Tenants with Assistance Dogs

[MonSqueek]

Dave,

If you had a tenant in one of your IP's who became blind and was partnered with a Guide Dog then you could not kick them out even though the lease in place may say "no pets" or even if it read "no animals". Their right to the animal is protected by Section 9 of the Disability Discrimination Act 1992 - The protection provided by the Disability Discrimination Act applies in all Australian states and Territories overriding any No-Pets and Animal Policies or Laws.

That act protects anyone with any disability partnered with an assistance dog - be it a hearing dog, seziure alert dog, mobility dog, guide dog ect ect ect...

I hope that answers your question. If you know about the dog before hand you can not offer the property without giving a reason and there is no way that any one can prove its discrimination but if you do offer the property then try to evict a tenant (because of the dog) you could possibly be sued if they felt so inclined and any breach of lease you take to the tribunal in regard to having an animal on the property would be won by the tenant.

However once the lease is up your under no obligation to renew it ... who knows you could just get the urge to repaint or renovate *wink* That is why I really dont WANT to back a landlord into a corner using this legistlation that is not really going to foster a positive landlord/tenant relationship. I will have a home for 12mths but I would rather not have to move every year.

 

[ianvestor]

Whats the "stick" that's wielded if I refuse and by who's authority will it be wielded?

All laws, no matter how trivial, are ultimately enforceable at gun point.

 

[s_t]

get a 2yr lease? Is that a long enough stay?

 

[jaycee]

So somewhere theres a rule that will "FORCE" me to accept animals if I dont want them

My house, my rules and if my rules cost me tenants, my problem I would have thought

Whats the "stick" that's wielded if I refuse and by who's authority will it be wielded?

Dont get me wrong MonSqueek , I dont have an issue that you have dogs and a special need for them, but I do have an issue that supposedly there is someone who can FORCE me to accept them in my IP's against my will or wishes.

Dave

Geez, the person is just looking for somehwere to live. Not cause proble4ms for your investment plans ! Althey were trying to do is find a solution to thier problem - find a place to rent.

How ignorant are you of rules in society anyway ?

Gettng back onto that topic, rather than the rules behind evrything under the sun..best of luck, I hope you find something soon.

Sounds like playing the nubmers game might work, keep going till you find one which says yes, which I know is easier said than done I know.

 

[MonSqueek]

Well in light of the advice given I have just sent off this email to a few of the agencies in the areas Im looking. Lets hope it helps make me more of a person then just another applicant. At the worst it will make them remeber me for that crazy woman who emailed. Or.... It could just be deleted unread. *sigh*



Dear property manager,

I hope you have had a lovely weekend. I would like to introduce myself to you and your real-estate agency. I am seeking an animal friendly rental property and have been for some time. I have been using the usual technique of looking on realestate.com, inspecting properties and submitting applications for the last two months. Having had no luck with this approach I have decided to take a moment to contact you directly in the hope you may have a suitable property becoming available in the next month or so. In the current competitive rental market landlords have their pick of tenants and I understand that a lot of landlords are hesitant to allow animals in their investment property. This seems to be the reason I have had no luck securing a property.

Neither of my dogs are considered "pets" under the law. Luigi is my assistance dog - he has the same public access rights as a guide dog - Section 9 of the Disability Discrimination Act 1992 guarantees that persons living with a disability and partnered with an assistance dog has total access rights in nearly all situations this means any place which is open to the public such as public transport hospitals motels & hotels restaurants etc. The assistance dog is permitted as a medical aid the protection provided by the Disability Discrimination Act applies in all Australian states and Territories overriding any No-Pets and Animal Policies or Laws. Luigi alerts and responds to my medical condition.

Zoey is an emotional support animal. An Emotional Support Animal is a companion animal dog or other for people living with psychological or physical health challenges it may or may not have been task-trained the purpose of this type of companion is for use in the home and does not have public access rights it can not go in no-pets-allowed places with its person it can however live in no-pets-allowed housing with a letter from the person's doctor which I can provide for you.

