If a friend actively ignored me when I needed to talk to them, they wouldn't be a friend for very long!
Regardless of whether I needed to talk to them about something business or personal related.
Hi All,
Sorry, been away from SS for the last few days as am working to start an online business here at the moment. Crazy but exciting time!
Thanks for all your feedback and for sharing your experiences. I agree that this issue needs to be resolved ASAP, it's been waaaayyy too long and too expensive. I'm not mucking around and crying over a dud relationship. I'd love to move the management to another agent agent ASAP if I could find one. I already did that with the other 5 properties previously managed by the company, but had been unable to find other local PM to take on this case, hence the delay and all these DFT and tribunal stuff.
Below are the actions in progress at the moment. Would love to hear of any suggestion on what else I can do.
Beachgurl & TMNT - I agree that it's best using local agent. They understand the rental and tradies market better, and able to react quickly.
Sorry, been away from SS for the last few days as am working to start an online business here at the moment. Crazy but exciting time!
Thanks for all your feedback and for sharing your experiences. I agree that this issue needs to be resolved ASAP, it's been waaaayyy too long and too expensive. I'm not mucking around and crying over a dud relationship. I'd love to move the management to another agent agent ASAP if I could find one. I already did that with the other 5 properties previously managed by the company, but had been unable to find other local PM to take on this case, hence the delay and all these DFT and tribunal stuff.
Below are the actions in progress at the moment. Would love to hear of any suggestion on what else I can do.
- Complaint lodged with Dept of Fair Trading.
- Application lodged with Tribunal, seeking for order against PM to handover files and handover property with vacant possession. DFT advised this to make stronger case.
- Contacted and keep contacting local PMs to take over management - none found yet willing to take on the case in spite of offering more fee during eviction & reno. I keep looking. would love referral if anyone know a good PM.
- Contacted a couple of local lawyers referred by NSW Law Society. First consult is scheduled this week.
Beachgurl & TMNT - I agree that it's best using local agent. They understand the rental and tradies market better, and able to react quickly.
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Some progress
At last, some progress on the matter....
I had a very productive chat with a local lawyer who suggested that I contacted Tribunal directly and get a copy of the result coming of the 19th Dec session. Now, why haven't I think of that?
Surprisingly, requesting the result copy was a very easy process and within minutes of contacting tribunal, I received a copy of the order.
Good news was, tribunal ordered tenant to:
- vacate property immediately (as of 20th Dec)
- pay owed rent - though amount noted is significantly lower that what is currently owed, not sure if this was amount at the time of applying for order?
- warrant of enforcement possession can be obtained if tenant not vacated on date specified
I still haven't heard back from them since my email last Wednesday, requesting an update re. the tribunal and insurance claim - so I'm not sure if tenant had indeed been vacated or if any warrant was issued for eviction. The Lawyer said he'd drive by the property later today to see if tenant has indeed vacated - so I should know a bit better by later today / tomorrow.
I'm so thankful for all the help I've received so far from different sources: SS members, DFT, old REA and now this lawyer. On the other hand, I can't help feeling a bit ironic that the only party that's holding up the process is the one we actually pay to manage the place.
At last, some progress on the matter....
I had a very productive chat with a local lawyer who suggested that I contacted Tribunal directly and get a copy of the result coming of the 19th Dec session. Now, why haven't I think of that?
Surprisingly, requesting the result copy was a very easy process and within minutes of contacting tribunal, I received a copy of the order.
Good news was, tribunal ordered tenant to:
- vacate property immediately (as of 20th Dec)
- pay owed rent - though amount noted is significantly lower that what is currently owed, not sure if this was amount at the time of applying for order?
- warrant of enforcement possession can be obtained if tenant not vacated on date specified
I still haven't heard back from them since my email last Wednesday, requesting an update re. the tribunal and insurance claim - so I'm not sure if tenant had indeed been vacated or if any warrant was issued for eviction. The Lawyer said he'd drive by the property later today to see if tenant has indeed vacated - so I should know a bit better by later today / tomorrow.
I'm so thankful for all the help I've received so far from different sources: SS members, DFT, old REA and now this lawyer. On the other hand, I can't help feeling a bit ironic that the only party that's holding up the process is the one we actually pay to manage the place.
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Some tradies don't advertise anywhere because they don't need to as they often get enough business from word of mouth, or direct referral from exclusive local agents.
If these good tradies aren't advertising themselves anywhere, how would the companyfind them
If these good tradies aren't advertising themselves anywhere, how would the companyfind them
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should i be concearned
i found this interesting and worrying at the same time, i have 2 of my properties with the company but at their qld office, i feel i have had the opposite service to all this. The Pm Jasmine and Scott are very good and are proactive never had an issue, Scott doesn't spend money unless i approve and even then has pushed payments out for affordability on my part. this post makes me feel like its false hope?
i found this interesting and worrying at the same time, i have 2 of my properties with the company but at their qld office, i feel i have had the opposite service to all this. The Pm Jasmine and Scott are very good and are proactive never had an issue, Scott doesn't spend money unless i approve and even then has pushed payments out for affordability on my part. this post makes me feel like its false hope?
