Housing Shortage essay

Olympic dam is different. There aren't many 100 year plus mines. Nor oil wells.

As I said, mines should have a low PE. Every year the resource is removed, the lower the value of the mine.

Real estate, farms, they should have high PE's. They will still be there in 1000 years time and the worth is increasing as time goes on.

See ya's.
 
Exactly. Stop feeding the trolls people, PLEASE.
And stop bumping this thread too please!

Hang on, did I just... Doh!! ;)

Cheers,
Michael

PS, Come on YM, don't make me put you on my ignore list too. I tend to like your balanced aanalysis even though coming from a biased start point.

PPS RPI, I was one of those Dungeons and Dragons geeks at school. We didn't all end up in delusional alternate realities!! :D
 
Hi Michael and I used to be one of the jocks doing the flushing (not literally by the way) but thankfully most of us grow up and realize how wrong we were, unfortunately some people seem to stay in their own little words
 
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Most people find it uncomfortable to have their existing beliefs challenged. Especially when it seems they are challenged with indisputable facts and figures.

This forum is very much a mutual positive feedback mechanism. A very dangerous way to invest as it can reinforce the wrong investing mindset. Successful investors accept the negative with the positive as a necessary part of risk management. It can't all be positive news and house prices cant go up forever. Believing that is more dangerous to ones wealth plans then not investing at all imho.

There is absolutely no doubt there is an oversupply of resi property for sale in this country. Add that to record unaffordability, the highest interest rates in a decade, the highest property prices for generations relative to wages, tightening monetary practices, a dodgy stock market...etc etc

The only shining light i can see is a shortage of rental properties with associated increasing rents.

Its an integral part of investing to heed approaching storm clouds. Ignore them at your peril.
 
???

Hired Goon, Yieldmatters (shogun) and Dad of Sam all posting here. why don't we just move the whole forum over to the Global House Price Crash Forum.

To all the SS'ers. DO you remember those guys at school/slash work uni who lived so much in their own reality that they didn't even know it. 10 years ago living in the world of dungeons and dragons (or warcraft or whatever) now living in GHPC.

These guys are trolling, you could smack them fair between the eyes with reality and they would still believe reality. If the market drops 10% they will be vindicated, If the market drops 40% they will be vindicated and if the market stays flat and then heads up again in 5 years they will all be going on about the ponzi scheme and how stupid we are and they will still be vindicated (in their reality) I suggest we stop responding to them

Hi RPI,

what did I do? Just because I post on GHPC it means I can't post here too? Please feel free to let me know which part of my post avoided reality.

And while you're at it, feel free to explain why your post doesn't reveal your need to dismiss opinions that don't fit with your own view of reality. I understand this forum is mostly for PI support, which is why I'm an infrequent poster, and only do so if I think it is "helpful", but noone's forcing you to read this thread.

Cheers,

DoS
 
The boy tries so VERY hard to look for supporters.
Alex

I think his argument is quite logical. I'm suprised at the level of negativity here towards HG. I thought he made a valid point.

I'm assuming judgements here are possibly clouded due to the success investors have had in the past?
 
I think his argument is quite logical. I'm suprised at the level of negativity here towards HG. I thought he made a valid point.

Precisely. Markets are made up of people, and people aren't logical. Especially when it comes to their 'home'.

I'm assuming judgements here are possibly clouded due to the success investors have had in the past?

No doubt. Ultimately, we view HG and co as people who have a lot of logical ideas and statistics, while we have been successful by basing ourselves on 'reality'. The two are often different.
Alex
 
The only shining light i can see is a shortage of rental properties with associated increasing rents.
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Dear Evand,

1. So are you then saying that objectively speaking, the housing demand created by the continued high international immigration into Australia as well as the recent change in the Australian household structure and the continuing resource boom, are not existing positive housing market fundamentals in Australia?

2. This is despite the present on-going financial turmoil and its related negative market sentiments and D+G atmosphere prevailing in Australia today.

3. The RBA has reportedly said in April 2008, when its has decided to keep its interest rateand the official cash rate steady in April 2008, that its last interest rate increase in March 2008, is about the "right" for the present market conditions, for the time being.