This is a link to a generic application form using 1form.com *link to pdf file containing the usual application questions and answers* just to give you an idea of who I am and my rental history for you to have a look over. I am a house proud tenant I like to keep the property clean and well maintained. I am looking for a medium to long term tenancy. Somewhere to call home.

I am looking for a property around or under the $200 a week mark, with some sort of private fenced outdoor area (a small courtyard would be fine) and off street parking anywhere within about 40mins of Dandenong.

I have copies of my tenant ledger at my current property that demonstrates that I always pay my rent like clock work 2 weeks before it is due. I can provide refrences and all the usual documents required for an application. I have also attached some information about the dogs to this email.

Hopefully this information is helpful for you to put a great tenant in an animal friendly property. Please, if there is anything else I can provide for you or if you feel it would be useful to arrange a face to face meeting so you can meet myself and the animals in question I would be happy to oblige.

Kind regards,

*My Real Name*

 

[natmarie73]

Assistance dogs are not pets - they are a medical aid and it is against the law to not allow a tenant because they have an assistance dog or guide dog.

MonSqueek, if you are being denied an extension on your lease, or being denied rental accommodation on the basis that you require an assistance dog then you need to go to the anti-discrimination tribunal in your state - not the rental tenancies board. The ADA has a hell of a lot more clout and can enforce their orders a lot better than the rental tenancies tribunal.

If a property manager or landlord is denying you accomodation solely on the basis of your disability by not allowing a guide or assistance dog, then they are breaking the law, and they will be prosecuted with potentially some very large fines being involved as well as a court order to provide you with the service you have applied for. You do not even need anything in writing saying it is because of the dog to apply to the tribunal - a suspicion is enough to commence an action and it does not cost a lot of money to make an application.

I think it would be better to be honest upfront though and not lie on your application as lying would not be beneficial to any action you take if you do go to the tribunal at a later date.

Originally Posted by BoatBoy
So somewhere theres a rule that will "FORCE" me to accept animals if I dont want them

My house, my rules and if my rules cost me tenants, my problem I would have thought

Whats the "stick" that's wielded if I refuse and by who's authority will it be wielded?

Dont get me wrong MonSqueek , I dont have an issue that you have dogs and a special need for them, but I do have an issue that supposedly there is someone who can FORCE me to accept them in my IP's against my will or wishes.

Dave

Dave, the rule you are thinking of is called the anti-discrimination law, and it has the same force as any other law. The judge can and will enforce any order they make according to the rule of law - even send you to jail if you do not comply.

You may think its your house and your rules, but if your rules break the law then the law will presumpt your rules every time.

Of course, this only applies to assistance or guide dogs, not to pets and the tenant would need to prove the dog is a trained assistance animal and required for medical reasons.

 

[jaycee]

Hi,

I wonder if possible, could you follow the letters up with a visit to the agencies after a couple of days of them receiving it as well ?

Might give them the opportunity of putting a face to the name etc

 

[MonSqueek]

Hi,

I wonder if possible, could you follow the letters up with a visit to the agencies after a couple of days of them receiving it as well ?

Might give them the opportunity of putting a face to the name etc

*nods* I will do so hopefully on Monday as I have Monday off work.

 

[natmarie73]

(or more accurately, they can't say that is why they are rejecting your application!).

Even if they say they are not rejecting the application because of the aid dogs etc it does not mean that the tenant can't take them to the AD tribunal. As long as the tenant suspects they are being discriminated against they can go to the tribunal and then the judge would listen to the evidence provided by both parties and come to a conclusion.

The PM or landlord would need to have a very good reason not to rent to a prospective disabled tenant with good references, who has paid their rent on time, can afford the rent and has evidence that the dogs are not destructive etc.

Monsqueek, its a shame you aren't looking for a house in Ipswich Qld, I would have no problem renting to a tenant with dogs as pets, or as assistance animals and I'm sure there are plenty of us out there who feel the same.

 

[MonSqueek]

Moving to QLD is tempting. My family live in Yamanto If I could find decent work up there I would seriously seriously contenplate it!

