Tenant FURIOUS over delivery noise downstairs

[cu@thetop]

No one asked but if was the tenant I would be bringing an action under Body Corp rules to prevent other (cafe) lot holder from causing a nusiance through noisy invitees (I bet its in the rules/ by-laws there somewhere).

I would expect cafe noises during normal business hours but not deliveries at 3am.

 

[sydsider]

Thanks everyone for your replies. I have some bad news. The tenant just gave two weeks notice to terminate the lease agreement as they were woken again at 3 this morning.

Both I and my PM contacted the strata manager numerous times since I wrote the first post. The strata manager 'spoke' to the cafe owner yesterday and said that's all he can do.

This is what he wrote in the email.

"I have spoken to Coffee shop owner, he is going to look into the matter. Keep in mind, the Coffee shop has been there for many years and it’s a functioning business. It will never be 100% quite, the Owners Corporation can’t affect By-Laws that would impact the running of the business. I agree, it should be quite. However, it they will make some noise."

That was before my PM told him we just received the termination notice. He said he'll speak to the cafe owner again today.

Apparently my tenant spoke to the guy who is renting at the apartment directly behind the cafe who's lived there for a month. That tenant has complained to the cafe owner directly about the noise who promised to make changes but so far nothing has changed. At least he's got a bit more patience than my tenant.

Should I urge my PM to start advertising asap while we try to fix the noise issue? The place will be vacant in two weeks.

 

[Perp]

I have some bad news. The tenant just gave two weeks notice to terminate the lease agreement as they were woken again at 3 this morning. ... Should I urge my PM to start advertising asap while we try to fix the noise issue? The place will be vacant in two weeks.

Do not accept his termination; check what notices you have to issue (if any) so that lawfully, the lease is kept in force, and the tenant can move, but they have to pay for re-leasing expenses (advertising etc), and have to pay rent until the new tenant moves in.

Has the tenant contacted Council regarding the noise? If not, then I'd be arguing at Tribunal (if it gets that far) that the tenant hasn't taken appropriate steps to try and remedy the situation. It's not really up to the landlord to fix this, and the tenant can't penalise the landlord because of a problem between themselves and a third party (the cafe owner).

Get to know the rules and don't let yourself get shafted.

 

[skater]

Get to know the rules and don't let yourself get shafted.

AND get a PM who knows the rules.

 

[sydsider]

Thank you ozperp, mary&mat and others for alerting me to take this up to the council. I called them and I was advised an officer from their health department will be assigned my case and carry out an investigation.

I have also advised the strata manager to let the cafe owner know of the actions I have taken. Hopefully this will alert him to get his act together to do more to minimize the noise.

PM also called the department of fair trading and we were advised we are NOT at fault so if the tenant wants to break lease he will be liable for the cost of re-letting and any vacancy associated. I would still like to solve the issue though, in case any future tenant complains again.

Will keep you guys updated. I'm hoping and praying the council will be able to do something as this is my last resort.

 

[ianvestor]

AND get a PM who knows the rules.

It will never be 100% quite...I agree, it should be quite.

Maybe get one who can spell, too.

I think you should see the tenants moving out as a positive experience. And as skater says, anal tenants aren't all that great anyway.

 

[Pushka]

Maybe the thing that makes your tenants anal about cleaning is the very thing that makes them anal about the noise. There is clean, and then there is anally clean. I can live with the former.

Having said that, one thing I hate about holidaying in Hastings Street Noosa (sounds off topic, I know!) is that EVERY night there is a garbage collection in the early hours of the morning.

 

[sydsider]

Maybe get one who can spell, too.

That's actually from the strata manager.

 

[Amadio]

I would still like to solve the issue though, in case any future tenant complains again.

Just be honest and say that there is noise but that they will probably get used to it if they give it a couple of weeks.

It's amazing how people can train themselves to sleep through extremely loud noises. My partner slept underneath the landing deck of an aircraft carrier for months. The sound of jets landing on a deck a couple of metres above your head all night is rather significant. They all learned to sleep right through it.

 

[Piston Broke]

I think the breach they are referring to is "quiet enjoyment" but bloody hell they live above a cafe!!

lol That's actually about not being hassled by the LL not dogs barking in the middle of the night or delivery people closing gates.

 

[RedCat]

The council may well be able to do something about this. I know in Richmond VIC where I live, rubbish trucks are not allowed to drive around at 4am. They used to until neighbour called council and complained and now they have to wait until 7am I think.

Hopefully the cafe will have to comply with similar rules

 

[Simon]

I am surprised at the lack of compassion and empathy shown by what I felt was an intelligent group of people.

Is a win/win answer not a solution here? Most posters see the tenant as the problem to be removed asap.

Maybe I am not the usual landlord.

 

[kathryn d]

Simon,
There is a bit of lack of compassion because the cafe was there first.The tenant knew there was a cafe below his unit.
It's like moving to the country, and then complaining because the farmer's manure stinks.

He also seems like a very anal individual, from what else we know about him.

 

[Ruddprime]

I am surprised at the lack of compassion and empathy shown by what I felt was an intelligent group of people.

Is a win/win answer not a solution here? Most posters see the tenant as the problem to be removed asap.

Maybe I am not the usual landlord.

Not directed at the OP

but thanks to government policy and the taxation system, we have bred an unprofessional mass of Mum & Dad, non-sophisticated, capital gains chasing land lords who run the rental show.