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If you are having good results, then let them speak for themselves. Bad performance at one agency does not mean there will be bad performance at another.
For instance, I use Raine & Horne for one Property, but there is no way on earth I would ever use the local Raine & Horne for my local holdings.
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Thankfully we had some progress on the matter in the last few days. Non-paying tenant was evicted on Tuesday and door lock was promptly changed!
We're now going trough insurance claim process and looks like it'd still be a pretty challenging from here as PM is somehow unsupportive and reluctant to provide documentations required by insurer, namely inspection reports, warning letters, photos and list of things to claim, etc. I suspect this is because they do not have many of the documentations, as haven't been managing the place properly (she actually admitted that they had not done any inspection on the place during 1.5 years managing the place). I was also been informed by the assessor (assigned by insurer) today re. PM not replaying to their voice mails re. inspector access to the place. Doh!
I had a phone call discussion with PM on Wednesday (first since May 2014). This happened after DFT told me that they had very stern discussion with PM ? make contact or else. I didn't delve on the past issues during the call and tried to focus the discussion to steps moving forward, ie. insurance claim, access, securing the place, repair quotes and the actual repair, but PM wouldn't listened. She kept hammering on the suggestion that I hire a local agent to secure the property to ensure it's not vandalized and let them hold the keys for tradies access. While I agreed that securing the place was a priority, I wasn't agree at all at palming off this issue to a local PM for the reason that it'd create confusion and prone to blame later on. I feel that the company is just trying to wash their hands on the matter. PM actually took my refusal of hiring a local PM as I wasn't interested in securing the place, and at one point made a remark that it's better for me if the place is vandalized, for insurance purposes! I wasn't sure what to take from that, but felt very concerned that this statement came from a PM.
Also as of today, I still yet to find someone who would take on the management as-is, I don't think any PM will also take on the responsibility of securing the property!
We ended the phone calls with action items for both of us to do. For me to send her insurer PDS document and for her to send me required documentations to claim insurance. I received a ledger afterwards, but still waiting on the rest of the documents.
There were some email discussion going between PM, DFT and myself afterwards. At one of the email, PM mentioned that they used to have someone local in Orange (new fact to me) and that person recently left the company, hence her suggestion for local PM. Surely, this is an internal issue that should not be shifted off to a client?
PM also said that she would arrange a discussion with myself and the company CEO (not sure if this is Nathan or his partner or someone else?). I told her I'd be happy to, but the focus needs to be on solving the issue. As of today, I still haven't heard from them on when this meeting is going to ahead.
Today I saw another email from PM requested that the complaint file be closed by end of today. I seriously don?t know what to think of that.
It's been very frustrating, but I'm glad we're chipping away on the issue. The DFT officer we deal with is quite frustrated with the matter too. She had escalated the matter, and mentioned of possibility of warning and black mark against PM.
On a brighter note, I found a local PM who still operated in the area. She expressed interest, but will only take on the management when it?s in rentable condition. She asked for an access sometimes next week, hope something good will come out of that.
Re. Lawyer, he talked about different ways we can take matter forward, incl. seeking damages, apologies, etc. I'm quite reluctant to proceed on these routes, as really I just want PM to help with required docs for claim, return me property in rentable state and part ways.
We're now going trough insurance claim process and looks like it'd still be a pretty challenging from here as PM is somehow unsupportive and reluctant to provide documentations required by insurer, namely inspection reports, warning letters, photos and list of things to claim, etc. I suspect this is because they do not have many of the documentations, as haven't been managing the place properly (she actually admitted that they had not done any inspection on the place during 1.5 years managing the place). I was also been informed by the assessor (assigned by insurer) today re. PM not replaying to their voice mails re. inspector access to the place. Doh!
I had a phone call discussion with PM on Wednesday (first since May 2014). This happened after DFT told me that they had very stern discussion with PM ? make contact or else. I didn't delve on the past issues during the call and tried to focus the discussion to steps moving forward, ie. insurance claim, access, securing the place, repair quotes and the actual repair, but PM wouldn't listened. She kept hammering on the suggestion that I hire a local agent to secure the property to ensure it's not vandalized and let them hold the keys for tradies access. While I agreed that securing the place was a priority, I wasn't agree at all at palming off this issue to a local PM for the reason that it'd create confusion and prone to blame later on. I feel that the company is just trying to wash their hands on the matter. PM actually took my refusal of hiring a local PM as I wasn't interested in securing the place, and at one point made a remark that it's better for me if the place is vandalized, for insurance purposes! I wasn't sure what to take from that, but felt very concerned that this statement came from a PM.