At this stage I really dont want the drama of going down the antidiscrimination path. Im hoping to find somewhere without such antics. If all else fails though... desperate times call will call for desperate measures. I have another month or two up my sleve but the possibility of ending up homeless is really quite terrifing. The sooner I find somewhere the better off I will be. Its quite unsettling not to know if one is going to have a roof over their head in a few weeks....

 

[BoatBoy]

Geez, the person is just looking for somehwere to live. Not cause proble4ms for your investment plans ! Althey were trying to do is find a solution to thier problem - find a place to rent. .

I dont have an issue with that, find a place that accepts animals, most LL's do.

How ignorant are you of rules in society anyway ?

Obviously very, I dont have the book on rules in society.

Maybe I should complain as no one would rent to me to build the boat that I have to have in their backyard (not mine).
I would have rented for several years and paid above the going rate and have good references also.

I was forced to buy a place to do it in.

jaycee,

If there are multiple tenants for a property who have no animals and one who does and I have a no pets policy, who do you pick?

Why should you or anyone try to make me feel guilty for not accepting them over others who meet my criteria?

Why should some authority force me to change my rules to suit theirs when there is no need, there are LL's that accept pets?

The point I make is that there are rules for everyone and some people are fine having animals in houses, so I suppose you rent from them if you have animals.

People who dont want animals in their house should not be forced to have them against their wishes.

Unfortunatly I get the feeling that landlords feel that a dog is a dog is a dog regardless.
.

Sorry, thats me, had a tenant take the piss once and now no one gets them (or any animal) in.

I am discriminatory towards animals in the house.

Maybe when the houses are a bit more "used" and tenants are harder to find, my rules will change.

Originally Posted by Simon

Sure the latter might mean a longer search for a sympathetic landlord but it will be worth it in the long run.

That it will, FORCING a LL to submit is not a good way to start the relationship

Dave

 

[jaycee]

Who made you feel guilty ?

Who said they wantd to force people to accept their pets ?

The lady quite clearly said she doesn't want to force anything on anyoe, she just mentioned what the rule book was for our refrence & understandig of the situation

She was jsut sayign that she was finding it difficult & wondered if anyone might have any suggestions which could help her.

Obviously you do not (I am not trying to make you feel guilty for that)

 

[steveadl]

NatMarie - no they can't deny her a lease because of the dogs, and if there was a suspicion that this is the case action could be taken. But really, is it worth it? MonSqueek wants a house, not to make a political point etc. and in the big scheme of things it won't get her far, especially if a LL is forced to begrudgingly let to her - and it would be if they were dragged through this process.

MonSqueek - reading your letter I'll give you my honest opinion as a LL, not trying to upset you, as I genuinly feel for you and would like to see you get a place to call home.

I think the letter is a fantastic idea, but speaking strictly as a potential LL - when I read it, my focus was immediately drawn to the section where you explain that by law they are not classified as pets and you reference to the Anti Discrimination Act etc. I would look at this and already be put off that you're already quoting law and act's etc. and probably put you in the "too hard" basket and move on to the next applicant.

Perhaps you could send the same letter to a couple of other different PM's in the area, but this time just leave it at your opening introduction paragraph and explain how you have been having a bit of trouble because of your 2 dogs (who are well behaved, don't shed much, are outside a lot etc).

As I said, I'm trying to help and can see potential problems with the letter as is.

 

[MonSqueek]

I think the letter is a fantastic idea, but speaking strictly as a potential LL - when I read it, my focus was immediately drawn to the section where you explain that by law they are not classified as pets and you reference to the Anti Discrimination Act etc. I would look at this and already be put off that you're already quoting law and act's etc. and probably put you in the "too hard" basket and move on to the next applicant.

Perhaps you could send the same letter to a couple of other different PM's in the area, but this time just leave it at your opening introduction paragraph and explain how you have been having a bit of trouble because of your 2 dogs (who are well behaved, don't shed much, are outside a lot etc).

As I said, I'm trying to help and can see potential problems with the letter as is.