Is it any wonder why the monetary premium placed on property ownership over renting is so damn high?

/rant

 

[kathryn d]

Not directed at the OP

but thanks to government policy and the taxation system, we have bred an unprofessional mass of Mum & Dad, non-sophisticated, capital gains chasing land lords who run the rental show.

Is it any wonder why the monetary premium placed on property ownership over renting is so damn high?

/rant

It is certainly not us (Mum & Dad landlords) who are running the show.
Have you never had to go to Tribunal as a landlord?
The laws are always in favor of the tenant, whenever possible.

 

[jaycee]

Thank you ozperp, mary&mat and others for alerting me to take this up to the council. I called them and I was advised an officer from their health department will be assigned my case and carry out an investigation.

I have also advised the strata manager to let the cafe owner know of the actions I have taken. Hopefully this will alert him to get his act together to do more to minimize the noise.

PM also called the department of fair trading and we were advised we are NOT at fault so if the tenant wants to break lease he will be liable for the cost of re-letting and any vacancy associated. I would still like to solve the issue though, in case any future tenant complains again.

Will keep you guys updated. I'm hoping and praying the council will be able to do something as this is my last resort.

Geez the health department officer department must be busy....

I hear ya sydsider, it wolud be a pain in the proverbial that you'd rather not have to deal with.

 

[Pom]

Simon,
There is a bit of lack of compassion because the cafe was there first.The tenant knew there was a cafe below his unit.
It's like moving to the country, and then complaining because the farmer's manure stinks.

Doesn't excuse deliveries at 3am - its unneccesary and inconsiderate not to reschedule them. Council will sort out and rightly so.

I don't think it anal to be pissed off at being repeatedly woken at 3am.

That said, it isn't the landlord's responsibility. Tenant should have the foresight to ring council. Failing that you PM certainly should - they should have nipped this in the bud far earlier to avoid notice being served. Lazy or inexperienced or both.

 

[kathryn d]

The mind boggling thing is he used to live in the same building a few years ago but probably more towards the back and he wanted to live in this building again because he liked having a cafe downstairs!!! AND he wants a two bedder as suppose to a one bedder now. Only about a third of the 36 units in the building are two bedders. The only one vacant in the building right now is the three bedder penthouse asking $960 a week. Maybe he can upgrade.

As mentioned before, he's very pedantic. Emailed a 'to do list' to PM along with comments like 'filthy blinds' 'place was extremely dirty' 'obviously not been painted for many years' 'oven very dirty with grease and oil!!!' all exact quotes.

For a second I thought he moved into the wrong apartment because seriously, the place is in pretty good condition, in fact excellent condition for a rental.

The only plus with this tenant is he is indeed very neat and tiny. I went there today to carry out some repairs on the 'to do list'. The place was very clean (he might disagree) and presentable with his furnitures. I just wish he can relax a little. Oh and I saw two sets of earplugs on either side of the bed.

Pom, I was referring to the comments about the tenant here, from the landlord.
This tenant will be difficult all the way thru his tenancy. Doesn't mean you let him walk away without obligations.

We see it here all the time. The tenant wants to paint, decorate, etc etc etc Next thing you know, they want to move closer to .... and think we should bear the financial responsibility.
I no longer try to please a tenant, in the hopes they will stay longer. It never works. They have their own agenda and reasons for leaving, that have nothing to do with us.

 

[sydsider]

It's been a few days since my last post. Problem still remains unfortunately. Tenant seems to be holding his breath for now although he did send PM another email this morning saying they were once again woken up by the delivery noise, this time at 2:15 and asking what's the outcome of the 'investigation' by the council.

I think most of us would agree it's usually not a very speedy process when dealing with council. I lodged my complaint last Friday and was told I would hear back from them either that day or by Monday the latest (I was doubtful but still hopeful). Well, that didn't happen. I've learnt to be persistent with any sort of officials esp ones from the government and after numerous phone calls I finally got through to the person in charge but only to be told she needs to deal DIRECTLY with the person affected by the noise i.e. my tenant (no other council staff has told me this!!), and the only way to find out how things are progressing is also only through my tenant. Pray to god tenant does contact the council since I the landlord doesn't seem to enjoy such privilege!

Wrote PM an email informing her of the situation and forwarded her the officer's direct line and hopefully the tenant will follow through.

I think I will look into CIP as my next move. Dealing with resi tenants just seem to be such a huge effort sometimes. I know some of the LLs on the forum seem to have a pretty cruisey run but I just haven't had the luck.

 

[skater]

Pray to god tenant does contact the council since I the landlord doesn't seem to enjoy such privilege!

Wrote PM an email informing her of the situation and forwarded her the officer's direct line and hopefully the tenant will follow through.

I think I will look into CIP as my next move. Dealing with resi tenants just seem to be such a huge effort sometimes. I know some of the LLs on the forum seem to have a pretty cruisey run but I just haven't had the luck.

You have one IP and one tenant who is being a tad problematic and you think this is a huge effort? Sheesh! What will you do when the rent stops or you get huge repair bills or one of the many other things that can (and do) go wrong sometimes.

Toughen up and don't let the tenant (or the PM) walk all over you.

You think CIP will be better? You still get problems with Commercial. Dazz makes it sound like sunshine and roses, but you know what? The main reason he is so successful is because he is not a walkover.

Maybe shares will be your "thing".