Network Monitoring

[JamesGG]

Maybe you can understand that your parents like me, are motivated to equip our children to enjoy the challenges and opportunities of life, rather than endure them in pain, loneliness, costly errors, and fatigue. Believe it or not, our life experience is relevant, even if uncool.

I don't think that she has said anything to the contrary, has she?

Now I know that I am clearly biased, but, I do believe that Sam deserves at least a little more respect than that. And, I can't help but feel that you are projecting your own outdated views and your recent experiences with your son, unfairly upon her.

Sam is a fiercely independent woman and I am proud of how she has adapted to the move interstate and the challenges that she has been presented with in that time. Despite the move, the relationship with her parents is still strong; if not moreso because of it. By no means does she fall under the (usually exaggerated) stereotypical description that many like to use for those of her age.

And, yes, I'm well aware that she does not need me to speak for her. But, I would be appreciative if you could judge her on more than just her age and her gender.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

And, I can't help but feel that you are projecting your own outdated views and your recent experiences with your son, unfairly upon her.

James, how lucky am I to have a childless Gen Y straightening me out on child rearing......and not any child rearing, but the brand new hip and happenin version.

 

[JamesGG]

James, how lucky am I to have a childless Gen Y straightening me out on child rearing......and not any child rearing, but the brand new hip and happenin version.

Forgive me, Winston, but I think that my post may have been a little unclear. My thoughts this morning, above, were directed only at your comments towards Sam, and not on your chosen method of raising your own children.

 

[mary&mat]

WW: "My values are similar to my parents and their parents. And that involves boys getting the best education they possibly can, so as to prepare them to be a primary bred winner for a wife and children. "

Oh WW, you had me right up until this statement...

what if he's gay?
what if he never marries?
what if there's an accident & he can't perform this function of 'primary breadwinner'?
what if he's gay & has kids with his partner & decided to stay home & be the house husband?

I believe it's equally important whether you're a male or female to get the best education you can....we should all be taught to stand on our own 2 feet & develop independence...not just the males

 

[WinstonWolfe]

I believe it's equally important whether you're a male or female to get the best education you can....we should all be taught to stand on our own 2 feet & develop independence...not just the males

I don't have daughters. Besides, I wouldn't encourage my son to rely on paid maternity leave to cover the mortgage while his partner is having one of several babies.

If you want to play the 'what if' logic, what if he gets hit by a bus and dies tomorrow. Does that mean he as an individual should have lower financial aspirations?

 

[Corey Batt]

Winston you constantly dodge peoples posts by only quoting small parts of it, while disregarding the rest.

Lil Skater and Mary&mat have made good points and you have completely disregarded them. Why don't you answer them?

Shouldn't Lil Skater be able to show the independence and individualism to be what she wants, rather than a wife and mother just because its your view of the primary function? (Not saying that being a wife and mother should be seen as a 'less-than' role)

Mary&mat brings up another point:

What if his personal choices affect your perception that he should be a primary bread winner in a heterosexual partnership? Why don't you answer these valid questions?

 

[WinstonWolfe]

CJ, rather than contribute flames full of non sequiturs suggestive of a fragmented mind, how about organizing your extensive experience and views on parenting into cohesive practically applicable doctrine that covers all likely scenarios. Then get back and express it in less than 100 words.

Winston you constantly dodge peoples posts by only quoting small parts of it, while disregarding the rest.

 

[mary&mat]

I agree with your sentiments about paid maternity leave. If people want babies, they should make sure they can afford them & not make everyone else pay...but that's another topic.

I think I was a bit touchy about what you said b/c I lived with a family for a few years when I was younger & they had the belief that the male child would be sent to a private school (for many of the same reasons you have alluded to), while the local high school was 'good enough for the girls'. I was lucky enough to have gained entry into a selective high school & they wanted me to leave there & go to the local high school as well.

What that said to me was that boys were more important than girls & had more to offer. I believe this is a potentially damaging mindset to pass on to future generations.

If your son is fortunate enough to have children and to have a girl/s, wouldn't you want the best education for that young mind regardless of whether they were a male or female?

In answer to the 'what if', no. I believe we should all try & do the best we can with what we have every day. If someone chooses to lower their financial aspirations, let them do so from an educated point of view. Perhaps they will lower them for any number of valid reasons. To me, money gives me choices and freedoms in life, but not everyone will prioritise it that way & that's ok.

Even if we don't agree, I still value your viewpoints and try my best to understand where you're coming from....& I do enjoy a lively debate too!

 

[skater]

I wasn't trying to suggest that you spoil, or torture, or snoop on your teenagers..

That's OK. It's all good.

It is very possible to reason with a 2yo btw... not always easy but sometimes it is.

You obviously have not been blessed with a little monster like Lil was at that age. As I said before, they are all different. The first was just so easy during the first few years that I was soooo totally unprepared for "Hurricane Lil". She was so much hard work, but so rewarding too. I used to live for the big hugs and the "I'm sorry, Mummy" that I would get at the end of a harrowing temper tantrum.

 

[Corey Batt]

My post did not mention anything about parenting.

I was asking about your views on women showing independence and individualism and how your views on your son's growth into adulthood facilitate in the possibility that he should decide that he does not want to be the primary bread winner in a heterosexual partnership.