4. In doing this, the RBA is also signalling that its interest rate is "peaking"/has already peaked accordingly despite the continued higher/additional rate hikes by the commercial banks recently as well as the higher inflation figures reported.

5. This will be further confirmed/disconfirmed by the RBA's interest rate policy decision-making outcome to be made during this coming May 2008 Board's Meeting.

6. All things being equal, the fact that Australians have been paying higher interest rate and much higher borrowing costs for their housing loans during all these while, as compared to their counterparts in the US and UK, would suggest to me that the various housing markets in Australia, are much more realistically supported by its underlying housing fundaementals than those in the US and UK housing markets.

7. Consequently, what has happened in the US and UK housing markets may or may not neccessarily happen in Australia subsequently, all things being equal.

8. Thus for me, the real challenge facing the various housing markets in Australia today is whether the same RBA, under Glenn Steven's new leadership, is able to continue to safely steer the Australian Economy out of the present continued financial turmoil midst its own domestic high inflation rate and dual-speed economy ground environment.

9. Financial storms can come and pass as they have previously done so, in the past.

10. What is truly important and remains a good track record in Australia, is the RBA's ability to steer the Australian Economy safely out of these financial storms in the past, so as to allow Australia and the Australian people to enjoy their prolonged economic prosperity continually over the last 17 years.

11. For your further comments and discussion, please.

12. Thank you.

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH
 
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The thing is, Australians are supporting more debt and higher house prices to wages even with higher interest rates than the Americans.

Sub prime and ARMs blew up in the USA, which caused their ponzi scheme to explode which actually stopped their boom before it reached our levels, and actually worked as a release valve.

Australia, having no such early release valve, pushed onward ever higher. It is still fundamentally unsustainable and will correct. In a lot of ways, we would have been better off topping early, as we'd have less far to fall.[/QUOTE
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Dear HG,

1. By your own post, it seems to me that apparently you have failed to appreciate the present sound and good basic financial, fiscal or/and monetary regulatory environment in Australia, vis-a-vis those in the US, in the first place.

2. The fact that ARMS /NINJA loans exist in US and has becoming its most prevaient lending practices in the US, in the first place but that such lending practices have still not occured in Australia, will properly testify to these basic differences that are presently prevailing in Australia and in US.

3. Therefore and furthermore, it is also not entirely "accurate" to say that there is no early release safety value in the Australian system at this point in time.

4. The RBA does actually monitor, analyse and conduct detailed studies into the existing "housing stress", levels of loan arrears occuring, and loan default rate etc in Australia, as part of their ongoing real time work in managing the Australian Economy, on a day-to-day basis.

5. Consequently, by RBA's own data, the present loan default rate in Australia, has presently amounted to only 0.3% of all loans reported in the Australian banks' balance sheet as compared to the 4% default rate reportedly against all prime loans made in the US when the global Credit Crunch Crises first broke out in the US in July 2007.

6. Consequently, the RBA further believes that the number of households earning less than A$60,000 per year, in Australia who are truly suffering from the real "housing stress" in Australia , at this point in time, amounts to some 40,000 households.

7. Consequently, the housing stress problem is still officially deemed to be "manageable" by RBA's own standard;- even though the RBA has recently alleged that the extent of the present housing stress problems in Australia, has been greatly exaggerated in the local mass media recently when 750,000-1,000,000 households were reportedly said to be some sort of housing stress.

8. Given the present impact arising from the cumulative rate increases by the RBA , the additiional and higher rate hikes by the commercial banks as well as a general tightening of the credit access in Australia recently, the various (still rising) housing markets in Australia would have already started to slow down/have already slowed down, together with the lower mortgage lending growth figures being reported recently.

9. Consequently, given more time, I would expect that various housing markets in Australia to make its own painful adjustments in due course so as to be more realistically and better supported by its underlying housing market fundamentals, ( rather than positive market sentiments), as well as to eventually slow down to its own soft landing, in the absence of a RBA's direct market intervention into the Australian housing market.

10. For your further comments and discussion, please.

11. Thank you.

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH
 
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I think his argument is quite logical. I'm suprised at the level of negativity here towards HG. I thought he made a valid point.