Oh.... I never thought of it like that. I just put that bit in there to try and highlight that these are not just any dogs... but rather dogs with a function and purpose and that that function was not just imagined by me (we all know how bias people can be towards their own pets/kids/whatever) but a purpose reconised and protected by law. Its really a double edged sword. Thats why I really wanted to just take the "yes I have dogs" route without being specific as to why I have them or what function they have, it would be so much easier.

I really am not a "too hard basket" type tenant. Minor maintnace I can organise myself, I pay the rent like clockwork, I keep the place clean, respect that it is someone elses investment of probably hundreds of thousands of dollars. I dont hastle the PM over crap. The only thing I can be a little difficult with is that I need inspections to be scheduled at a time I can be present because with dogs on the premisis its minimising any risk that the PM could accidently let them get loose or something but because of my work hours that is easy enough to arrange. Its hard to convey all this on the 2 sided application forms. They dont really give you any way to express personality or values on there. As Dave said if on paper there are 5 applicants of aprox the same standard and 4 do not have animals... who is the LL most likley to choose?

I wish someone could present to me an option/angle I hadnt all ready tried or thought of that could help me find the elusive landlords that accept animals, have a property in the location and price range I can afford.

 

[Tulip]

Hi,

A couple of further points:

1) I suspect certain applications do not get past my property manager. We have previously said we would consider pets, especially in an older style house, but have not had any such applications forwarded to us in the past. So consider private ads, perhaps the ones in your community paper that may not make it onto realestate.com.au etc.

2) As a dog owner myself, highlight that by default, the dogs are extremely well trained, do not run inside or jump up on things (so highlighting no damage ,assuming that is correct, are they older = quieter?), they just hang on their mat. I would also suggest you mention you are prepared to pay a pet bond or higher weekly rent. You just need to get past first base with the PMs.

3) In your shoes, I would consider placing as ad in the local paper. Rental needed, very flexible but have well trained dogs. etc. Do you have a very cute picture of them or can you get one? Could be useful.

I would also hold back on quoting the Acts in applications, agree it can be seen as high maintenance irrespective of the actual reason why.

Good luck with it.

 

[GoAnna!]

MonSqueek,

Firstly I would have no issue renting to you as you presented yourself on this thread. I usually accept pets and would have to have a really good reason not to do so. I also understand that you dogs are not pets and that you have the right to have them with you.

BUT if I had just recived the letter I suspect you would either have been rejected by my property and if not I would have. Why? I think the letter is too long, it assumes ignorance of the reader and it sounds high maintenance.

It is also really really easy to ignore a letter.

I would go and visit the PMs with the dogs so they can see for themselves how well behaved they are. I would just give a basic explanation of the dogs " Of course my dogs will be living with me as I need them to assist me with..bla bla .It's kind of like having a guide dog" I would not mention your rights unless asked. I would bring written references with you and encourage them to ring your current agent.

Is your disability obvious? If it is then I think it would make it easier for them to understand the whole situation.

I think when they see that you are just a regular tenant with assistant dog.

That you have good references.

That you work.

That you do keep the place clean.

That you are looking for a long term tenancy.

That you might be willing to pay an additional $10 per week to secure a property. (if that's how you feel)

Then maybe ask them what they have coming up that might suit.

I think you need to make it really personal and that makes it harder for them to put you to the bottom of the application pile.

I would then call them each week to ask again what is available or coming up.

Best of luck!

 

[steveadl]

Oh.... I never thought of it like that. I just put that bit in there to try and highlight that these are not just any dogs... but rather dogs with a function and purpose and that that function was not just imagined by me (we all know how bias people can be towards their own pets/kids/whatever) but a purpose reconised and protected by law. Its really a double edged sword. Thats why I really wanted to just take the "yes I have dogs" route without being specific as to why I have them or what function they have, it would be so much easier.