Substantiate your views, not fling petty insults.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

Mary, are you at work at the moment? Where's Mat?

I have made no comment that suggests I believe men should under all circumstances have privileged education rights and women should not be encouraged to have careers.

Anyone drawing these conclusions needs to look at their own biases and readiness to stereotype inappropriately.

 

[WinstonWolfe]

My post did not mention anything about parenting.

I was asking about your views on women showing independence and individualism and how your views on your son's growth into adulthood facilitate in the possibility that he should decide that he does not want to be the primary bread winner in a heterosexual partnership.

Substantiate your views, not fling petty insults.

CJ, your comments are illogical.....I suggest you stick with whatever views you feel are substantiated in your reality, but are unprepared to declare here.

By your logic, no child should have gender roles enforced on them because a parent never knows whether they are harboring trans gender tendencies, and it would be a transgression of their free will to lock them into the role of one gender.

 

[mary&mat]

Mary, are you at work at the moment? Where's Mat?

I have made no comment that suggests I believe men should under all circumstances have privileged education rights and women should not be encouraged to have careers.

Anyone drawing these conclusions needs to look at their own biases and readiness to stereotype inappropriately.

My dear WW, I actually said my views were clouded by my own personal experience sorry if I didn't make it clear enough (just re-read post) "I think I was a bit touchy" were my actual words.

I agree you did not make an outright comment on mens' v womens' educational rights....it was the way you chose to express that your son's education was important b/c you assumed he would be the breadwinner was where I drew this inference from.

I am on mat leave (reluctantly, as I did not ever want to perform my 'primary function' of popping out babies willy-nilly). It was a lovely accident

Mat is at work doing one job & getting paid for it. I am at home doing multiple jobs for little to no pay & my hours change without warning and often I am still working into the night as mother, cleaner, financial planner, taxation agent, caterer, gardener, bill payer, counsellor, oh & occaisonally lover, but that's one's definately not paid!!!!....and funnily enough I have always been the major breadwinner in every relationship & purchased my properties all by my self. I cannot wait to get back to work & start contributing financially again...and also have a decent break from parenting

Please don't think I'm attacking you, I think it's a healthy exchange of ideas & I look forward to your comments

 

[INVSTOR]

I don't know if I'm reading this thread wrong but I saw WW's actions as trying to protect his son and family from destruction such as:

Ben Cousins and Chris Mainwaring http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/ch...he-night-he-died/story-e6frf7jo-1225843097363
Heath Ledger http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heath_Ledger
Gemma Thoms http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Day_Out

etc

 

[INVSTOR]

It's kinda gone off topic though

 

[Luv2Travel]

I don't know if I'm reading this thread wrong but I saw WW's actions as trying to protect his son and family from destruction

That's how I read it too.

 

[Simon]

WW has his ideals and aspirations for his kids. I am guessing that he now feels under seige from all sides and is feeling unreasonably defensive.

Maybe we should all respect each others views a bit more and get off our back feet - I am as guilty of this as anyone else, maybe more than most.

Anyone who has strong ideas about raising their kids is better than 80% of the population who treat life as something that just happens while you aren't looking! Thats my 80/20 generalisation again

 

[mary&mat]

WW has his ideals and aspirations for his kids. I am guessing that he now feels under seige from all sides and is feeling unreasonably defensive.

Maybe we should all respect each others views a bit more and get off our back feet - I am as guilty of this as anyone else, maybe more than most.

Anyone who has strong ideas about raising their kids is better than 80% of the population who treat life as something that just happens while you aren't looking! Thats my 80/20 generalisation again

Agreed. Sorry WW, I'm sure you're doing the best and want the best for your boy

 

[mary&mat]

WW has his ideals and aspirations for his kids. I am guessing that he now feels under seige from all sides and is feeling unreasonably defensive.

Maybe we should all respect each others views a bit more and get off our back feet - I am as guilty of this as anyone else, maybe more than most.

Anyone who has strong ideas about raising their kids is better than 80% of the population who treat life as something that just happens while you aren't looking! Thats my 80/20 generalisation again

Fence-sitter! hee hee Pick a side! Pick a side! 'Two men enter, one man leaves!' Cage fight Cage fight....where's Bon?

(Just joking)

 

[willair]

I would have pulled my child out of a school that was rife in drug use in the first year.

Why didn't you?
.

Weg ,very simple it took "US" 4 years on the waiting lists,you pay the entrance fees upfront and get in line with everybody else,and while waiting on the list if some one puts their mame down being an old girl
from the school they get in first,no inbetweens that's the way the system works,BTW,i wanted to rip my daughter out of that school when she told me of some of the things that were going on and told me that was not for here,she understands what it takes to put someone in Dollar terms in PS,BECAUSE WHAT EVER THE UPFRONT PER TERM COSTS ARE,DOUBLE THAT NUMBER BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT WILL COST and i trust them 100%,because as i have told them many times i can only take you so far before you have to pick up LifesBatton and start running your own race she in the final year of UNI at A Small Uni at Banyo,still does not own a car,still with the same school mates,one of her mates smoke the green tabbey when they come over,her Father knows we all do but it's not my problem it's hers..willair..