Live cattle trade to Indonesia
- Thread starter Graingrower
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Was talking to a stock agent today at work and he told me that 'they' have stopped exporting to these abattoirs that were listed/shown. I asked him why we as a country can't export frozen meat products killed the 'halal' way. Apparently most of the live export is younger stock that is fattened up in feedlots before slaughter. The feed in the northern states isn't productive enough for the farmers to hold onto the stock until it's fully grown, so they export it.
Nice post Dazz , just the reply I was looking for . Generally I agree with you and I suppose the first on your list is just going to be rope-a-doped for a while and then we will see what happens ...
I'm not right up with the halal either but I just think processing all that product here in Aus would be a license to loose money . Happy to be proved wrong .
I'm not right up with the halal either but I just think processing all that product here in Aus would be a license to loose money . Happy to be proved wrong .
http://www.theage.com.au/environment/animals/new-rules-on-cattle-for-indonesia-20110605-1fnhk.html
Restricting exports to 'approved' abbatoirs seems the best solution imo!
Sure they are 'only' cattle and they need to be slaughtered, but they don't need to be treated like that!
If the Indonesians are happy for 'approved' abbatoirs, then obviously the way it's happening on the videos is not 'halal' - not that i care whether it is or isn't...
If we don't sell them cattle, i bet they'd change what is acceptable to 'Halal'
Restricting exports to 'approved' abbatoirs seems the best solution imo!
Sure they are 'only' cattle and they need to be slaughtered, but they don't need to be treated like that!
If the Indonesians are happy for 'approved' abbatoirs, then obviously the way it's happening on the videos is not 'halal' - not that i care whether it is or isn't...
If we don't sell them cattle, i bet they'd change what is acceptable to 'Halal'
Rubbish. Female circumcision is banned in Australia. Anyone caught doing that vile barbaric thing would be thrown in gaol. It doesn't get much viewing here because it doesn't happen in Australia thank goodness. Female circumcision has had plenty of exposure, and the average aussie is digusted.
Just because it happens in certain places doesn't mean it's not barbaric. I'd regard lots of things that muslems do as barbaric, like stoning people, and the way women are treated and the full burka. And they probably think I'm barbaric, like how much alcohol I drink, that I eat bacon, or that I'm an athiest or that I regard women as full equals to men.
Who cares mate. I think some things are barbaric, and others don't and we all know that. That's why there is so much trouble in the world and always will be.
See ya's.
Thanks Lisa.... you took the apple and the hand with it. I must confess, that I baited you... just like the media
It definitely was not intended as a personal tirade, but rather to illustrate how easily a thought process can be drawn to a particular conclusion. I agree with everything you said except those comments at the end of your post... the emotional ones, where logic was swept aside for personal gratification. This is exactly how the media preys on the collective consciousness to evoke an emotive response, rather than rational.
But hey, that's OK, I enjoyed the discourse
Indifference, sorry to disappoint you, but your illustration has proven nothing other than that you like to play games. My logic was not swept aside for personal gratification, it was based on an analysis of your posts. As a researcher, I use Heidegger's hermeneutics to uncover hidden meanings within text - that is I go beyond what is given directly. Your emphatic comments that there were MUCH bigger issues than how a cow gets on a "dinner plate", emphasised to me that you do not care at all about the welfare of these animals.
The media did not prey on our collective consciousness, it aired real footage of what was being inflicted on numerous cattle within these abattoirs. This was actual footage, not something concocted by the media to "condition" us. Given the horrific nature of the footage, of course it is going to evoke an emotional response for those who watch it (I'd be a little concerned if it didn't). Additionally, although one can be emotive regarding a certain topic (indeed, I argue, most people are emotive about most things most of the time), one can still apply rational thinking towards finding a solution to the problem.
No one here is approving of it, but they do it to people as well. Anyone care?
Some people throw rocks at a tank which fires back with real bullets. Is that what civilised people do?
Thousands of old people and kids are homeless on Australian streets. How about anybody caring about that?
Gee, the "civilized world" around here obviously has much more pressing priorities.
As above.
Seems you have none for human beings, many of which do not have a bed.
Bravo...
At last someone else who can contextualize world events... Kudos to you!A little bit of perspective can go a long way...