I really am not a "too hard basket" type tenant. Minor maintnace I can organise myself, I pay the rent like clockwork, I keep the place clean, respect that it is someone elses investment of probably hundreds of thousands of dollars. I dont hastle the PM over crap. The only thing I can be a little difficult with is that I need inspections to be scheduled at a time I can be present because with dogs on the premisis its minimising any risk that the PM could accidently let them get loose or something but because of my work hours that is easy enough to arrange. Its hard to convey all this on the 2 sided application forms. They dont really give you any way to express personality or values on there. As Dave said if on paper there are 5 applicants of aprox the same standard and 4 do not have animals... who is the LL most likley to choose?

I wish someone could present to me an option/angle I hadnt all ready tried or thought of that could help me find the elusive landlords that accept animals, have a property in the location and price range I can afford.

Sounds to me like you'd be a great tenant Mon, you just need to get past the initial rejection out of hand because of dogs.

I totally agree with GoAnna and think you should go see some PM's face to face. If you come across in person like you do over this forum, I think it shouldn't be too long before someone offers you a place. Go see them and say exactly what you have above.

 

[Perp]

I agree with the others that it would be better to approach them as though asking for a "favour" (even though it's your entitlement) than to be quoting Acts in your letter; it creates the wrong impression. Most people do want to be helpful, and if a property manager can feel like they've done a good deed for you by finding you a home, I believe they'll respond well if you approach them with the attitude that you'll be very grateful for their help with a challenging problem.

I'd turn up at the agency with the animals, ask to meet the property manager, introduce yourself and your animals, and hand-deliver a letter with the supporting information you mentioned. The tone of it should be "I have a very challenging situation and would be very grateful for your help". Perhaps include photos of your present home, showing how nicely you keep it, and if possible, a reference from your current landlord (hopefully saying wonderful things about you!).

Good luck!

 

[karina]

I would steer away from quoting the act etc and just say you have an assistance dog etc, well behaved ,I think a copy of your rental payments and letter from the landlord will help as well.

It saddens me that it is this difficult for you to find accomodation. As the others have suggested it may not be a bad idea to go in and meet the property managers face to face. I would consider an add in the local paper. "Great tenant needs pet friendly accomodation" Perhaps offer a pet bond in any applications you submit.

Have you considered buying a property? I don't know what your financial situation is like but if you could pick up something around the 140-150k mark that would cost you around $260 a week in mortgage repayments interest only. (I have factored in 9% interest)

If you rented out a room or had a friend that was prepared to move in with you, you could possibly get $100 -$120 or so coming in from your boarder. You would need to allow for council rates of about $1200 a year and maybe another $500 a year for insurance. Strata fees on top if you go for a townhouse/unit option although I think you would be better off with a house due to body corporate laws. Just a thought it may not be an option for you at the moment but perhaps down the track it may be a good way for you to secure a property long term and not worry about being kicked out of your rental property.

Maybe try putting a post on steve mcnights website www.propertyinvesting.com as many investors read that forum as well and you may just come across someone that it is looking to rent out a property in melbourne.

Good luck and let us know how you go.

 

[natmarie73]

NatMarie - no they can't deny her a lease because of the dogs, and if there was a suspicion that this is the case action could be taken. But really, is it worth it? MonSqueek wants a house, not to make a political point etc. and in the big scheme of things it won't get her far, especially if a LL is forced to begrudgingly let to her - and it would be if they were dragged through this process.

I don't know if it would be worth it - I've never been in a situation where I have been discriminated against to such an extent I would be left homeless. I don't think it is about making a political point at all - it is about standing up for your basic legal right to accommodation despite being disabled.

If I had been knocked back for accommodation time after time because I needed an assistance dog or guide dog (or for any other reason ie race, religion etc) then I would get pretty pissed off eventually and yes, to me it would be worth it if there was no other alternative. Of course, I would not start out swinging a big stick, but try all other ways of assuring the PM that I am a model tenant first. If I kept getting grief from the PM after that then I would ensure my legal rights were upheld.

Personally, if I was in this situation I would try to buy a house I could afford so that I could have a place to live where I wasn't judged or discriminated against by ignorant PMs or landlords but I realise it isn't always possible.

I agree with the previous posts about not quoting the Act in the letter though as it would probably scare PMs into thinking negative things. Rocking up to the agency in person with the dogs is a good idea too.