we install solar power their profits go down
so to maintain their profit they raise the rates for the rest to pay
 
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Sunfish said:
Well for a long time the states ran the system, and like all governments took more dividends OUT than could be afforded.

.
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I think of memory (correct me if I am wrong)Jeff Kennett sold off the power
So it is a LONG TIME since the state govt has
ran the system
 
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