I'm assuming judgements here are possibly clouded due to the success investors have had in the past?
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Dear Xgjunkie,

1. Which specific "valid point" made by HG , are you actually referring to, in your own post,please?

2. Thank you

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH
 
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8. Given the present impact arising from the cumulative rate increases by the RBA , the additiional and higher rate hikes by the commercial banks as well as a general tightening of the credit access in Australia recently, the various (still rising) housing markets in Australia would have already started to slow down/have already slowed down, together with the lower mortgage lending growth figures being reported recently.

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH

888888888888888888888888888888888

"Rates drive fall in house prices"

"HOUSE prices have fallen in half of Australia's capital cities, offering the first widespread evidence that interest rates are taking their toll on values."

"Signs of the slowdown have escalated this year with lending for housing falling and new home building weak."

http://www.news.com.au/business/money/story/0,25479,23619914-5016113,00.html


"NEW home sales fell for the second straight month in March as high interest rates and the costs of construction hit hard, a survey shows."

http://www.news.com.au/business/money/story/0,25479,23622281-5016110,00.html

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH
 
http://www.news.com.au/business/money/story/0,25479,23634094-5013951,00.html

Rudd wants one million new homes

Doesn't look like hiredgoon has convinced Rudd.
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Dear Freddie,

1. I agree with you.

2. Given their recent posts in this forum, I am wondering what HG, YM and the others D+G have to say next, regarding the present housing shortage in Australia, if the Australian Federal Govt under KR's leadership, officially starts to work on achieving a 1 million new homes requirements to meet its rising population housing needs in Australia over the next 6 years.

3. For your further comments and discussion, please.

4. Thank you.

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH
 
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Kenneth,

Yes, thats what i'm saying.


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Dear Evand,

1. So are you then saying that objectively speaking, the housing demand created by the continued high international immigration into Australia as well as the recent change in the Australian household structure and the continuing resource boom, are not existing positive housing market fundamentals in Australia?

2. This is despite the present on-going financial turmoil and its related negative market sentiments and D+G atmosphere prevailing in Australia today.

3. The RBA has reportedly said in April 2008, when its has decided to keep its interest rateand the official cash rate steady in April 2008, that its last interest rate increase in March 2008, is about the "right" for the present market conditions, for the time being.

4. In doing this, the RBA is also signalling that its interest rate is "peaking"/has already peaked accordingly despite the continued higher/additional rate hikes by the commercial banks recently as well as the higher inflation figures reported.

5. This will be further confirmed/disconfirmed by the RBA's interest rate policy decision-making outcome to be made during this coming May 2008 Board's Meeting.

6. All things being equal, the fact that Australians have been paying higher interest rate and much higher borrowing costs for their housing loans during all these while, as compared to their counterparts in the US and UK, would suggest to me that the various housing markets in Australia, are much more realistically supported by its underlying housing fundaementals than those in the US and UK housing markets.

7. Consequently, what has happened in the US and UK housing markets may or may not neccessarily happen in Australia subsequently, all things being equal.

8. Thus for me, the real challenge facing the various housing markets in Australia today is whether the same RBA, under Glenn Steven's new leadership, is able to continue to safely steer the Australian Economy out of the present continued financial turmoil midst its own domestic high inflation rate and dual-speed economy ground environment.

9. Financial storms can come and pass as they have previously done so, in the past.

10. What is truly important and remains a good track record in Australia, is the RBA's ability to steer the Australian Economy safely out of these financial storms in the past, so as to allow Australia and the Australian people to enjoy their prolonged economic prosperity continually over the last 17 years.

11. For your further comments and discussion, please.

12. Thank you.

Cheers,
Kenneth KOH
 
Kenneth,

Yes, thats what i'm saying.

************************
Dear Evand,

1. What exactly do you mean in your a/m post?

2. Do you actually agree with your own statement made in your previous post which I have referred to in my post or do you actually mean to say that you are agreeing fully with what I have posted, please?

3. Can you please further clarify and elaborate where neccessary.


4. Thank you.


Cheers,

Kenneth KOH
 
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