Also as of today, I still yet to find someone who would take on the management as-is, I don't think any PM will also take on the responsibility of securing the property!
We ended the phone calls with action items for both of us to do. For me to send her insurer PDS document and for her to send me required documentations to claim insurance. I received a ledger afterwards, but still waiting on the rest of the documents.
There were some email discussion going between PM, DFT and myself afterwards. At one of the email, PM mentioned that they used to have someone local in Orange (new fact to me) and that person recently left the company, hence her suggestion for local PM. Surely, this is an internal issue that should not be shifted off to a client?
PM also said that she would arrange a discussion with myself and the company CEO (not sure if this is Nathan or his partner or someone else?). I told her I'd be happy to, but the focus needs to be on solving the issue. As of today, I still haven't heard from them on when this meeting is going to ahead.
Today I saw another email from PM requested that the complaint file be closed by end of today. I seriously don?t know what to think of that.
It's been very frustrating, but I'm glad we're chipping away on the issue. The DFT officer we deal with is quite frustrated with the matter too. She had escalated the matter, and mentioned of possibility of warning and black mark against PM.
On a brighter note, I found a local PM who still operated in the area. She expressed interest, but will only take on the management when it?s in rentable condition. She asked for an access sometimes next week, hope something good will come out of that.
Re. Lawyer, he talked about different ways we can take matter forward, incl. seeking damages, apologies, etc. I'm quite reluctant to proceed on these routes, as really I just want PM to help with required docs for claim, return me property in rentable state and part ways.
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Hi Thatguy, I agree with Skater that bad performance on one agency does not necessarily mean bad performance on another. I'd suggest though to check on whether this Qld branch is under the same management as one in St Mary's, or if it is a franchise. I know that the Central Coast branch is under the same management and report to St Mary's, but different arrangement may apply to the Qld branch.
I had experience dealing with a good PRD agency and a bad one. They're completely different management/franchisee, so one branch is only related to the other by trade name. I will be a bit more wary if both branches are indeed under same management.
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Good news. Ask her for the name of her cleaner and handman. Get them to clean and repair the place, and then she can take on the PM.
Alternatively offer for the PM to charge a reno project fee to cover her time in organising repairs.
I am using Laing and Simmons of Blacktown for my IP in Blacktown, St Marys and Kingswood. They're on commission payroll which makes them work hard. So far have had no problems with them. rate is 5.5%
I would assume its part of same company as properties were purchased via Nathan and the company conducted pre settlement inspections for me, provided video and photos. im happy so far and i feel for you and hope it doesn't happen to me.
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Why would you want an apology? In my opinion, you're well past apologies.
If I had been treated like this, I certainly wouldn't be using a softly softly approach.
I had a similar case with an LJ Hooker Office which also declared bankruptcy.
I lodged a claim with fair trading who I believe have a compensation fund and they paid me back 100%
I've been using the St Marys office for the last couple of years too. At the start they were quite good but I noticed they went a bit off the ball around middle of last year when one of there good PM's left. After that there seemed to be a couple of young staff in their who were a bit inexperienced dealing with issues. Things seemed improve late last year when they got a more experienced PM in. For now I will be sticking with them but if the service drops off again I will be moving my properties. For a long time I noticed they always paid rent a few days late too. Instead of end of the month it was always early the following month. This seems to have stopped now though.
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DaveM - that will be an ideal scenario (fingers crossed). at the moment I'm still awaiting PM confirmation re. access to the property. unfortunately, only she holds the key at the moment. I've asked her to either provide access or courier a copy of the key over, but hadn't heard back.
RetireRich101 - thanks for the suggestion. I keep that in mind for when need a PM in the areas you mentioned.
kathryn d - no, they haven't. I actually never experienced being charged for inspection from any PM I dealt with so far - all our IPs are located in NSW though. where is your IPs located?
spludgey - I don't. it's just something that the lawyer discussed, on our option on where we could take this case.
BV - I'm sorry about your experience, but glad to hear that you got your money back at the end. hope sharing this could help Skater gets her money back too.
RetireRich101 - thanks for the suggestion. I keep that in mind for when need a PM in the areas you mentioned.
kathryn d - no, they haven't. I actually never experienced being charged for inspection from any PM I dealt with so far - all our IPs are located in NSW though. where is your IPs located?
spludgey - I don't. it's just something that the lawyer discussed, on our option on where we could take this case.
BV - I'm sorry about your experience, but glad to hear that you got your money back at the end. hope sharing this could help Skater gets her money back too.
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I'd like to share lessons learned no. 4, as this had been immensely useful for me during the course of this matter.
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