bogus invoicing

[tonyd]

This is unrelated to property but seems like the right place to discuss the following...

My neighbour was busy working one day and receives an unsolicited call on his mobile.
It is a call from a company called X [probably best to omit the company name unless one of the mods says it is ok]. The company is registered.

The woman tries to sell the company's services but the neighbour says he is too busy to talk, please send out some information and he'll read through it.

The material arrives. There was an invoice for ~$400. The offer is a 12 mth subscription for a bi-monthly magazine with taxation news updates and some other services.

They have an accountant so don't see the need for the service, so treat the info as junk mail and put it aside, not reading any further.

Some weeks later they receive another invoice for ~$400.
They phone the company who insist that they must pay the bill as they didn't respond or return the info within 14 days. It's all there in the fineprint.

The neighbour contacted Consumer Affairs in WA who says they should have read the fine print. They can't assist because it is a business to business transaction (is it?).

The company in question says they may reconsider if they receive a letter of explanation.

What are my neighbour's rights in this situation?

Has anyone had similar experiences before?

cheers, Tony

 

[sbe]

Compose a letter back to company expaining exactly the same.

State firmly that at no point was any authorisation given to subscribe to any service, only for information.

State you believed the invoice was only if you took up the offer, and that any 'presumtion by non return = acceptance' was not highlighted sufficiently for a reasonable person to notice.

Thank them for their contact but advise that you already have an accountant who taks care of your business in that matter.

State that you trust this will suficently explain the matter and that the invoice will be reversed, with written confirmation of same.

Otherwise - Consumer Affairs - Was the invoice to a business or personal? Or let them chase you for it. Diary everything (just in case).

Good luck.

Shonky business at best.

 

[tonyd]

Thanks sbe.

cheers, Tony

 

[see_change]

Not quite the same but I was almost stung about 6 years ago. Something about how pushy the person was made me double check with the organisation concerned. ( Major community service providor ).

The person said they were arranging for a first aid pamphlet to be distributed in various suburbs , and as a GP in the area was I interested in sponsoring it. I had no problems with what was suggested , however the "hard sell " which made me slightly suss.

I rang up the organisation concerned and they confirmed that the person was working for them on a contract to get advertisers for their in house magazine that was distributed to all their employee's. They were most annoyed about the spiel the telemarketer was using.

My wife has had a similar story about two years later , and given the time taken to check the bonafidies of the telemarketers I now have nothing to do with similar approaches.

I must admitt the Microwave timer method in the current TV add is very clever, but I just say up front that I don't use the services of any business that rings me while I'm busy working ( if at work ) or busy relaxing ( if I'm at home ). I have forwarning with telemarketing at home as our number is registered in my wife's maiden name , so if anyone says good evening Mr xxxx , I have my rejection forming before they have a chance to get into their spiel. Saves my time and theirs

See Change

 

[Sunfish]

They haven't a chicken leg to stand on. At law "junk mail" is exactly that.

OK! I'm oversimplifing, but I met [propobly] this company a few yrs ago who gave my daughter's name as authorization. No details, but my daughter is an "invalid" pensioner who, none the less, knows her limits. She is prob tougher on "solicitacious" phone calls than I.

On the phone, when told my daughter was under 18 [a lie] and without legal standing, they dismissed my objection with a comment that they can't be expected to check if OKing people are of legal age. Obviously they never got paid.

No point in getting older if you don't get smarter!

No court in this country would uphold this claim. Your neighbour can go back to his roses. [Just a generalization]

T

 

[Olly]

Could your neighbour say that he only asked for their information so he had more details on the company in order to make a complaint against them for making an unsolicited phone call?

This is the advice re: unsolicited phone calls put out by Privacy NSW

UNSOLICITED TELEPHONE CALLS
To have your details removed from a list used for unsolicited telephone calls, you should, when receiving the call, find out:
the name of the caller
the organisation's name
the mailing address
the phone number
who to address your letter to have your details removed.
You should also note the date and time of the call.
You should then write to the organisation ensuring that you inform them of the date, time and caller's name. Ask the organisation to:
delete your details from any list in their possession
confirm to you in writing that they have done so.
Make sure that you keep a copy of your letter.

If you don't receive a satisfactory reply within a reasonable time, write to the ADMA enclosing a copy of your letter requesting removal from the list.
If the ADMA is unable to resolve your complaint, then send a copy of both letters to Privacy NSW.

Please see the information about the ADMA National Preference Scheme if you wish to stop receiving unsolicited phone calls generally.
ADMA NATIONAL PREFERENCE SCHEME
To stop receiving all unsolicited faxes, mail or phone calls, you can contact the Australian Direct Marketing Association and ask them to put you onto their National Preference Scheme.
Your details are placed on a disk and circulated to all their members. This disk is "washed" against the member's records and any names that appear on both are "tagged" on the member's lists. Your details will not be removed but you will no longer receive unsolicited mail from that source.
If you are placed on the National Preference Scheme you remain on the scheme for one year. You need to specify which scheme (phone, fax or post), you wish to be placed on when you call.
The ADMA National Preference Scheme can be contacted on 1800 646 664.

The Executive Director
Australian Direct Marketing Association (ADMA)
PO Box 464
KINGS CROSS NSW 2011
Telephone: (02) 9368 0366


If you are still unsuccessful then contact -
Privacy NSW
PO Box A2122
SYDNEY SOUTH NSW 1235
Phone: (02) 9268 5500
Fax: (02) 9268 5501

Cheers
Olly

 

[tonyd]

Could your neighbour say that he only asked for their information so he had more details on the company in order to make a complaint against them for making an unsolicited phone call?

Too late for that.

My suggestion was that the neighbour should ask them for $400 to stop them going to ACA/TT.

There is the possibility that some miscommunication took place, so the first course of action will be a reasonable letter. The result of that will dictate the next course of action.

cheers, Tony

 

[crest133]

Recently I disputed a particular charge by a merchant on my credit card with VISA. I asked them what categories they have for cardholders to refuse to pay. There were many, but the most appropriate was "goods not as ordered". I returned the "not as ordered" goods, provided VISA with all the info, they found in my favour, and they clawed back the money from the merchant's bank account.
The point is, if you ask for information to enable you to decide if you want to order some goods, then info is all you should get. Anything else including chargeable items is unsolicited, and cannot be charged for. Adviseable to return it COD. In the he said she said scenario of an unsolicited sales approach via mobile phone, the consumer gets the benefit of the doubt.
good luck
cheers
crest133

 

[ggumpshots]

You are entitled to open your own mail.
You are not obliged to do anything ie you need noyt return the material as explained by your facts.

Basic contract law 101, is agreement cannot be inferred by silence

Dont do any thing and let them waste their money on mail and materials.
Writing a letter or phoning would be like walking to a window and throwing your hard earnt dollar out the window.

 

[superted]

I have forwarning with telemarketing at home as our number is registered in my wife's maiden name , so if anyone says good evening Mr xxxx , I have my rejection forming before they have a chance to get into their spiel. Saves my time and theirs

See Change

LoL same here soon as they ask for Mr or Mrs xxxx they get "whatever your selling im not buying".

 

[Sunfish]

Writing a letter or phoning would be like walking to a window and throwing your hard earnt dollar out the window.

Similarly, but a little off topic, I was involved in a "fender bender" with a state gov vehicle. As I was reversing at the time the driver claimed it was my fault but [there is always a "but"] she was exiting a dark private driveway, across the footpath and got between me and my parking space.

Polite, precise letters meant nothing until one day the assessor rang me. A short explanation later it was forgotten. Nobody reads anymore!

T