I DO care about the animals, but am far more appalled at the lack of empathy for our fellow human beings which should be a higher priority. But hey, it isn't currently the main news story so must be less important today
I do not think because you care about the welfare of animals it automatically means you are oblivious to the suffering of people. If you think there are more important topics than the organised Australian government condoned barbarism to cattle then why post on this thread ? I know, why not start a thread titled 'the media's response to Australian soldiers killed in Afghanistan' . Were the boating accident of a Z list rapper in America, is a bigger story on the nine msn site than a digger getting shot in the back by his so called Afghan "mate". This not the only incident , yesterday i logged on to find another soldier had been shot, and the most prominent story was who was kicked off Masterchef the night before. Distgusting.
When the media in this country very,very occasionally report on a story that people are interested in and are shocked and distgusted by, they are doing their job. Instead of the usual diet of Idol, X Factor and who took pictures of some unknown footballer's backside.
I think the fact that the government knew about this awful situation and so did the MLA has shocked a lot of people that they could be lied to so easily.
But this trade is propped up with our hard earned tax payer dollars and how rude that we might want to know how it is spent , well obviously not on animal welfare just on lying MLA spin. Move along! Move along! Nothing to see here.
Well done Animals Australia for exposing this cruel trade and embarassing the government.
When the media in this country very,very occasionally report on a story that people are interested in and are shocked and distgusted by, they are doing their job. Instead of the usual diet of Idol, X Factor and who took pictures of some unknown footballer's backside.
I think the fact that the government knew about this awful situation and so did the MLA has shocked a lot of people that they could be lied to so easily.
But this trade is propped up with our hard earned tax payer dollars and how rude that we might want to know how it is spent , well obviously not on animal welfare just on lying MLA spin. Move along! Move along! Nothing to see here.
Well done Animals Australia for exposing this cruel trade and embarassing the government.
Bravo...
A little bit of perspective can go a long way...
I DO care about the animals, but am far more appalled at the lack of empathy for our fellow human beings which should be a higher priority. But hey, it isn't currently the main news story so must be less important today
How self important are our views ?
More important than the issues
Sorry, but quite hilarious
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Yes, 236,000 Australians urgently contacted their political representatives and voiced their grief, to astonishingly rapid effect it would appear.
May I add, not one of those people I'd warrant would seriously not rate human suffering either here or overseas as in any degree less important, but what all of them saw I believe was an outrage that could be immediately addressed by the relatively simple act of suspending exports of live animals to Indonesia.
And the result achieved was not nothing. It was an important additional step in the right direction. You'd need to be inhumane and anti-democratic to the core to not appreciate this. As the expression has it, "something is better than nothing", and this was something.
My personal thanks go out to LisaP again for putting me (and everyone to whom I forwarded those links) onto the most effective trails for expressing our outrage.
NB: Lisa, wasn't Heidegger, Heidegger a boozy begger who could think you under a table? Damned if I'd trust his brand of hermeneutic phenomenology!
May I add, not one of those people I'd warrant would seriously not rate human suffering either here or overseas as in any degree less important, but what all of them saw I believe was an outrage that could be immediately addressed by the relatively simple act of suspending exports of live animals to Indonesia.
And the result achieved was not nothing. It was an important additional step in the right direction. You'd need to be inhumane and anti-democratic to the core to not appreciate this. As the expression has it, "something is better than nothing", and this was something.
My personal thanks go out to LisaP again for putting me (and everyone to whom I forwarded those links) onto the most effective trails for expressing our outrage.
NB: Lisa, wasn't Heidegger, Heidegger a boozy begger who could think you under a table? Damned if I'd trust his brand of hermeneutic phenomenology!
Thank you to everyone who phoned or emailed their respective MP's and kept up the pressure, and did not let this shameful trade slip from the news. I am very pleased the live export of cattle is suspended for six months. Let us hope they make it permanent.
A big apology is needed from my partner who thought that all the phone calls and emails i sent would amount to nothing.
A big apology is needed from my partner who thought that all the phone calls and emails i sent would amount to nothing.
Well said Belbo!
I've copied below the thank you letter that Lyn White sent to those subscribed to Animals Australia:
Dear Lisa,
For thousands of cattle in Australia's top end, today is a day worth celebrating. After eight days of intense campaigning and public pressure following exposure of the horrendous animal cruelty, the Gillard Government has announced a suspension on the live cattle trade to Indonesia.
I cannot express in words my relief to know that, at least for now, animals will be spared from what I witnessed during Animals Australia's most recent live export investigation in Indonesia. This is a huge step towards an end to the cruelty inflicted on all animals in the live export trade — but our campaign is not over yet.
The graphic images of Australian cattle having their tails broken, tendons slashed, eyes gouged, whipped, and kicked will never be forgotten. Neither will the culpability of Meat and Livestock Australia, which was revealed to have known of the atrocities in Indonesia for more than a decade. Such was the loss in faith in Meat and Livestock Australia and the live export trade that national meat consumption was reported to have dropped by 10 — 15% in one week.
The massive public outcry following last week's Four Corners exposé eclipsed the backlash of almost any other political issue in Australian history. Over 100,000 Animals Australia and RSPCA Australia supporters wrote to the Prime Minister at BanLiveExport.com and at the same time countless politicians were adding additional pressure on the Government to act by speaking out against the brutal trade — many for the first time.
The announcement of the suspension on the live cattle trade to Indonesia is a welcome step, however, the weight of evidence from Animals Australia's eight investigations confirms that only a complete ban on live animal exports to all countries will ensure that these images are not repeated. Such a move would also send the strongest possible message to other countries that animals, and their welfare, matter. We will continue to campaign rigorously for millions more animals who are destined to be shipped to slaughter in countries where there are no laws to protect them from cruelty.
Our recently launched advertising campaign featuring television and radio ads is one powerful way that we are reminding Julia Gillard that caring Australians will accept nothing short of a total ban on all live animal exports. We are seeking urgent donations to keep this campaign on air for as long as possible.
On June 20th, historic private members bills to completely phase out the cruel live trade will be submitted to federal parliament by independents Andrew Wilkie and Nick Xenophon and another by the Australian Greens. These bills represent the animals' best chance for an end to a trade that has willingly sent millions of animals to a cruel fate for the past 30 years. Please click here to send an instant letter to your local MP and state senators to encourage them to pass this vital legislation.
Up against a powerful industry and a Government reluctant to act, this past week has shown that the power of caring individuals voicing their concern is nothing short of tremendous. We couldn't have come this far without you.
On behalf of those animals still depending on our help, thank you sincerely for your continued support.
Lyn
Lyn White
Investigator & Campaign Director
PS. Heidegger's brand of phenomenology is to both describe and interpret the world-as-experienced by the participant. Not sure if he liked his booze, but he if was still alive today, he would certainly have been able to think me under a table!
I am also pleased the live cattle trade is suspended for 6 months until they fix up this problem, I watched 4 corners on Monday night & was shocked. Now the campaign to compensate the 13,000 people directly affected by the suspension of this trade should now begin. One solution is the government should temporarily suspend the payment of the foreign aid to Indonesia & use this money to directly compensate the people affected within the cattle industry by the decision to temporarily suspend this trade.
A good step in the right direction.
Really? So in that period:
How many people contacted their local reps about kid being killed for throwing rocks at tanks?
How many people contacted local reps demanding something be done about homeless kids or elderly people?
How many people contacted their local reps about wasted billions on a BER full of bs?
Did the same people mention any of that?
Hey maybe it was even more, but does it get any mention?
Nope cause this cause keeps the plebs minds busy like the footy, (which isn't even played with feet).
And yes human suffering is much more important.
And again it has nothing to do with this forum other than giving small minds their daily dose of drama.
I was overseas during the past week, so missed most of the media coverage on this, and I havent read all the posts in this thread, so apologies if I'm repeating something already said.
I heard an interview on the radio yesterday with someone from the Indonesian embassy. I thought he responded very well to the questioning and seemed genuine in the desire to change the way that animals are treated. From his point of view, the law in Indonesia doesnt support the torture killing of animals.
http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2011/s3239720.htm
I hope people dont assume all Indonesians support killing animals in this way, or even that it is the "halal" way to kill animals. It seemed, from this interview at least, that the Indonesians are committed to ensuring that trade with Australia can continue, and understand that they will need to make changes in order for that to happen.
I heard an interview on the radio yesterday with someone from the Indonesian embassy. I thought he responded very well to the questioning and seemed genuine in the desire to change the way that animals are treated. From his point of view, the law in Indonesia doesnt support the torture killing of animals.
http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2011/s3239720.htm
I hope people dont assume all Indonesians support killing animals in this way, or even that it is the "halal" way to kill animals. It seemed, from this interview at least, that the Indonesians are committed to ensuring that trade with Australia can continue, and understand that they will need to make changes in order for that to happen.
I'm amazed the federal government can enforce an overnight ban on cattle, yet there's a huge problem with "legal" synthetic drugs, that is yet to be resolved and there are numerous types available..the most common is mentioned here
Designer Drug Problems 1
Designer Drug Problems 2
Designer Drug Problems 1
Designer Drug Problems 2
